[theo042296]

I think I am dealing with a double leak. A few weeks back, I noticed water stains on our kitchen ceiling directly below our master bath. I took some measurements and it appeared to be the toilet so I replaced the wax ring. By the way, the old ring did look spent - probably 5-10 years old. It appears that leak has stopped. Anyway... a few days ago, I noticed another water stain in the kitchen ceiling but this one seems to be coming from the shower drain area. I re-did my kitchen a few years ago, and if I recall, the shower plumbing is just above the newest stain. I ripped out a closet from the old kitchen design. If memory serves, there was a makeshift access in the closet ceiling - I think for the shower plumbing.

Anyway, I now have cabinets mounted there. I have several questions:

1. Can I determine the leak source without ripping apart my kitchen?
2. Can I repair the leak - assume it is the shower drain area - without ripping apart my kitchen?
3. How can I confirm that the original leak is resolved? With all the water stains in the ceiling, its hard to tell!
4. If I create backside access, can I make the repair? (again, assume the latest leak is from the shower drain area)

[massplumber2008]

Hi Theo:

Start with most obvious stuff first... then work your way from there.

Begin by looking around the shower base itself... but look outside the shower and see if anything obvious there. Then, look inside shower and see if any issues at tile (if present)... maybe grout issue? If tile present... one lone ungrouted line/area can cause quite a mess.

If that reveals nothing obvious then continue by removing the shower handle and trim plate and use a flashlight to look in behind the wall... while running the shower... see if you can see any water at valve or even above valve from the shower arm (will show up at valve if leaks from here... ;) ).

If nothing revealed at this time then this job grows a bit for you...

As a plumber I would probably open an area of the ceiling around the stain at this point and get up there and see what is going on...

Really need to know if this is a tile shower or a fiberglass unit to advise best after this... ok?

Check the easy stuff first... let us know what you discover and answer my questions.

Last point here... plumbing/leaks can be a bit of a stinker! Work this a step at a time and maybe we can keep you from having to "rip your kitchen apart".

Have a good night...

MARK

[ballengerb1]

Mark has given you a great start. Leaks are sneeky and can show themselves many feet from where they really are located. Try to determine what water usage is associated with the leak like a shower or the toilet getting flushed.

[theo042296]

It is a fiberglass unit - no tile/grout issues surrounding the unit either. (We have a tiled floor.

[massplumber2008]

Hii Theo:

If you have done all I mentioned above and you still have not found the leak then I am going to suggest that the shower drain/strainer may be the culprit here.

When you step into the shower is there a little give to the floor? If so, then may be that we are getting closer to your leak.. ;)

Pull the shower drain strainer cover and see if you can tell me if you have a rubber seal around the pipe (see picture below)... if you do then it may not be a bad idea to replace the rubber seal (I screw 3" screws about an 1" into the rubber and then yank up with a pair of pliers... if that doesn't work then may need to cut into the rubber a bit with a flat screwdriver and PRY the rubber up and out).

However, before you go that route check that the seal under the shower strainer is in good shape (need to have strainer cover removed for this). If, when you step into the shower, you see the strainer move and moisture/dirt squeezes out from under the lip of the shower strainer then may be time to replace the shower strainer itself (this can be done from above using the WINGTITE repair shower strainer assembly.. see 2nd picture).

Now.. all this being said, I don't want you to simply replace these parts just to eliminate them as issues and to keep from having to open the ceiling. In my experience, you could repair these only to find that the leak is coming from a pipe in ceiling below.. ok?

Unless anything really obvious is revealed from the above assessment I would open a small area of the ceiling and take a look inside the ceiling to be SURE of exactly what is happening... never know, could even be ice damming from previous year leak at roof or could even be the seal from the toilet you just fixed... ;)... never know?

Let me know what you think...

MARK