[tomder55]

The people don't buy a locally made product because they know they can get it cheaper from Dell. So much for job creation

Your wrong.. the fact that the Dell computer is affordable to many more people means that there are more customers to purchase it which means that there are more people selling it and servicing the consumer. I did not say it was for any altruistic reason ;that is not the goal for the company .The goal is to make money by providing goods and services that people want .

[paraclete]

A great and successful model apparently and it works so long as people have money to spend which they gain from employment, so how do the unemployed participate in this bonzana or is this a plan for the haves and not the have nots

[speechlesstx]

Fearing an Impasse in Congress, Industry Cuts Spending

Manufacturers canceling new investments due to fear of impending “fiscal cliff”

A rising number of manufacturers are canceling new investments and putting off new hires because they fear paralysis in Washington will force hundreds of billions in tax increases and budget cuts in January, undermining economic growth in the coming months.

“The fiscal cliff is the primary driver of uncertainty,” said Timothy Powers, the chief of Hubbell Inc. a maker of electrical products.

Executives at companies making everything from electrical components and power systems to automotive parts say the fiscal stalemate is prompting them to pull back now, rather than wait for a possible resolution to the deadlock on Capitol Hill.

Democrats and Republicans are far apart on how to extend the Bush-era tax breaks beyond January — the same month automatic spending reductions are set to take effect — unless there is a deal to trim the deficit. The combination of tax increases and spending cuts is creating an economic threat called “the fiscal cliff” by Ben S. Bernanke, chairman of the Federal Reserve.

Until recently, the loudest warnings about the economy have come from policy makers and economists, along with military industry executives who rely heavily on the Pentagon’s largess and who would be hurt by the government reductions.

But more diversified companies like Hubbell Inc. in Shelton, Conn. have begun to hunker down as well.

Hubbell, a maker of electrical products, has canceled several million dollars’ worth of equipment orders and delayed long-planned factory upgrades in the last few months, said Timothy H. Powers, the company’s chief executive. It has also held off hiring workers for about 100 positions that would otherwise have been filled, he said.

“The fiscal cliff is the primary driver of uncertainty, and a person in my position is going to make a decision to postpone hiring and investments,” Mr. Powers said. “We can see it in our order patterns, and customers are delaying. We don’t have to get to the edge of the cliff before the damage is done.”

I guess Hubbell needs excon to run it. He doesn't fear any "fiscal cliff."

[smearcase]

Outsourcing is much ado about nothing. Wow Tom--sounds like you have given up. Do you really believe that if American manufacturers hadn't given up and sold us out that this country would be in the same sad condition it is today? They want all the protections that America can offer while they contribute basically nothing. I ain't drinkin' your koolaid either.

[excon]

Manufacturers canceling new investments due to fear of impending “fiscal cliff”

Hello Steve:

So, government spending DOES create jobs, huh? I didn't know that...

excon

[speechlesstx]

No sir, quite the opposite. It says the government is hindering job growth, “the fiscal cliff is the primary driver of uncertainty."

We keep telling you get the government out of the way and the jobs will come.

[excon]

No sir, quite the opposite. It says the government is hindering job growth, “the fiscal cliff is the primary driver of uncertainty."

Hello again, Steve:

I don't know how you got that... It's NOT "government" per se that's the problem. The problem is the congress's WILLINGNESS to throw the government OFF the cliff. I think you said as much...

The "fiscal cliff", of course, is when the CUTS in government SPENDING that will be FORCED upon us IF congress DOESN'T act... In truth, it's the LACK of government spending that going to send us over the "fiscal cliff".

These cuts should THRILL a guy like you. They're going to HACK away at Medicare and Social Security... Oh, that's right... They're going to hack away at the military too. Can't have that now, can we?

Besides, wasn't it YOU guys who were WILLING to throw us off the cliff over the debt ceiling, IF you didn't get what you wanted? I think it WAS.

excon

[speechlesstx]

Hello again, Steve:

I dunno how you got that... It's NOT "government" per se that's the problem. The problem is the congress's WILLINGNESS to throw the government OFF the cliff. I think you said as much...

The "fiscal cliff", of course, is when the CUTS in government SPENDING that will be FORCED upon us IF congress DOESN'T act... In truth, it's the LACK of government spending that going to send us over the "fiscal cliff".

These cuts should THRILL a guy like you. They're gonna HACK away at Medicare and Social Security... Oh, that's right... They're gonna hack away at the military too. Can't have that now, can we?

Besides, wasn't it YOU guys who were WILLING to throw us off the cliff over the debt ceiling, IF you didn't get what you wanted?? I think it WAS.

excon

Just Reminder — It's Been 800 Days Since the Senate Passed a Budget

[speechlesstx]

While an Obama super pac is running an ad claiming Romney killed a steel worker's wife, we learn that this administration had no problem terminating the pensions of 20,000 Delphi workers. Non-union workers that is.

