[talaniman]

I am going to be positive and hope the American people drain the swamp of those feckless Dufus GOP sycophants.

[paraclete]

You are obviously a man of great faith, Tal, Like Tom you have faith in the system. I hope it is not misplaced but I think all you have is hoipe

[jlisenbe]

I am going to be positive and hope the American people drain the swamp of those feckless Dufus GOP sycophants.

As opposed to the feckless, Dufus democrat sycophants?

[talaniman]

Name one, and say WHY. You threw it out there so back it up. Me I hope for the best in November to get us on a better path, but for sure I'm planning on the worse. Repubs stay in power in all the branches of our government. The drunk on power Dufus needs to be checked.

[jlisenbe]

1. Mr. Obama.
Why? Lied about Benghazi so he could get reelected. Lied about keeping your doctor and policy under Obamacare. VA scandal for which NO ONE was ever held accountable. IRS scandal for which NO ONE was ever held accountable. Only two term president who never had a single quarter of GDP growth over 3%. Said Obmacare would result in lower insurance premiums... they went up instead. Fast and Furious gun running scandal for which, again, NO ONE was held accountable. The Obama administration paid ransom to Iran for hostages, and lied to the American people about it.

If you want to read some more, then go here. https://www.politifact.com/personali...yruling/false/

https://www.dailywire.com/news/10982...-aaron-bandler

I threw it out there, and I backed it up. The really astonishing thing is that you have been drinking the Kook Aid so long that you actually seem to believe that the dems are a bunch of high-character, well meaning philanthropists. Most politicians will say about anything to get reelected if they think they can get away with it.

[talaniman]

Obama is GONE, The Dufus is here and has Obama beat in one way at least... MORE LIES IN JUST TWO YEARS. My guy wasn't perfect, but your guy is off the chart bad already, so now it's my turn to blast your guy! You had your 8 years of fun blasting Obama! They're gone too.

MY TURN!

Do you really want a link to the Trump Scandals so far? Not wise to bring pebbles to a rock fight.

[jlisenbe]

This is tiresome. You asked for an example. "You threw it out there so back it up." So I back it up, and now you want to complain that Obama is gone. And your lame excuse is, "My guy wasn't perfect." That is the understatement of the decade.

Your link is a joke. Nothing there to see.

[paraclete]

This is tiresome.

You know you are right. Some people want to rehash the past thinking it was better, some people have blind hope in the present thinking this has to be better

[jlisenbe]

You know you are right. Some people want to rehash the past thinking it was better, some people have blind hope in the present thinking this has to be better.

Very true. But then we could rehash the past and try to learn from our mistakes so that our hope for the present would not be a blind hope.

[talaniman]

A closed mind learns nothing, and unwilling mind is STUCK on its own BS, and a slave to feelings devoid of facts.

[paraclete]

A closed mind learns nothing, and unwilling mind is STUCK on its own BS, and a slave to feelings devoid of facts.

Now you distilled the essence of politics

[talaniman]

Sometimes it helps to break things down to it's simplest terms to better understand what's really going on to identify the problem and hopefully get a solution. It appears we are still enthralled with the rich and powerful, so much so we sell ourselves cheap to what they want. I can certainly understand those that choose to listen, obey, and serve such a powerful entity, as the consequences are quite real and fearful, and overwhelming to some. Isn't that the problem though, being told by a rich guy how we should be governed?

[paraclete]

Sometimes it helps to break things down to it's simplest terms to better understand what's really going on to identify the problem and hopefully get a solution. It appears we are still enthralled with the rich and powerful, so much so we sell ourselves cheap to what they want. I can certainly understand those that choose to listen, obey, and serve such a powerful entity, as the consequences are quite real and fearful, and overwhelming to some. Isn't that the problem though, being told by a rich guy how we should be governed?

Ok we want to get into problem solving, so WHY?

[talaniman]

I think stopping the flow of money from donors to politicians would be a step in the right direction. Are you familiar with the citizens united ruling?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizens_United_v._FEC

As well as anonymous huge donations to lobbyist, corporate, and political groups supposedly from other countries that are passed on to politicians.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/nra-acc...ses-it-claims/

And

Employer Political Coercion: A Growing Threat

That would be a place to start. I don't know if you guys have such a problem but its a long growing one here.

[paraclete]

And

Employer Political Coercion: A Growing Threat

That would be a place to start. I don't know if you guys have such a problem but its a long growing one here.

No, we are actually a free country. You see we have compulserary voting so every one is politically savvy enough. It is a given there are things not disgussed in the work place and there are no massa-slave relationships. Our politics doesn't have the razzle dazzle yours does

we have other ways of changing unsuccessful leaders

https://www.news.com.au/national/pol...18c75be87616a8

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-2...eting/10146280

[talaniman]

The smaller party system that must form coalition and cooperate, melding different agendas to govern has always been a fascination, but I doubt compulsory voting would go over very well here. Then there is that money thing hanging over everyone's head every few years. You can never be free serving that agenda. It's in too few hands, and who wants it to freely circulate?

Supply siders surely don't since they would have no more leverage to control wages or opportunities... or the flow of capital. Nor kill the competition with a bigger stick.

[paraclete]

Well I'm glad you are fascinated, we live with a different form of political turmoil here and until there is some blood letting or an execution it is going to go on. What it says is we might be getting close to a change in government election time. Rearranging the deck chairs on the titanic. The not so faceless men are working on an Ides of March scenario

[jlisenbe]

No, we are actually a free country. You see we have compulserary voting

Can you see the massive contradiction in those two statements?

[paraclete]

Can you see the massive contradiction in those two statements?

Not at all, we feel the best expression of democracy is to canvas the will of all the people. Now I know you would criticise that view from within your constitutional republic but the reality is you don't live in a democracy, you live by the will of people who long since left this Earth. There is a difference between freedom and liberty. We can of course not vote and be penalised in some small way but our ethos demands that those elected have the support of all the people, not just the few who can be bothered

[jlisenbe]

I'll paraphrase your statement: "We are so free that the government forces everyone to go vote no matter what those people might prefer to do." Wow. What a statement of freedom.

those elected have the support of all the people

Except, of course, for the people who voted in favor of the guy who did not get elected.

you live by the will of people who long since left this Earth.

So you mean that your country has no constitution, or no written rule of law as to how the country is to be governed?

How are freedom and liberty different?