[PABound09]

Hi and thanks in advance for any advice!

Up until July 08 my husband, kids and myself lived in PA when we decided to move to LA because his family lives there and he had been laid off and a family member offered him a job. The job turned out to pay less and we couldn't afford our bills so we had to go on a variety of government assistance. Since then he has gotten a better job but our marital issues have gotten worse. We've always had problems and I see now that moving was a bad thing. He spends all of his free time with his parents and sister. I feel that he he is never around and never helps but anytime he can he critizes everything I do.

To make his family dependence matters worse, we live in a 2 bedroom apartment over his parent's garage and his sister lives next door. We're constantly having to be together, there is no family time with the four of us and he really doesn't understand why I want we should have our own time as a family. Not to mention, the apartment is small for our family and animals and I believe there are water damage issues that may be causing my son to have reoccuring chest problems.

I just want to take my kids and move home to PA to our house that is still sitting on the market. We're paying for it, why wouldn't we live there? I just need to get a way to make up my mind whether I want to live in LA, PA or get a divorce. I'm so unhappy but most important are my children. Losing them is NOT an option. I would rather be with him and keep going the way we are then not be with my kids.

Any advice would help!

[cdad]

Are there plans once the family home is sold ? If you try to go back to the home you once lived in and get a divorce you will be creating a huge mess. You need to be prepared for it. That home your moving to may have to go back on the market as part of the divorce. Then there is the custody battles you will be going through etc. You might want to wait out your options unless you or your children are in eminent danger until the previous home is sold and then consider your options from that point. Does he speak of moving when that home is sold ?

[PABound09]

I would either take the house off the market or if it sold (depending on how I felt) either move back with him or get another place. I've looked at the finances and I can afford to take over the house payments. It'd be hard but I could do it. He doesn't want to go to PA again. In fact he has talked of being in the apartment above his parents garage for up to 3 years.

[cdad]

You have a tough road ahead. And remember this when you think you can aford the house on your own.. its 1/2 his. Be very careful with that. Also you need to watch timelines for residency when filing with the courts no matter where you are. General rule of thumb is 6 months in State before you can file.

[cadillac59]

I'm not exactly sure what your question is. Are you asking whether you can move back to PA with the kids? If so, there is nothing that says you can't, not at the moment. If your husband files for divorce or custody (or if you do) you'll automatically be enjoined from moving; however, if he files after you're back in PA the odds are you'll be able to stay there with the kids until the case is decided.

Jurisdiction over the custody of your kids is now in California (exclusively). If you moved to PA and he filed for custody in a California court within 6 months of the move, the case over the custody and support of the kids would always be in California. If you moved to PA with the kids and for some reason he never filed a case in California and 6 months passed since you arrived in PA, you could then file for custody in PA. Whatever you do, keep the jurisdictional issue in mind and don't listen to anyone who tells you you can move to PA now and promptly upon arrival file for custody in PA just because the kids are there. No way. That's not how it works.

[cdad]

I'm not exactly sure what your question is. Are you asking whether you can move back to PA with the kids? If so, there is nothing that says you can't, not at the moment. If your husband files for divorce or custody (or if you do) you'll automatically be enjoined from moving; however, if he files after you're back in PA the odds are you'll be able to stay there with the kids until the case is decided.

Jurisdiction over the custody of your kids is now in California (exclusively). If you moved to PA and he filed for custody in a California court within 6 months of the move, the case over the custody and support of the kids would always be in California. If you moved to PA with the kids and for some reason he never filed a case in California and 6 months passed since you arrived in PA, you could then file for custody in PA. Whatever you do, keep the jurisdictional issue in mind and don't listen to anyone who tells you you can move to PA now and promptly upon arrival file for custody in PA just because the kids are there. No way. That's not how it works.

Im a bit confused because when OP said LA I was thinking Louisiana.?

Where is OP at ; at this time ?

[cadillac59]

If LA means Louisiana not Los Angeles, then substitute Louisiana wherever I said California. The same statute on custody and support jurisdiction applies.

[JudyKayTee]

If LA means Louisiana not Los Angeles, then substitute Louisiana wherever I said California. The same statute on custody and support jurisdiction applies.

The residency to apply for divorce in Louisiana is 12 months. OP doesn't have residency in LA if I am reading this correctly. She DOES have residency in PA. If she goes back to PA, takes the kids, she could sue for divorce and custody there - again, because LA doesn't have jurisdiction.

