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jlisenbe · Jun 20, 2020, 04:02 PM

Still...no answer.

Well, granny, we'll just move on. 8D And by the way, I am a grandpa as of about 4 months ago. Baby due in November.

Wondergirl · Jun 20, 2020, 04:09 PM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Still...no answer.

Well, granny, we'll just move on. 8D And by the way, I am a grandpa as of about 4 months ago. Baby due in November.

Am not a granny. Congratulations to you!

My answer is, stop chewing on history. Let's fix this now, for your grandchild(ren).

jlisenbe · Jun 20, 2020, 04:16 PM

A better answer would be this. "Well by George, my theory failed when applied to the Great Depression or 1960, so I guess it's not a very good theory." It happens sometime.

So since poverty and unemployment are not really causes of out of wedlock births, what are your ideas for reducing them?

Wondergirl · Jun 20, 2020, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

better answer would be this.

So now the admin in you is reduced to lecturing me.

So since poverty and unemployment are not really causes of out of wedlock births, what are your ideas for reducing them?

I asked you first.

jlisenbe · Jun 20, 2020, 07:02 PM

Thank you for the congrats. We are looking forward to the "event".

So now the admin in you is reduced to lecturing me.

More like advising.

I asked you first.

I've answered twice. You didn't like my answers. You said they were not practical. Remember??

Wondergirl · Jun 20, 2020, 07:48 PM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

I've answered twice. You didn't like my answers. You said they were not practical. Remember??

Right. Practical, something beyond the obvious.

jlisenbe · Jun 20, 2020, 08:13 PM

Most of the time the obvious is obvious because it's what really needs to be done, so I'll stick with my original answer.

The great change has had nothing to do with poverty or unemployment. Social beliefs have changed. It used to be scandalous to be pregnant out of wedlock. Now it's celebrated and supported by federal subsidies. Families used to be a great deal more intact than they are now. We used to honor the teachings of the Bible. Now they are ridiculed. Marriage used to be held as valuable. Now it's just another institution waiting to be destroyed by the left. Men used to be responsible. Now the world is just there for our enjoyment and that includes women. There used to be some mystery about sex. Now it's just another activity in life. Movies used to be pretty clean. Now they are vulgar and crude. All of those factors have contributed, but the first four are primary.

talaniman · Jun 20, 2020, 09:15 PM

I get you JL, sad that nobody is listening to you. Don't know why that is but what worked for you didn't work for them. Must have been the shaming thing.

paraclete · Jun 20, 2020, 09:23 PM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Most of the time the obvious is obvious because it's what really needs to be done,

. Social beliefs have changed. It used to be scandalous to be pregnant out of wedlock. We used to honor the teachings of the Bible. Now they are ridiculed. Marriage used to be held as valuable. Now it's just another institution waiting to be destroyed by the left. Men used to be responsible. Now the world is just there for our enjoyment and that includes women. There used to be some mystery about sex. Now it's just another activity in life. Movies used to be pretty clean. Now they are vulgar and crude. All of those factors have contributed, .

let us examine this; Social beliefs have changed, why? I submit that two world wars undid the closely held beliefs. Too much suffering, too many unspeakable acts, too much trauma. People longed for freedom from the attitudes that bred these conflicts. In the first case; it was monarchy gone mad. In the second; it was ideology gone mad. The church was powerless to stop it and receded from relevance and into the vacuum came hedonism, love of self

talaniman · Jun 20, 2020, 09:43 PM

More like people being tired of being told what to do as the tellers did as they wanted. Church scandals didn't help, nor covering them up.

paraclete · Jun 20, 2020, 10:48 PM

No the Church scandals just added to the unbelief, people asked how could God allow this? a valid question

jlisenbe · Jun 21, 2020, 06:24 AM

The church was powerless to stop it and receded from relevance and into the vacuum came hedonism, love of self

That's an interesting observation. It is certainly true that the church had largely become powerless. The failure of the church to stand up for the right during the Civil Rights campaigns, particularly in the south, sapped it of strength. And certainly hedonism and love of self have been major contributors to the rising wave of out of wedlock births.

