[paraclete]

It's very strange. In the 60s a "War on Poverty" was declared, giving Federal aid to Single parents, the disadvantaged, the unemployed, etc., with no strings attached.

Now we have four or five generations of single mothers for whom each child increases her stipend and marriage or employment would render destitute. In the 90s a "Welfare to Work" program was instituted that did get a few off the dole, but it's still epidemic here.

What you describe is what we call the welfare trap, some people reach a point where it would actually cost them money to get a job, but that situation doesn't last forever. I think it is a comment on our society when wages are so low that that situation could arise. Once a child of a single parent reaches sixteen assistance stops. I'm glad we don't declare war on anything, the last person who tried it here made the foolish statement that by 2000 no Australian child would live in poverty and in 2007 we had the intervention to deal with indigenous disadvantage because of the conditions of indigenous children and their dole bludging parents

[smoothy]

As I said what a strange place you live in, where I come from the dole or unemplyment is the same thing and if you can't find a job you are in training or on work for the dole. There are the disabled but that is another story. The only people I know caught in the welfare trap are our indigenous population and to be fair there isn't a lot of opportunity in some parts of the country. Of course we do have old age pensioners but surely we are not talking about them.

You seem to have a high level of service for the disadvantaged, so there must be some charity working there somewhere but you wouldn't know it from the attitude you display

Well, I'm not in or from any strange place...

Welfare and Unemployment are not the same here. How long you can be on umemployment depends on how long you have worked at your job. Generally to discourage people from working a little then collecting as a practice to avoid as much work as they can get away with. And yes there are people like that.

Welfare is totally different... originally intended to help people who could not find work during the 1930's Great Depression when there really was no work to be had... and morphed into a program for people who did NOT want to finish school and/or get a real job because they were too special to break a sweat or get up in the morning.

Many Claim to be "disadvantaged" while the reality, nearly every case is a result of their own choices and actions. Like refusing to finish High school or making the most of it because THEY feel its "uncool".

The only real disadvantaged here are those born with handicaps, or learning disorders (which are NOT their own doing) however failing to make the most of your abilities IS the fault of that person and nobody else. The rest have the same opportunities most of the rest of us have.

Job retraining programs are not automatic... nor specifically part of either program.

And remember... While I am talking about the USA where I am familiar... you are talking about Australia where I admit I am less familiar.

There will be big differences in many programs, as there can be between the UK, USA, and Australian english dialects.

[Catsmine]

what you describe is what we call the welfare trap, some people reach a point where it would actually cost them money to get a job, but that situation doesn't last forever.

But it does. That's why Bureaucrats get the ninth circle of the Inferno all to themselves. They perpetuate their "client" list to acquire more staus/seniority/power.

[paraclete]

There will be big differences in many programs, as there can be between the UK, USA, and Austrailian english dialects.

Indeed but ideas, like people, have a way of migrating. The world really is a small place and many bad ideas get a second outing in a place where the elections come around every three years. The smaller the economy the more it becomes a testbed for new products and new ideas. We do get the advantage of watching and therefore don't always make the mistakes obvious in the first implementation. We also have a political system more ameniable to compromise although it can become polarised as it is at the moment. We have many who like to cross the Pacific to tell us about a problem we haven't experienced yet.

[smoothy]

Indeed but ideas, like people, have a way of migrating. The world really is a small place and many bad ideas get a second outing in a place where the elections come around every three years. The smaller the economy the more it becomes a testbed for new products and new ideas. We do get the advantage of watching and therefore don't always make the mistakes obvious in the first implementation. We also have a political system more ameniable to compromise although it can become polarised as it is at the moment. We have many who like to cross the Pacific to tell us about a problem we haven't experienced yet.

I actually have more respect for most illegals than I have for the lazy underclass that feel entitled to handouts.

Doesn't mean I condone their actions however. At least a good number of them actually have a strong work ethic, which is an admiral trait to have.

But laws are laws... and we have the right to limit and control who is allowed to immigrate and how many. Nobody has the right or is "Special" enough to be above the law.

[paraclete]

.

But laws are laws...and we have the right to limit and control who is allowed to immigrate and how many. Nobody has the right or is "Special" enough to be above the law.

Go tell it to the UN they want a home for all their refugees which is another way of saying people who think the grass is greener someplace else. I agree, no country should have to take people just because they turn up on their door step, which is a complete reversal of the situation under which both our countries were founded. However, we have forgotten that we do need to think about how to alleviate poverty in the places where these people come from. A little exploration of inner space might do more for this planet than chasing after a dream in a place that doesn't even sustain life

[smoothy]

Go tell it to the UN they want a home for all their refugees which is another way of saying people who think the grass is greener someplace else. I agree, no country should have to take people just because they turn up on their door step, which is a complete reversal of the situation under which both our countries were founded. However, we have forgotten that we do need to think about how to alleviate poverty in the places where these people come from. A little exploration of inner space might do more for this planet than chasing after a dream in a place that doesn't even sustain life

Don't even get me started on that worthless bunch...

The UN... what a joke. Yeah it was created with noble purposes in mind... but its somehow turned into a clone of a student council that somehow got taken over by all the school bullies and troublemakers.