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michelle001 · Oct 17, 2013, 05:47 AM

I feel my FMLA rights are not being provided to me. My employer recently outsourced our FMLA rights to a 3rd party. I have a chronic condition that is secondary to breast cancer. I have provided so much paperwork and for the 1st time I have had disciplinary action taken and my pay docked. In the 9 years I've been with company I've never been denied paid sick leave nor been on disciplinary action.

I've seen this new FMLA admin cover days and then take them away as if I never requested coverage. In the past I had an issue where our medical dept faxed a letter to my Dr mentioning dates that were already covered.

Due to all the stress I've dealt with (not only the daily pain that I am in from so many surgeries) I've recently been dx with bells palsy that is stress induced. The only stress that I am dealing with is the stress of trying to make sure that I FMLA protect the days I am unable to work because of my chronic pain.

Any advice, info or education would be appreciated.

smoothy · Oct 17, 2013, 09:08 AM

You can't just unilaterally decide to take FMLA leave and expect it to be granted... its has to meet all the legal requirements. And even then once you use up all your sick leave... and vacation time... it will be all be unpaid time off. And generally you are expected to ne 100% ready to do your full workload after returning.

You can start by telling us under what grounds they denied it.

michelle001 · Oct 17, 2013, 11:11 AM

I've never had an issue with my intermittent leaves in the past. I do meet all the legal requirements for FMLA protection and I do expect to have the 12 weeks that are state mandated covered.

They denied my claim stating I did not provide sufficient paperwork when I have. My dr's have been providing the same info to my employer for years.

I get more confused each time I call the outsourced FMLA people. They give me different info for same questions. They consider PSL and STD the same thing... when I KNOW the definition of each is completely different. I'm not disabled and can perform my job duties when my pain subsides.

I think I'm just going to have to get legal counsel... take all papers and let an Attny in my state determine if this is harassment. I wish I had the funds to just get an attny and give them POA to deal with all of this. This would then allow me to do my job (which I love) and if out sick due to my chronic pain, I could just work on getting better and get back to work sooner.

I have enough appointments that are required by my medical team and it sucks to have to make more appts for FMLA paperwork. I've asked repeatedly to have my Dr contact their DR's... one person from the FMLA dept told me they have nurses and Dr's there and another said they don't.

When I call the FMLA dept, my head spins from all the info they want and advice they've provided of what to do.

I feel that if I've proven my chronic condition... I should be granted the 12 weeks mandated by the state. If I surpass that time... then my employer can take whatever action is needed. Since the outsourcing, I've missed more work than usual. Stress is the main trigger of my chronic pain and this FMLA outsourced company has definitely caused me more stress resulting in me now having bells palsy.

Thanks for the response. (Still trying to get the hang of this website and what it offers)

ScottGem · Oct 17, 2013, 12:27 PM

Sounds like this 3rd party was hired to reduce company FMLA costs so they are giving you a hard time about it. Have you discussed this with your HR people?

smoothy · Oct 17, 2013, 12:33 PM

I'm assuming you already know these like the back of your hand... it sounds like you've done the research.

http://www.dol.gov/compliance/laws/comp-fmla.htm

But here they are if you haven't. Right from the Dept of Labor.

Also... job protection only applies DURING the FMLA period while you are out... but they can fire you anytime after you return and its fair game. Meaning you don't have a leg to stand on. I know people through my wife this has happened to.

michelle001 · Oct 17, 2013, 12:48 PM

Originally Posted by ScottGem

Sounds like this 3rd party was hired to reduce company FMLA costs so they are giving you a hard time about it. Have you discussed this with your HR people?

I have contacted HR, they tell me to contact 3rd party and 3rd party says contact HR...

I just feel like I've battled breast cancer for past 11 years and am losing steam trying to battle out for my FMLA. I want to thank both of you for the replies... and you are right, they can fire me for any reason... accept, they are actively hiring and I have impeccable reviews. So if I were to be fired I think it would be obvious. I have a consultation with an atty and will pay the $85.00 fee just for my own piece of mind on the issue and see what I can do to stop future issues... I need my job and in this Obama economy (Lol), I know there won't be another to fall back on.

I'm not a lazy person nor do I just want to sit at home and get paid for nothing. (Unless its lottery money or something)

I just feel like something is not right in what this outsourced agency is doing. Its probably the few that have abused the system that make it harder for us that truly have chronic conditions and really want to work and not have any taxpayers paying my bills through disability. Not that its not there for those that need it. I just think I'm too young to give up on working for a living. (39) I want to have my 401k and pension benefits when I retire and would love to put another 30 years into this company that I work for and retire properly. Ya know?

smoothy · Oct 17, 2013, 12:52 PM

If you are an AT-WILL employee... don't make the mistake of assuming they need a reason to fire you. There are very few times they would really need a reason at all... usually in conjuntion with a sexual harassment suit... or anything that's EEOC related... almost any other time... impecable reviews or not... they could just say we don't need you any more.

I assume you aren't in a union or have a labor contract.

What's right isn't always hand in hand with what's legal.

So be careful.....which I get the feeling you are doing already.

michelle001 · Oct 17, 2013, 01:05 PM

Originally Posted by smoothy

If you are an AT-WILL employee... don't make the mistake of assuming they need a reason to fire you. There are very few times they would really need a reason at all... usually in conjuntion with a sexual harassment suit... or anything that's EEOC related... almost any other time... impecable reviews or not... they could just say we don't need you any more.

I assume you aren't in a union or have a labor contract.

What's right isn't always hand in hand with what's legal.

So be careful.....which I get the feeling you are doing already.

