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PixieMama · Jul 11, 2007, 02:13 PM

DISCLAIMER: THIS IS STRICTLY OUT OF CURIOUSITY AND I MEAN NO DISRESPECT TO ANYONE AND THEIR BELIEFS!

This is something that I have always wondered about and have never been able to get anyone to give me a rational and logical answer to this. I am not interested in offending anyone but I have a very natural curiousity about most things I don't understand and religion is one of the main topics that peaks my curiosity.

I am not a christian. My mothers family is jewish. My step-dad used to be roman catholic before he converted to marry my mother. My bio-dad is some form of christianity (I do not know which as he's never been a prominent figure in my life). My mother in law is pagan - by pagan I mean Witchs - no, not Wiccans -(as are my brother & sister in law), and the rest of my husbands family are southern baptists. My husband and I do not believe in religion but we do have our own set of beliefs. However, with the mix of different beliefs in our families, the fact that everyone believes THEIR way is the ONLY way to "God" and that following any other path is a sin, it has always been something that made me go "huh!"

Something that I don't get is this. Jesus was jewish. He was born to the "chosen people". Somewhere I read he was a rabbi (equal to a priest in your faith). So, Jesus being a jew means he believed in the jewish religion and his spiritual teachings would have followed suit with that, right? In the jewish religion (which I was taught growing up) there was never mention of "devil" or "hell". Jews also believe in reincarnation - yet, christians don't? If Jesus believed in certain things and certain teachings, then how come christians don't?

Something else that has always bothered me with curiousity is if Jesus's teachings and words weren't written until 100's of years after his death, how can you be sure that what was written about what he said was actually true? And how can be sure that the scrolls or scriptures that were found were properly translated being that hebrew still exsists today but aramaic is a dead language and unless I am mistaken Jesus spoke aramaic.

And one more thing to mention. I was watching a show about Mary Magdalan (sp?) on the history channel a few nights ago, which was very interesting. She was Jesus's wife? And they were talking about how it is believed her "servent girl" who she showed up in France with was actually the daughter she had with Jesus. So... do you believe that the Christ bloodline still exists? I mean, if you believe the Mary Magdalan story? I don't know much about her or her play in the whole thing aside from the show I watched, but I did find it interesting.

Even though I don't accept Jesus as my god, or as the "son" of god anymore then I accept you and me and all living creatures as the "children" of a higher power, I am in no way anti-christ and I do have a curiousity about this subject. So I hope some people will give insightful answers without getting heated and nasty about it. In my experience, anytime I've tried to ask these sorts of questions to christians in real life they have become verbally violent and nasty. I did not appreciate that, as I meant NO disrespect, but simply was curious about their beliefs and why they believed that or how they were sure it was true. And I couldn't accept the "blind faith" as a good enough answer. I needed more then just that to go on.

bigdreamer85 · Jul 11, 2007, 02:42 PM

OK, I'm with you on this one, I'm a southn baptist too, and when I asked my youth pastor this question when I was in High School he couldn't give me an answer and neither could my pastor. Sadly that was the last time I went to that church...

Fr_Chuck · Jul 11, 2007, 02:57 PM

Let me see, first yes Jesus was Jewish, but rabbii merely means teacher, he was not a priest at the temple, or part of the priesthood as done by the church of that time. Rabbii was merely a title of respect of a religious teacher with followers.

No, it was not 100's of years after Christ, the New Testement except for Pauls writings were done in the 10 to 30 years after Jesus death and resurrection. Pauls writtings were also written about the same time, except he did not personally follow Christ during that time frame.

And yes, if one follows the teaching of the old testement there is mention of satan and hell. It may well not be taught in today's Jewish faith but would have been at that time.

Most of the new Testement was done in Greek, the common written language of the time,

No Mary Magdalan was not married to Christ, there is no mention of this at all and the TV show was merely fantacy or fiction and sad if it was on a history channel since there is no proof at all, complete fiction
And no there is no writing, teaching or anything except in some fictional books about a daughter of Christ in France.
So no there is no bloodline, so no it does not exist.

But yes, faith has to do with it, without faith, you really have little to believe in.

Tessy777 · Jul 11, 2007, 03:02 PM

Originally Posted by PixieMama

DISCLAIMER: THIS IS STRICTLY OUT OF CURIOUSITY AND I MEAN NO DISRESPECT TO ANYONE AND THEIR BELIEFS!

