Ask Experts Questions for FREE Help !
Ask
    mike306's Avatar
    mike306 Posts: 4, Reputation: 1
    New Member
     
    #1

    Sep 9, 2007, 08:54 AM
    Stuborn open neutral condition
    Ok I have a circuit in my home which is showing a open neutral condition on my tester, my first course of action was to check the white wire connection on all the outlets on the circuit, still showing open neutral, next I changed all the outlets on the circuit to new ones, still showing open neutral? The entire circuit consists of 3 indoor outlets, 1 outdoor (all replaced) and a closet and bathroom light. Can someone PLEASE help me out on this am I missing something? There were small tabs on the new outlets that the instructions say to break off if wiring a 2 circuit feed, I did not break them off, could this be it? Any help you guys/gals could give me would be great.

    Thanks
    Mike
    tkrussell's Avatar
    tkrussell Posts: 9,659, Reputation: 725
    Uber Member
     
    #2

    Sep 9, 2007, 02:14 PM
    What instructions told you to break off tabs?

    You only break off the tabs if there is a 3 wire feed, with two circuits and one neutral. Did you break off any tabs? If so that may be the problem.

    What exactly are you doing?
    mike306's Avatar
    mike306 Posts: 4, Reputation: 1
    New Member
     
    #3

    Sep 9, 2007, 03:23 PM
    No I did not break off any of the tabs on the outlets, I got that info from the box that the new outlets came in. What I am trying to do I get these outlets working, there are 3 outlets, 2 lights and one outdoor outlet and outdoor light that are on the same circuit and are not working, I have changed all the outlets to brand new ones but the problem still presists. Not sure what else to do?

    Mike
    tkrussell's Avatar
    tkrussell Posts: 9,659, Reputation: 725
    Uber Member
     
    #4

    Sep 9, 2007, 04:45 PM
    Start at the panel and test across the black and white until you find the broken neutral.
    mike306's Avatar
    mike306 Posts: 4, Reputation: 1
    New Member
     
    #5

    Sep 10, 2007, 02:11 PM
    If I check at the panel and find the broken neutral at the panel, how do I know which outlet that neutral goes to in order to repair it? Am I missing something?
    mike306's Avatar
    mike306 Posts: 4, Reputation: 1
    New Member
     
    #6

    Sep 10, 2007, 02:17 PM
    Could it be possible that these outlets are sharing a neutral with outlets on another circuit? If so how can I test this?
    tkrussell's Avatar
    tkrussell Posts: 9,659, Reputation: 725
    Uber Member
     
    #7

    Sep 10, 2007, 02:58 PM
    Using a voltage tester, start at the panel testing across the black and white of the circuit that feeds the outlets. Follow the cable to every junction box and outlet testing across the black and white.

    If the circuit shares a neutral the black and white will be in a cable with some other wire, usually red.

    This testing action will methodically cause you to find and test each box looking for the break.
    Stratmando's Avatar
    Stratmando Posts: 11,188, Reputation: 508
    Uber Member
     
    #8

    Sep 11, 2007, 06:40 AM
    Since the hot is good, plug an extension cord into that plug missing neutral. Go to panel, and measure between the panel neutral or ground and the Hot from the cord, turn breakers off one by one until voltage gone, follow the wire on that breaker to cable exiting panel, that is the neutral you would need to check, and if a red is with that it is shared. See what that circuit is(Kitchen, bed?)Are the white wires on the white or light colored screw?
    When they suggested removing tab for 2 circuit feed, It could be red and a black circuit or
    A black and a switched circuit.
    I would Tighten ALL Neutrals, and Breakers while in there.
    shuntripper's Avatar
    shuntripper Posts: 180, Reputation: 8
    Junior Member
     
