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innkeeper9 · Jul 14, 2012, 05:32 PM

To start, I will be replacing the panel, but I cannot afford to do it for about 14 months.

I have a Square D XO Series B 50amp 120/240 A.C. panel. I have replaced 1 breaker, but noticed that the main shut off breaker doesn't look right. It is a 2 pole 50 amp XO breaker with two switches connected by a little copper wire. It looks as if the switches are not in 'sinc' that is when I shut it off and put it back on it remained as it was with one switch that went all the way and the other looks to be kind of short of all the way. I'm including an image

This is not my breaker but the only one I could find that I could manipulate to kind of show what it looks like. I lightened the switches and as is shown they are not in the same position as I explained. Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Ruth

stanfortyman · Jul 14, 2012, 06:39 PM

Why not take a pic of the actual breaker and post it?

innkeeper9 · Jul 14, 2012, 07:16 PM

I have no way to take a pic. No cell phone with camera, no program to put it on my computer if I did have a cell phone with camera. I can give you an image of the breaker [Square D 50 amp XO breaker] since I can find it on the web, but it wouldn't have the 'offset' between the two switches I tried to show. Sorry, I was hoping that the image I created would be enough. I can make up just the switch part and probably show the offset between them better. It's really not much, but the one switch goes all the way to the on position and the other one is probably 1/16 to 1/8 inch off that on position. But, there is nothing out in the house.

Ruth

ma0641 · Jul 14, 2012, 08:16 PM

Are you sure this is a 50 amp main breaker or is this a subpanel? Sounds like somebody converted a duplex 120 volt breaker and used it as a 240 volt one.

innkeeper9 · Jul 14, 2012, 10:40 PM

Originally Posted by ma0641

Are you sure this is a 50 amp main breaker or is this a subpanel? Sounds like somebody converted a duplex 120 volt breaker and used it as a 240 volt one.

Yes, I'm pretty sure on that. It's not a subpanel, it's the only panel. I just bought the house a few months ago and had to replace a breaker which meant I had to do some research since I couldn't find the breaker anywhere.

This electrical panel or whatever you call it is a semi flush mount. It sits inside the stucco with just an inch or so showing around the edges. It has the meter in the top part, a CL200 240V 3W Type C2SOD [and a bunch more numbers] OpenWay by Intron.

In the bottom part is a lift metal door. When you open that it has perhaps 1/4 of the space at the top with a blank area below it separating the top from the bottom area. The top area has the 2 pole 50 amp breaker which says 50amp on it, below the separating space are 1 30 amp 2 pole breaker to a 220 outlet in the laundry for an electric dryer, I guess, which I've shut off since I have no need of it. Below that 30 amp are, in this order, all single poles, 20amp, 15amp, 20amp, 15amp - marked as GFCI-, 20amp. Except for the top 20 amp single pole I know what they all control. That top one doesn't seem to have anything on it at all, nothing gets shut off when I shut it off. I haven't gone to the attic crawl yet to try and find where the wire is.

I took off the metal cover that surrounds the breakers and on the inside it says

Square D Rain Tight XO Circuit Breaker and Metering device.
Suitable for use as Service equipment.
Cat no. XO44MRF (semi flush) XO44MRO (surface)
Series B 50 amperes 120/240 A.C.

Sorry that was so long but hopefully from that info someone will know if it is really a 50amp ? Service.

Ruth

ma0641 · Jul 15, 2012, 05:46 AM

I have not seen a house supplied with a 50 amp service unless it was a VERY small cabin. My weekend cabin in the GA mtns is 480 sq ft and has 100 amp. How old and how big is the house. Do you have central heat and air? Something doesn't add up for this being the main panel at only 50 amps.

stanfortyman · Jul 15, 2012, 06:14 AM

Originally Posted by ma0641

I have not seen a house supplied with a 50 amp service unless it was a VERY small cabin.

I would almost guaranty it is a split-buss panel.
There are four or six "mains". The breaker in question is probably the "lighting main".

ma0641 · Jul 15, 2012, 06:50 AM

That would make more sense except the poster said this is the only panel?

stanfortyman · Jul 15, 2012, 09:24 AM

Originally Posted by ma0641

That would make more sense except the poster said this is the only panel??

