[mbyrne230]

My 20 year old son lost his temper with me yesterday. We were having an argument. I was giving out to him. He shouted at me, kicked a chair and the wall. I was so shocked. After things calmed down I asked him what happened and he had no answer for me. He said he just lost control and had been feeling tense because I have been bad tempered lately (I have exams coming up). Does not excuse his behaviour in my opinion. We all went to work and college today and this evening, when his Dad asked him again about it he still could not explain his loss of control. He would never do anything like this to his Dad but because I'm physically weaker he felt safe to lose control with me. His Dad sent him to his room and wants to punish him by cancelling a treat he was looking forward to. I think we should talk it out but to be honest I feel uncomfortable being in the same room with him since this happened. What should I do or say and how can we talk about it if he can't give us a reason for losing control like that?

[Oliver2011]

"His Dad sent him to his room and wants to punish him by cancelling a treat he was looking forward to."

You said he was 20 right, not 8? You all need to talk this through as adults. He gave you a good insight as in "feeling tense because I have been bad tempered lately". Young adults struggle with giving insights into why they behave the way they do. So open up with that and take some responsibility for your involvement in the whole ordeal. Also convey to him that you want to be able to discuss difficult subjects with him along with a fun subjects.

You won't be excusing his behavior. The end plan is for him not to blow up again, so working through this with him, discussing as adults, and not using petty punishments is the way to go.

[Cat1864]

mbyrne230 (1 Posts) Asked Today, 02:17 PM — 0 Views
My 20 year old son lost his temper with me yesterday. We were having an argument. I was giving out to him. He shouted at me, kicked a chair and the wall. I was so shocked. After things calmed down I asked him what happened and he had no answer for me. He said he just lost control and had been feeling tense because I have been bad tempered lately (I have exams coming up). Does not excuse his behaviour in my opinion. We all went to work and college today and this evening, when his Dad asked him again about it he still could not explain his loss of control. He would never do anything like this to his Dad but because I'm physically weaker he felt safe to lose control with me. His Dad sent him to his room and wants to punish him by cancelling a treat he was looking forward to. I think we should talk it out but to be honest I feel uncomfortable being in the same room with him since this happened. What should I do or say and how can we talk about it if he can't give us a reason for losing control like that?

This isn't to place blame, but to get you to think about how both of you made mistakes.

What responsibility are you taking for his outburst? It seems to me that neither of you are innocent in this incident.

Did he try walking away before he exploded? Did you make him stay?

You were 'giving out to him' which I have to guess means you were not on your best behavior and he was giving it back until he got so frustrated he acted out like a child. The same child you and your husband seem to see him as. Sending him to his room and withholding a 'treat'? Isn't that how you discipline a five year old?

You are correct that you do need to sit down and talk. You need to treat him like an adult discuss what you can both do to get some of the tension out of the house. How long have you been taking your frustrations out on your family (namely your son)? How long have they been walking on eggshells and holding in their own frustrations until something has to give?

Are you really a victim of his temper or your own?

[mbyrne230]

"His Dad sent him to his room and wants to punish him by cancelling a treat he was looking forward to."

You said he was 20 right, not 8? You all need to talk this through as adults. He gave you a good insight as in "feeling tense because I have been bad tempered lately". Young adults struggle with giving insights into why they behave the way they do. So open up with that and take some responsibility for your involvement in the whole ordeal. Also convey to him that you want to be able to discuss difficult subjects with him along with a fun subjects.

You won't be excusing his behavior. The end plan is for him not to blow up again, so working through this with him, discussing as adults, and not using petty punishments is the way to go.

Hi Oliver, thanks for replying to me. Yes I have been very tense for the last couple of weeks and have been taking it out on my son. Last night when we had a chat I apologised to him for been bad tempered and he apologised for losing his temper. So things are a bit better now. I'm just worried at the loss of control. We had another chat just now and he said he's happy to sacrifice any treat to make it up to me but having read your reply I realise we have been treating him like a child so I said that's not what I want. I just need him to talk to me if I or anything at all is upsetting him so as not to let things get to that level of tension again. Unfortunately I hadn't realised how tense I was or how I was taking it out on him. Hopefully things will improve now that we are communicating better. Thanks again for your help.