    #9

    Sep 11, 2007, 08:16 PM
    Check voltage at the replaced receptacles. If it is 220-240V or thereabouts you have a combination circuit with a lost neutral. If the voltage check at the receptacles (hot to ground) is 110-120V, it's less complicated, I'll assume that is the case. The reason the voltage would be 220-40V is that the neutral is open that two hots use to return voltage to the source. Did you check the wire in the Light circuits? Do the lights still work? (your post did not state) If the lights still work ( and someone has had them apart lately maybe?) check in the boxes where the fixture is. All OK?( no loose connections and light works ?) If not,then here it gets a little tricky. With the circuit off at first take the switch(es) off their mounting screws, leaving wire connected. Is there a white and a black wire on the switch? Switches don't need neutrals to work. (unless it is a motion snsor or something other than the usual toggle switch, single pole always says on and off on the handle) The white wire should have a piece of tape on it or some marking to indicate not really a neutral. Any way the white wire is either the hot brought down or a "switch leg", so it may be energized. Look at the light box,does it have 2 two conductor cables?(with or without a ground, grounds aren't called conductors, in this instance conductor is not an adjective, it is a... name. Noun? Pronoun? I'm not an English Major) Anyway with only two cables the hot and neutral come in from the source in one cable, with the hot made up to a wire (other cable now)down to the switch and back on the other wire to the light fixture(some people take hot down with a taped white and come back up on the black, others do it the other way)the neutral from the source goes to the white wire from the light fixture. If there are THREE cables (or more ) you have a cable from the source, a cable going to the next device on the circuit and a cable down to the switch. With this arrangement the source hot comes in and will (need to ) be made up to a hot to the next device AND a wire down to the switch,again the other wire ( now a SWITCHED HOT or SWITCH LEG) from the switch cable goes to the hot from the light . The neutral from the source must be made up together with the neutral in the cable to the next device(s) and the white (neutral) from the light fixture. If all the white wires were together in this case you would be senig a neutral down to the switch and back and the light fixture would not work. If you put all the black wires together too, including the one down to the switch. If you turned the circuit on with the Switch in the off position the light would come on. BUT this would be a bad situation because the moment you turn the switch on you would find that you have wired a SHORT CIRCUIT. The neutral on the white and the hot on the black going down to the switch is what e call a "DEAD SHORT TO GROUND." Best case scenario you trip the circuit breaker, worst case you makee fire, burn down your house, and be dead. These are only two ways this wire can be made up or pulled, source voltage may have been brought into the switch box. Check what you have going on and ask again if this is no help.
    Is the outdoor receptacle a GFCI type? It should be if a general use receptacle. If it is a GFCI did you take wires through the recept to the next device, or (I know this is weird TK, but I 've seen weirder) is only the white wire through the recept and the black tailed out, I know this is getting technical /eclectic, please let TK Russell know what you have found, I've been working out of town and away from my Computer/email must got bed now, back in a few days or a week? Don't know. Big transformer with 25 1000kcm jumpers to busduct, 12,500kV service approx 800 feet to utility.

Not your question? Ask your question View similar questions

 

Question Tools Search this Question
Search this Question:

Advanced Search

Add your answer here.


Check out some similar questions!

Open neutral in several rooms [ 11 Answers ]

I have discovered that there is an open neutral condition in three of my home's rooms. First, one of the bedrooms has an open neutral. I tested three receptacles on one side of the room. The end of the line is fine. The first two receptacles show the open neutral in the bottom outlet; the...

Open neutral [ 2 Answers ]

I have just changed my switches and plugs and have found that one plug on an outlet is showing open neutral. The problem plug is the one that is controlled by a switch. When the switch is off my tester shows "open neutral" but when the switch is on it show "correct". The other "hot" plug on the...

GFI - Open Neutral [ 1 Answers ]

I read through the previous question and answers asked on here, but it did not help me solve this problem. I recencly replaced 5 GFI Receptacles in my kitchen and bathroom. All were only one white, one black, and one ground wire and I attached them to the line section on the back of the GFI, they...

Suspected open/loose service neutral [ 1 Answers ]

I had a BGE (local power company) service person come out to investigate what I believe to be an open/loose neutral problem. The service person did not believe there to be a problem. (and didn't even seem to understand that power traveled in a loop and needs a return path) When a clamp-on amp...

Open Neutral [ 2 Answers ]

I need some expert assistance... I think that I have an open neutral on the power company's side. They came out to look at it today and didn't fix anything, and I would like someone else to evaluate my conclusion before I call them tomorrow. This is a commercial building that I am...


View more questions Search