This is something that I have always wondered about and have never been able to get anyone to give me a rational and logical answer to this. I am not interested in offending anyone but I have a very natural curiousity about most things I don't understand and religion is one of the main topics that peaks my curiosity.

I am not a christian. My mothers family is jewish. My step-dad used to be roman catholic before he converted to marry my mother. My bio-dad is some form of christianity (I do not know which as he's never been a prominent figure in my life). My mother in law is pagan - by pagan I mean Witchs - no, not Wiccans -(as are my brother & sister in law), and the rest of my husbands family are southern baptists. My husband and I do not believe in religion but we do have our own set of beliefs. However, with the mix of different beliefs in our families, the fact that everyone believes THEIR way is the ONLY way to "God" and that following any other path is a sin, it has always been something that made me go "huh!"

Something that I don't get is this. Jesus was jewish. He was born to the "chosen people". Somewhere I read he was a rabbi (equal to a priest in your faith). So, Jesus being a jew means he believed in the jewish religion and his spiritual teachings would have followed suit with that, right? In the jewish religion (which I was taught growing up) there was never mention of "devil" or "hell". Jews also believe in reincarnation - yet, christians don't? If Jesus believed in certain things and certain teachings, then how come christians don't?

Something else that has always bothered me with curiousity is if Jesus's teachings and words weren't written until 100's of years after his death, how can you be sure that what was written about what he said was actually true? And how can be sure that the scrolls or scriptures that were found were propperly translated being that hebrew still exsists today but aramaic is a dead language and unless I am mistaken Jesus spoke aramaic.

And one more thing to mention. I was watching a show about Mary Magdalan (sp?) on the history channel a few nights ago, which was very interesting. She was Jesus's wife? And they were talking about how it is believed her "servent girl" who she showed up in France with was actually the daughter she had with Jesus. So...do you believe that the Christ bloodline still exists? I mean, if you believe the Mary Magdalan story? I don't know much about her or her play in the whole thing aside from the show I watched, but I did find it interesting.

Even though I don't accept Jesus as my god, or as the "son" of god anymore then I accept you and me and all living creatures as the "children" of a higher power, I am in no way anti-christ and I do have a curiousity about this subject. So I hope some people will give insightful answers without getting heated and nasty about it. In my experience, anytime I've tried to ask these sorts of questions to christians in real life they have become verbally violent and nasty. I did not appreciate that, as I meant NO disrespect, but simply was curious about their beliefs and why they believed that or how they were sure it was true. And I couldn't accept the "blind faith" as a good enough answer. I needed more then just that to go on.

PixieMama,

Jesus was a Jewish Rabbi.. thru and through. He followed the law and led a sinless life. He never preached the Gospel as we know it because He came to fulfill the Law, die and be resurrected before there could be the Gospel.

I believe the BiBle to be written by the hand of man but completely inspired by the HOLY SPIRIT. (according to the book of Timothy) You need to understand how the scribes copied the Bible. ( Someone else will have to explain that process.) But it was very intricate.

Jesus Christ was never married. I know there are many claims, but each and everyone have been proven untrue. IT is only man's theory. Mathew, Mark, Luke and John are all about the life of the LORD. The idea that he was married is offensive to me. HE was God and didn't come here for that purpose, but nevertheless, the Gospels are the best source of the life of Jesus. I would strongly suggest if you really want to know more about Mary of Magdalene and the life of Jesus to really start reading the Gospels. The Davinci Code is all about the secret bloodline of Jesus... it is BOGUS according to the Bible.

The Jewish faith did NOT believe in reincarnation. I'm not sure where that idea came from but it isn't from the Jews.

I agree with you, there is no need to get nasty and heated. This subject certainly can do that for some. It is because people get passionate about their beliefs.

Tessy777 · Jul 11, 2007, 03:19 PM

Hey Fr_Chuck,

I agree with you. ;)

PixieMama · Jul 11, 2007, 03:54 PM

Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck

Let me see, first yes Jesus was Jewish, but rabbii merely means teacher, he was not a priest at the temple, or part of the priesthood as done by the church of that time. Rabbii was merely a title of respect of a religious teacher with followers.

No, it was not 100's of years after Christ, the New Testement except for Pauls writings were done in the 10 to 30 years after Jesus death and resurrection. Pauls writtings were also written about the same time, except he did not personally follow Christ during that time frame.