[Oliver2011]

Hi Oliver, thanks for replying to me. Yes I have been very tense for the last couple of weeks and have been taking it out on my son. Last night when we had a chat I apologised to him for been bad tempered and he apologised for losing his temper. So things are a bit better now. I'm just worried at the loss of control. We had another chat just now and he said he's happy to sacrifice any treat to make it up to me but having read your reply I realise we have been treating him like a child so I said that's not what I want. I just need him to talk to me if I or anything at all is upsetting him so as not to let things get to that level of tension again. Unfortunately I hadn't realised how tense I was or how I was taking it out on him. Hopefully things will improve now that we are communicating better. Thanks again for your help.

You're welcome. Good luck to you and your family.

[mbyrne230]

This isn't to place blame, but to get you to think about how both of you made mistakes.

What responsibility are you taking for his outburst? It seems to me that neither of you are innocent in this incident.

Did he try walking away before he exploded? Did you make him stay?

You were 'giving out to him' which I have to guess means you were not on your best behavior and he was giving it back until he got so frustrated he acted out like a child. The same child you and your husband seem to see him as. Sending him to his room and withholding a 'treat'? Isn't that how you discipline a five year old?

You are correct that you do need to sit down and talk. You need to treat him like an adult discuss what you can both do to get some of the tension out of the house. How long have you been taking your frustrations out on your family (namely your son)? How long have they been walking on eggshells and holding in their own frustrations until something has to give?

Are you really a victim of his temper or your own?

Hi Cat, thanks for replying to me. No, he didn't try walking away and no, I did not make him stay.

You asked how long have I been tense and making my family walk around on eggshells. About two weeks.

And you asked me what responsibility am I taking for the outburst. Well when he told me he lost his temper because I have been tense and bad tempered over the last two weeks, I apologised and asked him to tell me in future if he feels things are getting tense.

I've discussed the reasons for my tensions with my husband (a bad situation in work) and we're taking steps to sort it out.

Thanks again for your reply.

[mbyrne230]

Hello, I was wondering if someone could help me with my son.

He is 21 but has the emotional maturity of a 17/18 year old. He is bright but has ADD. With our help (my husband and I) and a lot of hard work on his part, he got through school, learned how to mix well with people, got great marks and got into a good college.

After going through some tough times, he's now very happy and deserves to be. He has lots of friends, is loyal, a great listener and always knows what to say to people when they are worried or upset.

The problem is, he lies and has done for years. When he was younger we would confiscate his things and send him to his room but now we try and sit down with him and talk about it.

We have always told him he can talk to us about anything and he knows this and does. Yet still, if it is more convenient for him to lie, then he will.

It was always only small things like lying about doing his chores but yesterday it got more serious and I don't know what to do.

He took my phone charger and replaced it with his own broken one because he didn't want to pay for a new one. It was obvious he wanted it to look like mine was the broken one. He knew if he told us he had damaged his own charger, we would tell him he had to replace it with his own money, or do without it.

He blamed his younger brother at first and only when my husband said it was serious and I needed my phone for work did he admit that he had my charger.

He still insists he was just borrowing my charger and won't admit to trying to pass off his broken one as mine. This was last night and I didn't want to talk to him about it when I was so upset.

I told him I was disappointed and would never even borrow anything of his without asking him. As for actually taking my charger, I told him I would discuss it with him in the morning. I feel like we're doing all the right things and being good parents but we must be doing something wrong. His younger brother is very honest and hates lying.

What does anyone think? Should I be worried? Please advise what should I say to him when we discuss it.

[JudyKayTee]

"We have always told him he can talk to us about anything and he knows this and does"

I don't think this is a correct perception.

When you catch him lying do you tell him so? Apparently he still lives at home, isn't out on his own - ?

Yes, I'd be worried. Little lies turn into big lies. Does he know that the little lies are causing you to doubt what he tells you, are causing you to lose trust?

[joypulv]

Children lie. It's one way they learn what the limits of their power is. It isn't easy for parents to treat lying with just the right amount of calm and reprimand. In the ideal world, they give a gentle lesson and gradually the child learns. 'Not me' is the universal lie, or 'He did it.' If a parent overdoes the punishments, the lying can just get worse. I'm not saying that you did that at all! Besides, you have a younger son who doesn't lie.