LA Court has no jurisdiction over husband OR wife at this point in time.

Don't know if it's Law or an exception and it involved Florida but my friend moved to Florida with husband and children, never changed her driver's license. She and children moved back to NY (again, house had not been sold) and she filed for divorce and custody. Husband fought it, saying FL had jurisdiction. Although she had been in FL for just shy of a year Court ruled NY had jurisdiction because she never gave up her NY residency, owned property "here," had a valid NY driver's license.

That's my vote. Please correct me if I'm missing something here.

[cadillac59]

The residency to apply for divorce in Louisiana is 12 months. OP doesn't have residency in LA if I am reading this correctly. She DOES have residency in PA. If she goes back to PA, takes the kids, she could sue for divorce and custody there - again, because LA doesn't have jurisdiction.

LA Court has no jurisdiction over husband OR wife at this point in time.

Don't know if it's Law or an exception and it involved Florida but my friend moved to Florida with husband and children, never changed her driver's license. She and children moved back to NY (again, house had not been sold) and she filed for divorce and custody. Husband fought it, saying FL had jurisdiction. Although she had been in FL for just shy of a year Court ruled NY had jurisdiction because she never gave up her NY residency, owned property "here," had a valid NY driver's license.

That's my vote. Please correct me if I'm missing something here.

There's actually three things going on here. The one has to do with state residency requirements to file for divorce. That varies from state-to-state (CA has a 6 month residency requirement for example but there's a way to initiate the dissolution process before one meets the residency requirements and not lose time in having a disso granted, but that's another matter; NV has a 6 week residency requirement). So, yes you are correct in that respect with regard to filing for divorce in Louisiana. But there's more.

The second issue has to do with child custody jurisdiction, which is a completely different matter altogether and is governed by the Uniform Child Custody Jurisidiction and Enforcement Act (UCCJEA). All states but three have the UCCJEA, but even those three states have just an older version of the same act and I believe are slated to adopt the newer act fairly soon. PA and Louisiana both have the UCCJEA. In the scenario described by the OP, child custody jurisdiction would play out as I said. Louisiana has child custody jurisdiction (unless the OP were to move back to PA with the kids and 6 months passed before wife filed her case during which time husband failed to file for custody in Louisiana). Because two different sets of laws govern jurisdiction to file for divorce and jurisdiction over child custody, it is very possible (and not uncommon) for one state to be the proper place to file for a divorce but another to be the proper place to file for custody of the kids of the marriage. I know that sounds weird but you have to keep in mind that the UCCJEA was designed to apply not only to divorces but to non-marital relationships involving kids. So, you might be right- the OP may have to file for divorce in PA, but that doesn't mean PA has jurisdiction over custody (as I said, LA would).

The third issue has to do with child support jurisdiction. This is governed by the Uniform Interstate Family Support Act, which all states have enacted. The rules on jurisdiction operate very much like those of the UCCJEA (but they are not identical) and the outcome in this scenario would be that either PA or Louisiana could have support jurisdiction over an initial order depending upon a kind of complex analysis of who filed first, where, where the child's home state was and so on. (It's a little involved for a brief discussion here).

[JudyKayTee]

I know that sounds weird but you have to keep in mind that the UCCJEA was designed to apply not only to divorces but to non-marital relationships involving kids. So, you might be right- the OP may have to file for divorce in PA, but that doesn't mean PA has jurisdiction over custody (as I said, LA would).

The third issue has to do with child support jurisdiction. This is governed by the Uniform Interstate Family Support Act, which all states have enacted. The rules on jurisdiction operate very much like those of the UCCJEA (but they are not identical) and the outcome in this scenario would be that Louisiana would have support jurisdiction under an analysis similar to that applied for custody.

I understand. My resarch leads me to believe that it's PA which has jurisdiction over both - but, again, I don't know the status of the driver's license, that type of info, and whether OP has actually been in LA six "legal" months.

I'm not questioning who has jurisdiction - I'm questioning why PA doesn't. It's going to come down to a residency argument and just when/how residence was established.

"What the latter part of the rule means is that if a parent moves with a child to a new state, when the child had been living in the original state for at least six months, the new state does not become the home state until the child has lived in the new state for six months; the original home state remains the home state for six months after the child is moved to a different state."

OP needs to post the time frame here. Note that this section refers to "living in the State" as opposed to "residency."

