[Wondergirl]

I have to agree with meyowgee.

So what are the things you would get rid of and change and improve?

[Catsmine]

So what are the things you would get rid of and change and improve?

The NEA would be a good place to start getting rid of.

Changes might include seniority-based pay being replaced with a meritorious system. The next place I'd look would be stopping the promoting of the best teachers into management and letting them teach. Principals needn't come from the classroom just as military officers needn't come from the ranks.

[Wondergirl]

The NEA would be a good place to start getting rid of.

Changes might include seniority-based pay being replaced with a meritorious system. The next place I'd look would be stopping the promoting of the best teachers into management and letting them teach. Principals needn't come from the classroom just as military officers needn't come from the ranks.

... and as library directors needn't come from the reference librarian ranks.

I'm good with all that. What else? Schoolday content?

[tomder55]

So what are the things you would get rid of and change and improve?

Mass firings at R.I. school may signal a trend - USATODAY.com

I agree with all of Cats' suggestions.Basically there is little accountability in the current tenure system and that has to change . Performance should be the only criteria for keeping a job.
You know I think competition is a good place to start .Schools from administration ,teachers on down should be held accountable for results . States should remove restrictions on the creation of charter school alternatives... and I am a believer in vouchers to allow parents the option of sending their children to private schools.
Encourage the increased participation of parents and businesses because they will clearly benefit from an educated work force. Direct corporate sponsorship or indirect through programs like America's Schools program should be expanded to give schools additional funding alternatives.America's Schools Program

Don't have time to list more. Regarding the OP ;clearly the system for text books is a scam but I don't have a better alternative in mind except perhaps a deemphisis of the use of text books . History is best taught as a story;a tale rather than droll factoids . I was lucky enough to have a few teachers who taught it that way and I was hooked for life .

[Wondergirl]

perhaps a deemphisis of the use of text books

Unfortunately, the students now who are headed for a career in education haven't been taught well. The students can't read or write or do math. Do we want them teaching the next generation of students?

[speechlesstx]

The fired RI teachers are being allowed to return to work... after agreeing to the district's expectations that led to the firings:

* School day extended by half hour (8a.m.- 3p.m.)
* Provide one hour weekly school tutoring for each student
* Stronger evaluation system
* Teachers will also have to interview with the school's new principal

In other words, I think the district expects them to teach and be held accountable.

[meyowgee]

Might I suggest that we change the school day to Mon through Thur for the kids for 10 hours a day. The teachers attend Mon -- Fri any child that is not up to par attends on Friday where the teacher in available with out distraction to work with the child who needs more help. If the teacher is good and her children are doing well Friday is an early out. This has a built in incentive to do well for both parties. A three day weekend every week. How would you react if you we're given the same chance. Secondly testing should be written only past third grade. This gives the teacher a better feel for what the children know.
Teacher's need to be tested and scored based on criteria such as student performance, knowledge and ability to preform. No more union job for life just like the real world you are bad and your gone.

[Wondergirl]

A three day weekend every week.

What will working parents do with their kids all day Friday?

testing should be written only past third grade

I was a teacher. The basics are taught from grades one through four. If there's no testing during these grades, teachers will have no idea of what their students know.

you are bad and your gone.

No. If you are bad, you are given a leg up on how to improve, are watched and tested and coached--so you can become a good teacher and not be thrown out like yesterday's trash. In fact, also go right to the college programs that train teachers and straighten them up. (P.S. It's "you're" = "you are gone," not "your gone.")

[meyowgee]

Sorry about the confusion testing as is K - 2nd is fine this is a time for skill building. By third grade a child should be able to form a sentence and prove he has a working knowledge of the subject matter.
Parent's will cope need be. My favorite day is Grandma day each week and my grandchild looks forward to it.
I've educated 3 children in both public and private systems. I have had to deal with good, great and poor teachers. I feel no one is even close to good
Till year 3. My problem is with the union protecting and paying a teacher that is so bad he no longer has a class. You know the guy who is running his internet business will he sits in any empty room because he can not be fired. I have been taxed to death for the children's sake for 30 years and I would pay more if I felt we the parent where not considered by the system as part of the problem.

