[tomder55]

So you are saying that he was on the White House visitor's log to go to seminars in the Ike office building ;which is not in the White House ? Do you even find that line of reasoning plausible ?

[excon]

Hello again, tom:

Do you even find that line of reasoning plausible ?

As plausible as his being there 3 PLUS days a week for the last 3 years. Do you find THAT plausible?

Excon

[talaniman]

The Ike building is part of the WH complex, and my explanation is as plausible as anything you and your right wing brethren have come up with.

Its all opinion and speculation no matter the source until we get the real deal. But you guys have it all figured out.

[speechlesstx]

While Tal and ex are reveling in their blind faith in all things Obama things just keep popping up to demonstrate how misplaced that trust is.

NSA collecting phone records of millions of Verizon customers daily

National Security Agency is currently collecting the telephone records of millions of US customers of Verizon, one of America's largest telecoms providers, under a top secret court order issued in April.

The order, a copy of which has been obtained by the Guardian, requires Verizon on an "ongoing, daily basis" to give the NSA information on all telephone calls in its systems, both within the US and between the US and other countries.

The document shows for the first time that under the Obama administration the communication records of millions of US citizens are being collected indiscriminately and in bulk – regardless of whether they are suspected of any wrongdoing.

The secret Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (Fisa) granted the order to the FBI on April 25, giving the government unlimited authority to obtain the data for a specified three-month period ending on July 19.

Under the terms of the blanket order, the numbers of both parties on a call are handed over, as is location data, call duration, unique identifiers, and the time and duration of all calls. The contents of the conversation itself are not covered.

The disclosure is likely to reignite longstanding debates in the US over the proper extent of the government's domestic spying powers.

Under the Bush administration, officials in security agencies had disclosed to reporters the large-scale collection of call records data by the NSA, but this is the first time significant and top-secret documents have revealed the continuation of the practice on a massive scale under President Obama.

[NeedKarma]

Yup, your government has been spying on you since 9/11. Eroded rights have been going on for quite a while and there really is nothing you can do about it - you don't factor in their pay.

[excon]

Hello Steve:

Yeah, I don't like 'em snooping on me. I'm a Constitutional sort of guy. I said it when Bush was doing it (when it was OK with you), and I say it now. You just beat me to the post.

He's also ramped up droning people, and I'm not sure how I feel about that. Tell me what YOU think, so I'll know what I think. (That's a joke.)

excon

[talaniman]

You probably only got the tip of the iceberg as I doubt Verizon is the only one to get such an order. Its broad in scope but for some very specific details, and while I bristle at the idea of FISA enabling this method of data collection, I'm not ready to go hog wild over conspiracy theories just yet.

I do know that radicals and terrorist are highly sophisticated in their use of tools of technology, and we better pay attention to what they are capable of. And lets not ignore the international criminals in this equation either, who can steal millions in a matter of seconds.

We have already seen one guy slipping through the cracks can screw up a lot of law abiding citizens so it's a balancing act. You give law enforcement the tools, or expect them to protect you with a popgun, against a cannon.

[speechlesstx]

Hello Steve:

Yeah, I don't like 'em snooping on me. I'm a Constitutional sorta guy. I said it when Bush was doing it (when it was OK with you), and I say it now. You just beat me to the post.

He's also ramped up droning people, and I'm not sure how I feel about that. Tell me what YOU think, so I'll know what I think. (That's a joke.)

excon

I don't believe I have ever said unlimited, unjustified domestic surveillance was OK with me. But I do have to chuckle every time I see you say you're a constitution guy, you're not OK with my first and second amendment rights. But this, this is like the Obama administration has been juiced by Biogenesis when it comes to domestic spying.

[tomder55]

The new order covers not only phone calls overseas to specific #s identified as probable terrorist links , but all domestic calls by Verizon customers over at least a three month period. There is a huge difference between that and what the Bush adm did .

Trevor Timm, a digital rights analyst at the Electronic Frontier Foundation, called the order “shockingly broad.”

“Not only are they intercepting call data into and out of the country, but they are intercepting all call data in the United States, which goes far beyond what the FISA Amendments Act allows,” Timm said.

“This is an abuse of the Patriot Act on a massive scale,” said Gregory Nojeim, senior counsel at the Center for Democracy and Technology. “Since the law requires that the telephone records sought be relevant to an investigation, it appears that the FBI and the NSA may have launched the broadest investigation in history because everyone's telephone calls seem to be relevant to it.”

Obama administration defends Verizon records order - POLITICO.com Print View

The Dems when they Bush bashed always talked of the potential for abuse while never coming up with a shred of evidence that the act was abused. Yeah the potential was there ;with a lawless Democrat adm.

[speechlesstx]

What are the odds that Glenn Greenwald will be named a con-conspirator in the leak investigation?

[talaniman]

Lawless dem administration?? That's pretty inaccurate since repubs signed off on it. Why would they become part of the lawless dem administration?

The top two leaders of the Senate Intelligence Committee said Thursday that the widespread monitoring of Verizon phone calls made in the United States has been going on for years, and that Congress is regularly briefed on it.

Sens. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.) and Saxby Chambliss (R-Ga.) also defended the National Security Agency's request to the company for all the metadata about phone calls made within and from the United States.

House Armed Services Committee lawmakers said late Wednesday that they had not seen the Guardian report, and so did not want to comment on it — but a GOP committee aide said the leak of the document is problematic.

“If the story proves accurate, we would have very serious concerns about the magnitude of the leak involved,” the aide said.

Maybe your brethren repubs know something you don't but don't seem to share your concerns about a lawless dem administration in this case.

[tomder55]

Congress passed a law five years ago to institutionalize the warrantless surveillance program. Are you saying that they approved this massive data collection ,or was this more abusive over reach by the Obots? The Emperor has expanded the warrantless surveillance to include what he and Janet Napolitano call domestic terrorism.

[talaniman]

Its called a reauthorization and if Saxby Chambliss knew about it and said nothing against it, that tells me something, since he has been briefed continuously for 7 (NOT 5) years so why are you berating just the dems, or just Obama for this tyranny, over reach stuff?

[cdad]

Copy of the document:

Verizon forced to hand over telephone data


What it looks like is a broad net fishing expidition on the part of the feds that may later lead to further investigations. A national database so to speak of phone records and all ties that lead to them.

[tomder55]

Its called a reauthorization and if Saxby Chambliss knew about it and said nothing against it, that tells me something, since he has been briefed continuously for 7 (NOT 5) years so why are you berating just the dems, or just Obama for this tyranny, over reach stuff?

What it shows me is further proof that the government is too big and powerful and it acts beyond it's constitutional limits .

[NeedKarma]

Just like Patriot Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
And
Digital Millennium Copyright Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[speechlesstx]

Copy of the document:

Verizon forced to hand over telephone data


What it looks like is a broad net fishing expidition on the part of the feds that may later lead to further investigations. A national database so to speak of phone records and all ties that lead to them.

And I'm sure the gun control advocates still believe the background checks bill would not have led to a national database. "Trust us" says Obama...

[NeedKarma]

Background checks are indeed kept in a database. When data is collected that is how it is kept, for retrieval and reporting.
Not sure why that's evil to you.

[speechlesstx]

Background checks are indeed kept in a database. When data is collected that is how it is kept, for retrieval and reporting.
Not sure why that's evil to you.

Guess you missed the gun control threads. Registration - a database - leads to confiscation and other abuses of our rights. But you probably believe that never happens, the government doing evil with information compiled on its citizens.

[NeedKarma]

Registration - a database - leads to confiscation and other abuses

Nope, it doesn't.