[cadillac59]

I understand. My resarch leads me to believe that it's PA which has jurisdiction over both - but, again, I don't know the status of the driver's license, that type of info, and whether OP has actually been in LA six "legal" months.

I'm not questioning who has jurisdiction - I'm questioning why PA doesn't. It's going to come down to a residency argument.

I've amended my answer with respect to child support jurisdiction to be a little more accurate (but CS jursidiction was not really the OP's question).

PA doesn't has custody jurisdiction because LA is the children's home state (it's the state they've resided in with a parent or person acting as a parent for the last 6 months). The residency of the parents is irrelevant under the UCCJEA.

I'll admit there's a possible argument that PA might still have custody jurisdiction if the mom moved back and promptly filed for custody-- that would be the argument that PA has always been the child's home state and that their stay in Louisiana was only a temporary absence under the UCCJEA and is therefore included in calculating the time the kids have been in PA (gauged from the time a PA action is filed). I think personally that's a very tenuous argument and don't know of any case law that supports that interpretation (but again I'll admit it's a possibility).

Oh, and I'll add, don't forget there is no concurrent jurisdiction over custody. Only one state at a time can have custody jurisdiction.

[PABound09]

We have lived in Pennylvania up until July 08, that is when we moved to Louisiana. My daughter started school there at the end of August. My license, car information, everything is still PA but we did get a PO Box.

To sum up the posts here, I can leave Louisiana with my kids if I tell my husband why I'm doing it especially stressing that it is best for the family. After I get to PA, if I decide to file I have to wait six months because technically I am residence of LA. If he decides to file there may be a good chance that the court might make us come back but a good lawyer might fight for us to stay here until the real trial/decision.

Thanks again.

[JudyKayTee]

We have lived in Pennylvania up until July 08, that is when we moved to Louisiana. My daughter started school there at the end of August. My license, car information, everything is still PA but we did get a PO Box.

To sum up the posts here, I can leave Louisiana with my kids if I tell my husband why I'm doing it especially stressing that it is best for the family. After I get to PA, if I decide to file I have to wait six months because technically I am residence of LA. If he decides to file there may be a good chance that the court might make us come back but a good lawyer might fight for us to stay here until the real trial/decision.

Thanks again.

No, you haven't been in LA for 6 months, have you? You've been there 5 months. Your residence is in PA.

Otherwise - yes, I sure do think that's it.

This is a really good, informative thread - I'm honestly glad that you posted. Please come back and let us know how things work out.

Or just stay here and participate - !

[cadillac59]

We have lived in Pennylvania up until July 08, that is when we moved to Louisiana. My daughter started school there at the end of August. My license, car information, everything is still PA but we did get a PO Box.

To sum up the posts here, I can leave Louisiana with my kids if I tell my husband why I'm doing it especially stressing that it is best for the family. After I get to PA, if I decide to file I have to wait six months because technically I am residence of LA. If he decides to file there may be a good chance that the court might make us come back but a good lawyer might fight for us to stay here until the real trial/decision.

Thanks again.

Well, as I said earlier, there's the issue of your residence for the purpose of jurisdiction over a divorce, and then there's the separate but very important issue of jurisdiction of the state court over child custody (and to a lesser extent child support), which is governed by a totally different set of rules (than those that goven filing for divorce)and they generally speaking having nothing to do with your (i.e. the parents') residency (I know it sounds kind of confusing but the UCCJEA can be confusing and often is until you read it carefully a few times, look at the case law on it, and then get a feel for how and why the rules were put in place-- the history of the Act is actually rather interesting and it derives from proposed uniform laws that date back to the late 1960's.. there's lots of stuff online about it if anyone is interested, which I doubt unless you're a family law attorney :)). If you research this a little bit you will hear over and over that the UCCJEA is concerned about the relationship between the state and the child, not the relationship between the state and the parents. It's the connection the state has with the kid that matters and justifies the state making orders over the child's custody (which makes sense when you think about it).

Your comments about having left PA to reside in LA in July 08 means that sometime this month (Jan 09) you will reach the 6 month mark of having resided in LA. If you move back before that 6 month anniversary date then you have a really excellent chance of PA being considered the kids' home state, which would mean PA would have child custody jurisdiction (I was under the impression that point was already past in my prior comments). If the 6 months has already past then yes, you might have to wait 6 months upon returning to PA before filing, subject to the other stuff I said about arguing the LA residence was temporary. I think you kind of have a handle on it. Good luck.