[Wondergirl]

I feel no one is even close to good till year 3.

I taught preschool for three years. It was much harder to teach that age group than it was to teach seventh graders. (No, we didn't play all day, and even the play we did was a learning thing.) I had to spend a lot more time preparing lessons and activities beforehand, so I cannot imagine why you think "no one is even close to good till year 3." If it weren't for teachers before 4th grade, the students may as well stay home. They would have no foundation on which to build.

[Wondergirl]

Parent's will cope need be.

I'm not sure what that means. "Parents" doesn't get an apostrophe; it's not possessive.

Too many parents DON'T "cope." That is another place that needs help--the students' homes. Too many students don't get the parental support and overseeing they need. I don't mean help with homework, but just making sure the student does his homework and eats the right foods and gets to bed on time.

[meyowgee]

Sorry WonderGirl the point I was trying to make was The Teacher needs a least that many years to get good at her job. By the way 20 years with preschoolers as lead teacher and trainer is where I'm coming from. I have a great respect for teachers good ones. I spend lots of my own time preparing for that so called play. I also check on and guide the 4 other preschool teachers.

[meyowgee]

Helping parents cope is part of the job. Not judging is doing the job right.

[Wondergirl]

Sorry WonderGirl the point I was trying to make was The Teacher needs a least that many years to get good at her job. By the way 20 years with preschoolers as lead teacher and trainer is where I'm coming from. I have a great respect for teachers good ones. I spend lots of my own time preparing for that so called play. I also check on and guide the 4 other preschool teachers.

YOU are a teacher?

[meyowgee]

Point made

[Wondergirl]

point made

Yes, you certainly did (in ways you can't imagine)!

[tomder55]

you are bad and your gone.

No. If you are bad, you are given a leg up on how to improve, are watched and tested and coached--so you can become a good teacher and not be thrown out like yesterday's trash.

I have seen the tenure system in action . I know that under it quality teachers are also discarded before tenure kicks in for budgetary considerations that have nothing to do with the job the teacher did.

The system and the union is a joke. In NJ and here in NY the unions refused to even consider temporary pay freezes that probably would have lasted a year at most .School systems across both states were forced into massive layoffs as a result.

[Wondergirl]

No. If you are bad, you are given a leg up on how to improve, are watched and tested and coached--so you can become a good teacher and not be thrown out like yesterday's trash.

I have seen the tenure system in action . I know that under it quality teachers are also discarded before tenure kicks in for budgetary considerations that have nothing to do with the job the teacher did.

I am totally against tenure. I do believe a bad teacher should be given a chance to improve and be watched while appropriate retraining is done. Why the teacher is bad is very important. If the teacher is missing all sorts of vital pieces in his/her education, can't write a decent sentence, can't add or subtract, etc. and needs a lot of remedial work, then I believe that person should probably seek other employment. If, for instance, the teacher needs only classroom management skills, that can be taught and monitored and coached.

[tomder55]

If, for instance, the teacher needs only classroom management skills, that can be taught and monitored and coached.

Yes the teachers here constantly take refresher course in such mundane topics as part of their recertification process.

But I think we agree that the issue at hand is the children getting a quality education .
Classroom management is part of a good learning environment .However ;
I have also seen cases where administration is wed to arcane ideas on that and what motivates students . Again, good teachers get sacrificed on the alter of orthodoxy. It is often the administrators that need to update their skill sets .

[Wondergirl]

yes the teachers here constantly take refresher course in such mundane topics as part of their recertification process.

But I think we agree that the issue at hand is the children getting a quality education .
Classroom management is part of a good learning environment .However ;
I have also seen cases where administration is wed to arcane ideas on that and what motivates students . Again, good teachers get sacrificed on the alter of orthodoxy. It is often the administrators that need to update their skill sets .

It isn't mundane. Have you ever tried to manage a classroom of 35 kids, and the students are at every level from clueless to super-gifted? That's part of a quality education. And yes, the administrators have to know how to administer. Who's watching them? The board of education?