But I just don't see this story as earth shaking, although it is immature. 21 isn't that far from the maturity level of 18, depending on the situation, and it sounds like he still lives with you. That means he hasn't had to face all that goes with living on his own, a huge leap into a certain amount of reality. People his age attach an almost fanatic importance to their phones (impossible for me to comprehend at my senior age).

What to do? I see you doing fine. Have your talk, be disappointed. Tell him that it's time for him to be on his own. That puts responsibility for his actions in the same ballpark as being responsible for his own existence.

[joypulv]

Reading merged threads reveals that you and he commute to the same college? That makes living at home a good money saver. But any college student living at home needs to start discussing moving out as soon as he graduates.
Plus it appears that he is just 21, so even closer to 18!
And with a younger brother, he might lie out of desperation to be ahead of him. He knows the ADD makes being a good student difficult.
Not saying you should coddle him. I still think you are a good parent.

[mbyrne230]

Reading merged threads reveals that you and he commute to the same college? That makes living at home a good money saver. But any college student living at home needs to start discussing moving out as soon as he graduates.
Plus it appears that he is just 21, so even closer to 18!
And with a younger brother, he might lie out of desperation to be ahead of him. He knows the ADD makes being a good student difficult.
Not saying you should coddle him. I still think you are a good parent.

Hi Joypuly, thank you for answering. I'm sorry I should have said before that he also has a mild degree of Asperger's syndrome. I'm not in the habit of mentioning it. When he was diagnosed the consultant said it was so mild he didn't want to put that label on him and we never have.

He needed a special needs assistant in secondary school because he was so disorganised. I could only get him organised out the door and to the school gates. After that he needed the s. n. a. in school. He was ostracised by the other kids. They were never mean upfront but he was always left out. It was very hard on him but we got him through it, encouraged him to work hard and get good grades so he could 'escape' and as I said, he did and is now very happy in college, mixes well and has loads of friends.

A thoughtless but well meaning teacher opined that he would probably never feel empathy in the way 'normal' people do. A huge generalisation which still angers me years later and one my husband and I never believed of him.

I don't know enough about ADD or Asperger's to know but one thing that worries me about the lying is the fact that the feelings of wanting to put things right after being caught out never seem to run very deep. It's almost like the remorse is only on the surface. Would that gel with ADD or Asperger's? Could that be a lack of empathy in spite of the empathy he has frequently shown me and others?

I'm sorry. I know I'm making a big deal of this when there are some parents of adult children on this site going through so much worse. I'm just trying to avoid something similar and I've gotten into the habit of looking ten years ahead with my son to avoid the pitfalls.

Oh I nearly forgot to mention as well, he will be moving out for a year as he is going abroad to study as part of his degree. He's very excited about it and looking forward to it. I think it will be a fantastic experience for him. As you said it's probably time for him to branch out.

Thanks again and any more advice you can give me would be appreciated.

[joypulv]

There is a regular responder here who is married to an 'Aspie' as she calls it. She talks about him pretty openly (and affectionately). I'm not sure how many people where he works even know, probably a lot like your son. I think he asked her to marry him on their first date. I think they have always slept in separate beds. Little endearing things. I suppose you could be right about the lying theory, and it's true that those who have more obvious attributes don't have that connection with even their closest family members, but I don't know if I would read too much into this. I can't remember how much lying I and my siblings did but we did, and I even went through a shoplifting stage, which is a form of lying. Despite being top of my class and mostly a goody goody.

[Wondergirl]

There is a regular responder here who is married to an 'Aspie' as she calls it.

That's me! He's undiagnosed, but he always wondered why he has certain difficulties and why he reacts in certain ways. Our older son is autistic (hyperlexic), and in 1991 I earned a grad degree in psychology, so it didn't take much for us (me) to figure out my husband is an Aspie. We are pretty sure his deceased father was an Aspie too.

She talks about him pretty openly (and affectionately).

Our 46th wedding anniversary is next week.

I'm not sure how many people where he works even know, probably a lot like your son.