And yes, if one follows the teaching of the old testement there is mention of satan and hell. It may well not be taught in todays Jewish faith but would have been at that time.

Most of the new Testement was done in Greek, the commom written language of the time,

No Mary Magdalan was not married to Christ, there is no mention of this at all and the TV show was merely fantacy or fiction and sad if it was on a history channel since there is no proof at all, complete fiction
And no there is no writing, teaching or anything except in some fictional books about a daughter of Christ in France.
So no there is no bloodline, so no it does not exist.

But yes, faith has to do with it, without faith, you really have little to beleive in.

In all that I was taught from my jewish relatives and in jewish school for the two years I attended, there was never mention of a hell or a satan. I was always brought up to believe that was a christian thing. And Rabbi is the term I am familiar with as the leader of the jewish temple and congragation, so forgive me if I was mistaken there. As I've said, it's been very hard for me to get any straight answers regarding this subject matter. I didn't know anything about Mary Magdalan until I watched that show on the history channel which is why I wanted to ask about it. It talked a lot about how she was Jesus's companion, he shared secret teachings with her and that she was one of the apostles (sp) of christ but that she was written off as a whore by the male apostles because they were jealous of how close she was to Jesus. It said that her scriptures and such were found in France where she was taken to and died. But yeah, I don't know.

Anyway, thank you for answering. :)

PixieMama · Jul 11, 2007, 04:01 PM

Originally Posted by Tessy777

Jesus Christ was never married. I know there are many claims, but each and everyone have been proven untrue. IT is only man's theory. Mathew, Mark, Luke and John are all about the life of the LORD. The idea that he was married is offensive to me. HE was God and didn't come here for that purpose, but nevertheless, the Gospels are the best source of the life of Jesus. I would strongly suggest if you really want to know more about Mary of Magdalene and the life of Jesus to really start reading the Gospels. The Davinci Code is all about the secret bloodline of Jesus....it is BOGUS according to the Bible.

Hi Tessy,

I mean you no disrespect, but I'm curious as to how they have proven it untrue. I would think it would be near impossible to prove something like that one way or another because we're talking about a man who lived many many years ago. I never read the Davinci Code (or saw the movie) so I wouldn't know anything about that. ;)

Tessy777 · Jul 11, 2007, 07:38 PM

Perhaps proven was the wrong word. What I meant was for every claim that Jesus has a bloodline with Mary of Magdalene, there is someone to back up how it couldn't have been. You are correct.. man can't prove it. If you read the gospels... you won't see any mention of it. When you understand who Jesus was and why he came... you'll understand why I find it offensive to think he married and had children. He started His ministry at 30 and was crucified at 33 and he rose 3 days later according to the scriptures. He remained on earth for 40 days and then ascended back to the Father where He sits at the right hand of God. He didn't didn't leave a wife and kid behind... according to the scriptures. The truth is.. I can only tell you what the Bible has to say. I do not know any other source but I believe the bible to be true.

As far as reincarnation goes... it isn't something your Jewish relatives got from the Old Testament. It isn't there and Jesus never taught it either.

Marily · Jul 16, 2007, 12:30 AM

Jesus was never jew or gentile , He was God manifested in Human form, these things are hid from the wise and prudent

Tessy777 · Jul 16, 2007, 05:43 AM

Originally Posted by Marily

Jesus was never jew or gentile , He was God manifested in Human form, these things are hid from the wise and prudent

Marly,

HIS mother was Jewish woman, His Father IS GOD. He was born into this world a Jewish baby. He was raised as a JEW and he lived under the Law. When he died on the cross the Romans posted a sign that said... "Jesus....King of the Jews". HE is coming back to rule and reign for 1000 years... where? Jerusalem. Yes Jesus WAS a Jew! He IS also GOD.

Marily · Jul 16, 2007, 06:38 AM

Tessy I could give you a valid answer to back up my statement but since we are here on a free moral agency I will respect your beliefs :)

speechlesstx · Jul 16, 2007, 08:44 AM

Yes, Jesus was a Jew and a Rabbi - a teacher. He was presented in the temple as a baby "to do for him after the custom of the law (Luke 2:27), he taught in the temple (Matthew 26:55), healed in the temple (Matthew 21:14), and was Himself worshiped in the temple (Matthew 21:15-16), which he called "my house" (Matthew 21:13). Of course Jesus turned Jewish belief and tradition on its head in condemning the complexity and rigidity of what the law had become and the hypocrites behind it, and returned it to its simplest form, love God and love others which is the foundation of BOTH Judaism and Christianity.