Thanks so much. I am in a 'right to work" state. So you are 100% correct. I do feel a little better just getting some of this off my chest (pun intended)

I'll update you to let you know if the Atty makes me a bajillionaire... Lol, not really what I'm looking for. Y'all are awesome!

joypulv · Oct 17, 2013, 01:10 PM

You work for a company that PAYS for 12 weeks sick time per year?
That's not a FMLA requirement.

michelle001 · Oct 17, 2013, 01:17 PM

Originally Posted by joypulv

You work for a company that PAYS for 12 weeks sick time per year?
That's not a FMLA requirement.

yes.. we get a TON of PSL it doesn't roll over it renews with each year of service. When I was out years ago to have my double mastectomy, I did not have that much PSL. I had to suck it up, not get paid and pay out of pocket to keep my insurance benefits. It was a struggle, but we got through it... I know that FMLA is no guarantee of pay, but if I have it, why would it be denied for the 1st time ever (after 3rd party came on board)?

michelle001 · Oct 17, 2013, 01:21 PM

Originally Posted by michelle001

yes.. we get a TON of PSL it doesn't roll over it renews with each year of service. When I was out years ago to have my double mastectomy, I did not have that much PSL. I had to suck it up, not get paid and pay out of pocket to keep my insurance benefits. It was a struggle, but we got through it... I know that FMLA is no guarantee of pay, but if I have it, why would it be denied for the 1st time ever (after 3rd party came on board)?

.. I don't have the chart in front of me, but each year you get more PSL.. :. Separate from vacation and other types of paid benefits.

One day I could accrue 365 days of PSL.

Like I said... love my job... the FMLA admin, not so much.

joypulv · Oct 17, 2013, 01:36 PM

If PSL starts anew each year, how could you accrue 365 days? Just by working there 50 years?
When you say that you know that FMLA is no guarantee of pay, but "if I have it," what do you mean by if I have it? Do you mean written company policy that you have not used all your days for 2013? And how does this mesh with your first sentence about your FMLA rights? Do you mean company sick time policy, not FMLA?

(I'm not trying to pick on you.)

ScottGem · Oct 17, 2013, 01:37 PM

Originally Posted by michelle001

why would it be denied for the 1st time ever (after 3rd party came on board)?

Because, as I said earlier, the 3rd party was charged with reducing the cost of the program.

I think there is a miscommunication here. FMLA is a federal law that applies to companies of a certain size that requires them to allow employees to take an unpaid leave for approved types of leave. There is nothing to administer there and I don't quite understand why a third party would be involved.

On the other hand, your company allows you to accrue a large bank of paid sick leave. This could be considered part of a short term disability plan that might require approval before they pay you.

michelle001 · Oct 17, 2013, 01:46 PM

Originally Posted by joypulv

If PSL starts anew each year, how could you accrue 365 days? Just by working there 50 years?
When you say that you know that FMLA is no guarantee of pay, but "if I have it," what do you mean by if I have it? Do you mean written company policy that you have not used all your days for 2013? And how does this mesh with your first sentence about your FMLA rights? Do you mean company sick time policy, not FMLA?

(I'm not trying to pick on you.)

I don't think your picking on me. It is separate from the FMLA.. and we get PSL from company. There is more to this story than can be communicated via blog.

Each year of service, they add (roughly) 20 more days to your PSL. So year 1 you start with 10 year 2 regardless of how many days you used previously, you get 30 days...

I never knew anything about FMLA until I started with this co. They do shove it down your throat and tell you if your out you need to protect it.

And lastly, I have not used all of my time, not even 1/2 and it'll start anew in Jan.

ScottGem · Oct 17, 2013, 01:50 PM

Originally Posted by michelle001

They do shove it down your throat and tell you if your out you need to protect it.

And lastly, I have not used all of my time, not even 1/2 and it'll start anew in Jan.

Again this doesn't make a lot of sense. it’s a government mandated program and the only cost to the employer is the loss of the employee's productivity during the absence. But they could hire temp help during that time. That's why I think this 3rd party is charged more with the company's STD plans.

michelle001 · Oct 17, 2013, 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by ScottGem

Because, as I said earlier, the 3rd party was charged with reducing the cost of the program.

I think there is a miscommunication here. FMLA is a federal law that applies to companies of a certain size that requires them to allow employees to take an unpaid leave for approved types of leave. There is nothing to administer there and I don't quite understand why a third party would be involved.

On the other hand, your company allows you to accrue a large bank of paid sick leave. This could be considered part of a short term disability plan that might require approval before they pay you.

That makes sense Scott. You may have hit the nail on the head. I'll get with that attorney and see if they feel I have been harassed or discriminated against.

And with that said, this is the 1st time I've been denied pay for being out sick... sooooo. Now when I ask the outsourced co, they tell me its my co policy and when I call HR, they say the outsource people need to explain.

joypulv · Oct 17, 2013, 01:57 PM

You are entitled to a copy of company policy.
Perhaps it has changed. A lot has changed since 2008, and now we have Obamacare just starting.
If you want to pay a fee to a lawyer, go ahead, but I think you are wasting your money.
At least review company policy first. A lawyer will just charge you to do it for you.

michelle001 · Oct 17, 2013, 01:57 PM

Originally Posted by ScottGem

Again this doesn't make a lot of sense. it’s a government mandated program and the only cost to the employer is the loss of the employee's productivity during the absence. But they could hire temp help during that time. That's why I think this 3rd party is charged more with the company's STD plans.

I completely agree. STD is completely different than PSL, but both parties are stating they are same thing. Just craziness! The co I work for is huge and yes they may lose productivity when I'm out, but I sure do make up for it when I return by being one of the top producers and impeccable quality. There is so much more I wish I could share... just don't want to be too specific and have actions against me. Lol