No one knew this until about three years ago (and very few people know now -- there's no reason to discuss it now that he is retired). Years ago, he got along well enough with other students in school, but was terribly unfocused and now could keep you up all night with stories about his struggles. Remember, autism and Asperger's were hardly even mentioned during the '50s and '60s, plus he attended parochial schools that didn't offer counseling or even tutoring, especially not back then. He had a 30-year career with AT&T, in a very structured job (structure and predictability are his salvation -- no impulsiveness here!).

I think he asked her to marry him on their first date.

No. Our first date was to a state forest-park and I got to carry all his camera equipment. We kind of just fell into marriage 13 months later.

I think they have always slept in separate beds.

Yes, and that's because he has to wrap up tightly in his blankets. It's a comfort thing that other Aspies I know also do. Aspies don't like being touched or hugged, so the blanket-wrapping solves a problem for them. The world-famous autistic, Temple Grandin, would (as a little girl) sandwich her body between sofa cousins in order to soothe herself, and when she was an adult, made a "hug machine" for herself.

You might want to read some of Grandin's books. (I just received her newest book from Amazon yesterday and can't wait to dig into it.) And feel free to ask me anything.

[JudyKayTee]

I am once again touched by the honesty and emotion displayed on AMHD on a regular basis. You don't need my applause, WG - but here I am, clapping for you!

[Wondergirl]

I am once again touched by the honesty and emotion displayed on AMHD on a regular basis. You don't need my applause, WG - but here I am, clapping for you!

Thanks, Judy. Our marriage has lasted this long partly because I am a pragmatic and organized and non-demanding/do-it-myself German type (100% on both sides), interestingly much akin to Asperger's thinking, which has allowed us to work through all the weirdnesses and any bad stuff. If I were still in grad school, I'd write a paper on this. (I did write one in library school about my job in public libraries and the psychology of them, i.e. transitional objects.)

[Wondergirl]

If you get a chance, check out from your library or purchase a copy of Temple Grandin's new book, The Autistic Brain: Thinking Across the Spectrum. It gets kind of technical at times, but she neatly explains the difference between autism and Asperger's. There seem to be different behaviors exhibited, depending on which part of the brain is in control. Both syndromes are on the huge autism spectrum, but temper tantrums and anger problems are not usually Asperger's syndrome characteristics. Thus, variations and different manifestations in autism should get their own names.

Grandin's complaint is that the new edition of the psychiatric manual, the DSM-V, has lumped everything together into one pot which she thinks will change for the worse how children are diagnosed and treated.

[joypulv]

I have heard her speak in person, and watched her talk on TV, and seen her cow holding bins on TV. She's remarkable, no matter whether she 'has' something or not.

WG, the part about carrying all his equipment on your first date is a howl, but I hope mbyrne takes it to heart when she wonders how much her son connects with people as opposed to thinking what might to be to his advantage.
I like to think that we all think to our own advantage but most of us have learned to cloak it in altruism, gratitude, and norms of politeness.
Nature designed us for survival. Even the infant learns that a smile gets good results long before he has a clue what a smile is.
Mbyrne's son is just near one end of the spectrum.

[Wondergirl]

like to think that we all think to our own advantage but most of us have learned to cloak it in altruism, gratitude, and norms of politeness.
Nature designed us for survival. Even the infant learns that a smile gets good results long before he has a clue what a smile is.

That's the "problem" with autism -- he is the only one walking around in his world. That means the parents, as with any child, must teach empathy and altruism by modeling it and finding worthwhile projects that family all together and also the individual on his own can work on. And I read somewhere that maybe, just maybe, we all are autistic to some extent and at various times in our lives.

[talaniman]

Even as my kids reach 40, I still trip over there well being as if they were 6.

[mbyrne230]

There is a regular responder here who is married to an 'Aspie' as she calls it. She talks about him pretty openly (and affectionately). I'm not sure how many people where he works even know, probably a lot like your son. I think he asked her to marry him on their first date. I think they have always slept in separate beds. Little endearing things. I suppose you could be right about the lying theory, and it's true that those who have more obvious attributes don't have that connection with even their closest family members, but I don't know if I would read too much into this. I can't remember how much lying I and my siblings did but we did, and I even went through a shoplifting stage, which is a form of lying. Despite being top of my class and mostly a goody goody.

Thanks for that Joypuly, it's reassuring.