Christ also speaks of coming to "fulfill" the law, fulfilling all righteousness and eliminating the need for any further sacrifice as He had become the perfect sacrifice. "But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God," Hebrews 10:12. He established the era of grace (unmerited, unearned favor of God), and reminded us it was never about keeping the letter of the law, but living by faith - "the just shall live by faith." So you see it isn't that Christians don't believe in some things Jesus believed in, we try to honor those beliefs as Jesus expressed them and therefore, how we believe God intended them from the onset. Love God, love others, live by faith.

As for Jewish belief in reincarnation I guess it depends on who you ask.

The passing of souls into successive bodily forms, either human or animal. According to Pythagoras, who probably learned the doctrine in Egypt, the rational mind (ψρήν), after having been freed from the chains of the body, assumes an ethereal vehicle, and passes into the region of the dead, where it remains till it is sent back to this world to inhabit some other body, human or animal. After undergoing successive purgations, and when it is sufficiently purified, it is received among the gods, and returns to the eternal source from which it first proceeded. This doctrine was foreign to Judaism until about the eighth century,when, under the influence of the Mohammedan mystics, it was adopted by the Karaites and other Jewish dissenters...

The doctrine counted so few adherents among the Jews that, with the exception of Abraham ibn Daud ("Emunah Ramah," I. 7), no Jewish philosopher until Ḥasdai Crescas even deemed it necessary to refute it. Only with the spread of the Cabala did it begin to take root in Judaism, and then it gained believers even among men who were little inclined toward mysticism...

Gilgul.

The theory of impregnation gave birth to the superstitious belief in "dibbuḳ" or "gilgul," which prevailed, and still prevails, among the Oriental Jews and those of eastern Europe. This belief assumes that there are souls which are condemned to wander for a time in this world, where they are tormented by evil spirits which watch and accompany them everywhere. To escape their tormentors such souls sometimes take refuge in the bodies of living pious men and women, over whom the evil spirits have no power. The person to whom such a soul clings endures great suffering and loses his own individuality; he acts as though he were quite another man, and loses all moral sense. He can be cured only by a miracle-working rabbi ("ba'al shem") who is able to cast out the soul from his body by exorcisms and amulets.

It sounds to me like some do, particularly Hasidic Jews and Kabbalists, and some don't believe in reincarnation. The Jewish Encyclopedia also has an interesting article on Sheol I won't get into. There is at least one expert here who could shed more light on this if he chooses to drop by.

As for when the New Testament was written it you'll find plenty of disagreement on dates, but it wasn't hundreds of years after Jesus' death and resurrection and it was written by eyewitnesses or those relating the accounts of eyewitnesses. And the Mary Magdelene thing, don't buy it. Neither side can prove without a doubt, but there is no ancient document that supports the claim as far as I know.

firmbeliever · Jul 21, 2007, 12:03 PM

In fact muslims believe that from Abraham,David,Moses,Noah etc till Jesus were all muslims prophets (ie to say they all came with the same message of One God).

A Muslim believes in all the Messengers and Prophets of God without any discrimination. All messengers were mortals, human beings, endowed with Divine revelations and appointed by God to teach mankind.Hence we believe in Taurat/Torah, Injeel/Old Testament, Zaboor/Psalms and that other books were revealed to other messengers but we also believe these books were tampered by people hence the message was mixed with truths from God and human needs added.

Regarding Jesus bloodline,it does not exist , we believe that when he descends a second time he will live,marry and die as he is human just like any other messenger of Almighty.

Disclaimer-I write only to provide informations not to argue with anyone!:) :)

txtracey · Jul 22, 2007, 09:22 AM

Tessy 777's answers are very good. You have to realize that ANY belief system is based on Faith. Even when you believe in "nothing" you are giving credit to something, whether it is the theory of evolution, or another theory. We all got here somehow. If you look at the old testament prohpecies about the chosen one to lead the Jews, Jesus fulfilled EVERY prophecy. The only prophecy not yet fulfilled is his second coming, which has not occurred yet. When Christians become angry, hateful or aggressive-they are not acting in a proper Christian way. You asked good questions. Jesus was not married, and there is no bloodline. He is married to his "church" which are all believers in Christ. If you delve into the new testament scriptures a little, you might actually find it interesting. God Bless!