[speechlesstx]

Yeah, well make sense with it. Meanwhile, Obama's home town paper and cheerleader dumped on him pretty good - and in the process sounded much like me.

President Barack Obama's signature accomplishment is teetering. The Obamacare website is a national punch line. Millions of Americans, repeatedly reassured by Obama that they could keep their doctors and health plans, are discovering that they can't. Their insurance policies are being canceled. The price of new coverage is substantially higher. The new coverage may force them to choose new doctors. And the law says they have to buy insurance or pay a fine.

People are deeply concerned, and for good reason. This is, as Democratic Sen. Max Baucus famously predicted seven months ago, a "train wreck."

...

Much of the focus in Washington has been on the political consequences of the Obamacare disaster, whether Democrats are vulnerable and Republicans can take advantage.

No surprise there. Democratic leaders forced the law through Congress without a single Republican vote. The architects of Obamacare brushed aside sharp warnings from tech wizards that the computer system wasn't tested and ready. They piled hundreds of pages of last-minute regulations on insurers. They forced insurers to cancel policies by the thousands because those policies fell short of the soup-to-nuts coverage required by the law.

The American public is having a credibility-shattering debate about the president: Did he not bother to learn the details of the law before he told us we could keep our doctors and our insurance, or did he know the truth and flat-out lie?

Political consequences from the early failure of Obamacare are likely. But far more important are the personal consequences for American consumers.

There are early indications that many young and healthy people are opting not to buy insurance. There are two likely reasons: It's nearly impossible for anyone to sign up, and the cost is prohibitive for people who have modest incomes but don't qualify for subsidies.

If this continues, you'll hear the phrase "death spiral" more and more. That's the term insurance execs use to describe what will happen if young and relatively healthy people don't pay into the system while older people with greater health care needs sign up. If that happens, increased costs will vastly outstrip increased revenues, putting enormous financial pressure on the whole scheme.
...

An essential first step: Accept that government doesn't know what's best for everyone. That people can decide what coverage they need and can afford. A strong marketplace offers choices for every wallet. Obamacare's rules curtail those choices. Why, for instance, should only people under age 30 be eligible to purchase lower-cost "catastrophic" insurance? Pinching Americans' coverage choices is one big reason this law doesn't work.

Republicans will have to be constructive. They've talked "repeal and replace," but the public has no idea what they would offer as a replacement.

Democrats will have to avoid being defensive. It was a mistake to attempt such a massive government intrusion on a marketplace and a mistake to do so without anything close to a public consensus.

Damn that all sounds familiar.

[talaniman]

Republicans will have to be constructive. They've talked "repeal and replace," but the public has no idea what they would offer as a replacement.

SOS as before more than likely. Quoting a philandering drunk hurts your credibility. So what if he is a democratic senator.

[speechlesstx]

And that's all you got out of that?

[tomder55]

if the public has no idea what the Republicans would offer as replacement it's because they haven't paid attention ,and idiots like those in the Chi-town Rag editorial board have not offered to examine them or dismissed them without serious consideration.

[speechlesstx]

if the public has no idea what the Republicans would offer as replacement it's because they haven't paid attention ,and idiots like those in the Chi-town Rag editorial board have not offered to examine them or dismissed them without serious consideration.

Well hey, it took them this long to look into what the emperor has been saying for all these years.

[excon]

Hello again, tom:

if the public has no idea what the Republicans would offer as replacement it's because they haven't paid attention

I pay attention.. Lemme see if I can name 'em. Tort reform, buying insurance across state lines, health savings accounts, and.. and.....

Am I forgetting something?

excon

[talaniman]

if the public has no idea what the Republicans would offer as replacement it's because they haven't paid attention ,and idiots like those in the Chi-town Rag editorial board have not offered to examine them or dismissed them without serious consideration.

What if we read it and rejected it after serious consideration? Like your jobs plan, keep the Bush tax cuts and add more cuts to them, and let the money trickle down to everyone else.

[tomder55]

Hello again, tom:
I pay attention.. Lemme see if I can name 'em. Tort reform, buying insurance across state lines, health savings accounts, and.. and.....

Am I forgetting something?

excon

yup those were just some of the things I mentioned

[tomder55]

Here are a few that was introduced before Obamacare :
10 Steps to Transform Health Care - Issue Statements - United States Senator Mike Enzi
Dr. Coburn, colleagues introduce "Every American Insured Health Act" - Press Releases - Tom Coburn, M.D., United States Senator from Oklahoma
Fixed Tax Credits | U.S. Health Policy Gateway
Healthy Americans Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://www.coburn.senate.gov/public/...6-fc195a833884
Individual Pay or Play | U.S. Health Policy Gateway
http://tomprice.house.gov/sites/tomp...%20Section.pdf
Health Status Insurance | U.S. Health Policy Gateway
there are others ,but why should I post any more ? You won't read these and will dismiss them out of hand because they don't offer nanny state universal insurance .

[talaniman]

Most of what I read is in the ACA, so some serious consideration was made of republican proposals. The problem is once you got your amendments you still voted no.

Republican Ideas Included in the President's Proposal | The White House

Throughout the debate on health insurance reform, Republican concepts and proposals have been included in legislation. In fact, hundreds of Republican amendments were adopted during the committee mark-up process. As a result, both the Senate and the House passed key Republican proposals that are incorporated into the President's Proposal.

Be sure to read the whole thing.

[Tuttyd]

Tired horses or no horses is sure a funny way of putting it when the facts show that not only are there no horses to do anything this system as it has been created (Obamacare) ends up pulling the horses along with everything else.