Out of wedlock births have also exploded in Australia. It's gone from 8% to nearly 35% and is only a few points less than what we have here. Church attendance is also very low. Fewer than 2 million attend church weekly.

https://yournotthefather.com/out-of-...hs-by-country/
https://mccrindle.com.au/insights/bl...a-infographic/

talaniman · Jun 21, 2020, 06:37 AM

Originally Posted by paraclete

No the Church scandals just added to the unbelief, people asked how could God allow this? a valid question

Even monolithic religions are not monoliths Clete, go down the road a bit its the same religion but a different sect, more akin to tribalism that we humans are so proud of. Every tribe claims some type of superiority putting it at odds over the customs and dogma of the other groups to ones they prefer. The bottom line is religion has failed us in a practical sense, being overwhelmed by the scope and size of the greater issues we face, even as governance is a failure to solve the economics of a crisis situation. A lack of confidence and disillusionment in what we have always relied on to get us through hard times.

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

That's an interesting observation. It is certainly true that the church had largely become powerless. The failure of the church to stand up for the right during the Civil Rights campaigns, particularly in the south, sapped it of strength. And certainly hedonism and love of self have been major contributors to the rising wave of out of wedlock births.

Out of wedlock births have also exploded in Australia. It's gone from 8% to nearly 35% and is only a few points less than what we have here. Church attendance is also very low. Fewer than 2 million attend church weekly.

https://yournotthefather.com/out-of-...hs-by-country/
https://mccrindle.com.au/insights/bl...a-infographic/

How has the church failed during the Civil Rights campaigns?

paraclete · Jun 21, 2020, 07:09 AM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

That's an interesting observation. It is certainly true that the church had largely become powerless. The failure of the church to stand up for the right during the Civil Rights campaigns, particularly in the south, sapped it of strength. And certainly hedonism and love of self have been major contributors to the rising wave of out of wedlock births.

Out of wedlock births have also exploded in Australia. It's gone from 8% to nearly 35% and is only a few points less than what we have here. Church attendance is also very low. Fewer than 2 million attend church weekly.

https://yournotthefather.com/out-of-...hs-by-country/
https://mccrindle.com.au/insights/bl...a-infographic/

Yes we are following you into godlessness

jlisenbe · Jun 21, 2020, 07:49 AM

How has the church failed during the Civil Rights campaigns?

Most of the church was silent during that time. We should have come down on the side of truth and right.

Yes we are following you into godlessness

Are you becoming a liberal? It's always someone else's fault. Truth is, you are walking side by side with us. Take some responsibility.

talaniman · Jun 21, 2020, 09:34 AM

Originally Posted by paraclete

Yes we are following you into godlessness

Is it the message, or the messengers?

talaniman · Jun 21, 2020, 09:41 AM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

Most of the church was silent during that time. We should have come down on the side of truth and right.

Which side is that?

Are you becoming a liberal? It's always someone else's fault. Truth is, you are walking side by side with us. Take some responsibility.

You should probably take some responsibility yourself for turning people off to the message. Bringing in a commandment breaker like the dufus sure didn't help your cause and one could say it made things worse.

jlisenbe · Jun 21, 2020, 12:35 PM

Which side is that?

Equal rights under law. The right to vote, for instance.

Bringing in a commandment breaker like the dufus

You can forget that. Obama, Biden, and Clinton are not glorious examples of righteousness. They all have their skeletons to hide. If there has been a more corrupt couple of pols than the two Clintons, I don't know who they are.

Athos · Jun 21, 2020, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by jlisenbe

If there has been a more corrupt couple of pols than the two Clintons, I don't know who they are.

Let me help you. Your boy Trump is ten times more corrupt than any two people on the planet. Take the blinders off.

talaniman · Jun 21, 2020, 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by Athos

Let me help you. Your boy Trump is ten times more corrupt than any two people on the planet. Take the blinders off.

Worth quoting, bolding, and repeating, while agreeing 100%, so go ahead JL, blame somebody else, while the dufus breaks laws and commandments, with his lying, cheating and stealing. And you wonder why nobody listen to you, and turns from your message with that kind of example?

It ain't the message, it's the messenger for sure. Take responsibility for it and stop blaming everybody else. You just can't can you?