Split-buss panels are almost always the only panel.
The mains are for appliances and the lighting main.

ma0641 · Jul 15, 2012, 12:04 PM

Have never seen them in Atlanta except for very old homes and they were fused.

innkeeper9 · Jul 15, 2012, 09:54 PM

Originally Posted by stanfortyman

Split-buss panels are almost always the only panel.
The mains are for appliances and the lighting main.

I have pictures. I finally got someone who could take them and send them to me email. The one showing two of the breakers is really two of the same item, but I wasn't sure about being able to see the 1st one so just put them together. You really can't read things so I wrote the info on the images. Maybe you can tell from this.

Ruth

hfcarson · Jul 16, 2012, 02:57 AM

Ruth,
After some browsing it appears this model panel has been obsolete for about 50 years...
Is the panel causing any problems? Does everything work?
If everything is working then what will you gain by replacing just a breaker?
I do hope you can replace this sooner rather than later...

hfcarson · Jul 16, 2012, 02:57 AM

Replace the entire panel that is...

innkeeper9 · Jul 16, 2012, 09:47 AM

Originally Posted by hfcarson

replace the entire panel that is...

The Panel is not causing any problems. Everything works, except the 20amp that I have off because I can't find anything that it seems to control, and the 30amp I shut off to the 220 outlet since I have no use for a 220. But they do work, they have power going to them, and the 220 has power at the outlet when it is on. I have very little that draws any major power: the washer 10amp when it starts, a freezer 5 amps, a 700 watt microwave which has no amps listed, refrigerator 3.5 amps they are all on separate breakers but the fridge and microwave, my lights have never dimmed when anything starts. Other than TVs that's all I have.

I am going to replace but as I said I can't for about 14 months, it's a financial issue. Justifiably, electricians tend to want to get paid for their work :)

The only reason I asked about the main breaker and whether that offset is an issue is because if the breaker is going bad I need to replace it to have power until I can replace the whole panel.

Thanks for the help

tkrussell · Jul 16, 2012, 11:50 AM

The position of the one handle does look like it is tripped.

If there is any question, replace the breaker.

It may be on the verge of failing, better to do the repair on your terms.

innkeeper9 · Jul 16, 2012, 02:07 PM

Tripped, such a simple term which I could not bring to mind, duh. Yes, I would rather do it on my terms

Thanks everyone for all the help, it is greatly appreciated. :)

Ruth

hkstroud · Jul 16, 2012, 02:20 PM

I may be over stepping my bounds here but it seams prudent to point out that replacing this breaker is not something you can do yourself. The meter must be pulled to kill the power in order to replace this breaker.

innkeeper9 · Jul 16, 2012, 04:17 PM

Originally Posted by hkstroud

I may be over stepping my bounds here but it seams prudent to point out that replacing this breaker is not something you can do your self. The meter must be pulled to kill the power in order to replace this breaker.

Not over stepping, or if it is, you should always do it. Electricity is a killer if you do not know what you are doing, even if you do and something was previously incorrectly connected and you were not careful, it could kill you. I will have the electric company come and pull the meter and I have a friend who is a general contractor who says a beer will get the breaker replaced - after the job, of course :)

This is not something I would try, even if I had all the expert advice and step by step guidance. My limit is adding an outlet, light, switch, even changing out a breaker once the main is off and I've checked there is actually no power going to each breaker, but a main is not something I would try, even with the meter pulled.

tommybwiz · Jul 16, 2012, 07:46 PM

Sorry for the earlier incorrect reply

innkeeper9 · Jul 16, 2012, 09:08 PM

Originally Posted by tommybwiz

I don't believe this is a main....

This is the only meter and panel anywhere in the house. If you shut off the 50amp breaker everything in the house shuts down. I have searched every possible place I could imagine for any other panel and there isn't one. There is a 220 outlet, it is in the laundry room, it runs off the 30amp breaker, I have shut that down and disconnected/closed the outlet since I have absolutely no use for a 220. The kitchen walls have been all taken out [mold problem] and all the electrical was visible, there's no 220 anywhere in there. There's no blanked/capped box.