Lets not forget that this system was designed by the very system it was suppose to regulate and it represents a huge boon for insurance companies as well as more levels for the government to be directly involved in your life by way of law.

I guess the reason I chose this analogy was because of the expectation that your health care system would have evolved over time to something that is equitable, or something that is a reasonable approximation.It would also seem to me that the drastic measures being implemented at the moment are a direct result of inequality

edit.

[Reinvented25]

My insurance premiums went down $23.92 for the year (about a buck a pay check).

My main OTC supplements are covered 100% instead of 0%, saving me around $60/month.

I now have the option to get rid of deductibles in exchange for 0% coverage out of network.

Seems Obamacare isn't hurting everyone. I find it funny that I just so happen to work for a rather liberal tech company whose CEO supported Barack.

Those of you getting hurt by your employer... Which way did your CEO/whatever vote in 2008?

[tomder55]

removed comment

[J_9]

My insurance premiums went down $23.92 for the year (about a buck a pay check).

My main OTC supplements are covered 100% instead of 0%, saving me around $60/month.

I now have the option to get rid of deductibles in exchange for 0% coverage out of network.

Seems Obamacare isn't hurting everyone. I find it funny that I just so happen to work for a rather liberal tech company whose CEO supported Barack.

Those of you getting hurt by your employer... Which way did your CEO/whatever vote in 2008?

I think I just threw up a little in my mouth. So far from the truth.

[speechlesstx]

Mine is changing, I have no details on the changes but my bet is it's not going to be good.

[J_9]

No, it's not going to be good. If yours is anything like mine your deductibles will increase, your premiums will increase and your coverage will decrease.

[excon]

Hello J:

I think I just threw up a little in my mouth. So far from the truth.

So, you don't think ANYBODY is saving money on the exchanges????

Well, of course they are. You shouldn't BELIEVE everything you hear from Hannity...

As Hannity called on each of them, the guests recounted their “Obamacare” horror stories: canceled policies, premium hikes, restrictions on the freedom to see a doctor of their choice, financial burdens upon their small businesses and so on.

“These are the stories that the media refuses to cover,” Hannity interjected.

But none of it smelled right to me. Nothing these folks were saying jibed with the basic facts of the Affordable Care Act as I understand them. I understand them fairly well; I have worked as a senior adviser to a governor and helped him deal with the new federal rules.

I decided to hit the pavement. I tracked down Hannity’s guests, one by one, and did my own telephone interviews with them.

First I spoke with Paul Cox of Leicester, N.C. He and his wife Michelle had lamented to Hannity that because of Obamacare, they can’t grow their construction business and they have kept their employees below a certain number of hours, so that they are part-timers.

Obamacare has no effect on businesses with 49 employees or less. But in our brief conversation on the phone, Paul revealed that he has only four employees. Why the cutback on his workforce? “Well,” he said, “I haven’t been forced to do so, it’s just that I’ve chosen to do so. I have to deal with increased costs.” What costs? And how, I asked him, is any of it due to Obamacare? There was a long pause, after which he said he’d call me back. He never did.

There is only one Obamacare requirement that applies to a company of this size: workers must be notified of the existence of the “healthcare.gov” website, the insurance exchange. That’s all.

Next I called Allison Denijs. She’d told Hannity that she pays over $13,000 a year in premiums. Like the other guests, she said she had recently gotten a letter from Blue Cross saying that her policy was being terminated and a new, ACA-compliant policy would take its place. She says this shows that Obama lied when he promised Americans that we could keep our existing policies.

Allison’s husband left his job a few years ago, one with benefits at a big company, to start his own business. Since then they’ve been buying insurance on the open market, and are now paying around $1,100 a month for a policy with a $2,500 deductible per family member, with hefty annual premium hikes. One of their two children is not covered under the policy. She has a preexisting condition that would require purchasing additional coverage for $600 a month, which would bring the family’s grand total to around $20,000 a year.

I asked Allison if she’d shopped on the exchange, to see what a plan might cost under the new law. She said she hadn’t done so because she’d heard the website was not working. Would she try it out when it’s up and running? Perhaps, she said. She told me she has long opposed Obamacare, and that the president should have focused on tort reform as a solution to bringing down the price of healthcare.

I tried an experiment and shopped on the exchange for Allison and Kurt. Assuming they don’t smoke and have a household income too high to be eligible for subsidies, I found that they would be able to get a plan for around $7,600, which would include coverage for their uninsured daughter. This would be about a 60 percent reduction from what they would have to pay on the pre-Obamacare market.

excon

[tomder55]

My insurance premiums went down $23.92 for the year (about a buck a pay check).

My main OTC supplements are covered 100% instead of 0%, saving me around $60/month.

I now have the option to get rid of deductibles in exchange for 0% coverage out of network.

Seems Obamacare isn't hurting everyone. I find it funny that I just so happen to work for a rather liberal tech company whose CEO supported Barack.

Those of you getting hurt by your employer... Which way did your CEO/whatever vote in 2008?

so in other words you work for a company that isn't affected because the employer mandate doesn't kick in this year .

[speechlesstx]

No, it's not going to be good. If yours is anything like mine your deductibles will increase, your premiums will increase and your coverage will decrease.

But, but, it will be more "comprehensive." I'll get free contraceptives.

[J_9]

Exy, I'm sorry, but I don't read your rhetoric. I believe in what I see firsthand. Your quotes and links don't do it for me. I live the life, I don't read the news. I don't have to. I live it. I see it. I experience it.

I've given you some first hand knowledge, you can only give me what you see in the news. If you give me some first hand knowledge maybe you could change my mind.