Emails obtained by The Daily Caller show that the U.S. Treasury Department, led by Timothy Geithner, was the driving force behind terminating the pensions of 20,000 salaried retirees at the Delphi auto parts manufacturing company.

The move, made in 2009 while the Obama administration implemented its auto bailout plan, appears to have been made solely because those retirees were not members of labor unions.

The internal government emails contradict sworn testimony, in federal court and before Congress, given by several Obama administration figures. They also indicate that the administration misled lawmakers and the courts about the sequence of events surrounding the termination of those non-union pensions, and that administration figures violated federal law.

Delphi, a General Motors company, is one of the world’s largest automotive parts manufacturers. Twenty thousand of its workers lost nearly their entire pensions when the government bailed out GM. At the same time, Delphi employees who were members of the United Auto Workers union saw their pensions topped off and made whole.

The White House and Treasury Department have consistently maintained that the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation (PBGC) independently made the decision to terminate the 20,000 non-union Delphi workers’ pension plan.

I wonder how many people Geithner killed by cutting off their pensions?

[excon]

I wonder how many people Geithner killed by cutting off their pensions?

Hello again, Steve:

Man, I can't figure out if you want government to SHRINK, or you want to yell at the Democrats who do it...

excon

[speechlesstx]

Hello again, Steve:

Man, I can't figure out if you want government to SHRINK, or you wanna yell at the Democrats who do it...

excon

And I can't tell if you care about people or not.

[talaniman]

I care about people, AND facts, and the law you so want to restrict.

Delphi Plan-specific FAQs

No budget, No solution to the fiscal cliff, No creating jobs fixing bridges, NO early voting, just blame the guys who say NO to everything. AND the guys that egg them on, who NO nothing except NO WAY but my way. NO wonder the country got a credit downgrade. NO solution for that either.

[speechlesstx]

I care about people, AND facts, and the law you so want to restrict.

Delphi Plan-specific FAQs

No budget, No solution to the fiscal cliff, No creating jobs fixing bridges, NO early voting, just blame the guys who say NO to everything. AND the guys that egg them on, who NO nothing except NO WAY but my way. NO wonder the country got a credit downgrade. NO solution for that either.

Lol, you ignore the facts. Fact is this administration appears to have purposely fed non-union workers to the wolves. Fact is Republicans warned Obama about the pending downgrade and Obama twiddled his thumbs. Fact is the Democrat controlled senate has not passed a budget in 800 days as required by law. Fact is even Democrats haven't taken Obama's budgets seriously. Only Dems can move anything forward, stop misplacing the blame on those out of power.

[talaniman]

That's all BULL, nothing can moved forward without 60 votes, and all the repubs say NO. That means NO budget, No Jobs No nothing but listen to you deflect the blame on someone else without taking responsibility for NON action.

And dude since you don't know the LAW, salaried workers, and union ones have very different contracts. That's the difference between salaried office types, and ordinary workers.

Ignorance of the law is no excuse so look it up. Its like that voter suppression crap, and Romney claiming that Obama is stopping the military vote. That's pure crap.

I gave you facts and you didn't even read it so check the BANKRUPTCY law yourself. Go ahead keep believing the misinformed, and the ones with an agenda.

Maximum Monthly Annuity Guarantees, Pension Benefits

And you may as well understand the politics of this whole thing. Oh and the unions took the same cuts in wages, pensions and benefits.

http://www.theoaklandpress.com/artic...c360146658.txt

Delphi, which was spun off by General Motors Corp. in 1999, has said the pensions were transferred to the PBGC to satisfy the terms of a deal with private equity groups to help bring the big automotive supplier out of bankruptcy.

Meanwhile, GM refused to take responsibility for the under-funding of Delphi's salaried pension plan, saying they had left the company with ample funds after the spin off.

The shortfall in the funding of the salaried plan was the responsibility of the Delphi's management, GM officials said.

GM, however, was obligated to take back responsibility for Delphi's hourly pension fund because of a separate agreement with the United Auto Workers that was signed during the spin off in 1999.

So how do you holler about some facts and not others. Bet you were lousy at home work, but were a great cheerleader for your team.

[tomder55]

Budgets are not subject to cloture and haven't been so for 40 years. How do I know that ? Reid's Dem Senate majority made that very clear when they passed Obamacare .Reid has 53 votes in his caucus, and could pass a budget at any time.But I don't blame you for not knowing that. Even Obama's Chief of Staff doesn't .
White House chief of staff Jacob Lew on State of the Union – CNN Press Room - CNN.com Blogs
The real reason that Reid obstructs the budget process is because Reid is reluctant to have Democrats vote on a large budget full of deficits and tax increases that Republicans can use to run against them.

[paraclete]

Tom I can't believe you honestly believe what you are saying. No governmen gives up the opportunity to implement it's agenda

[tomder55]

Unless it is politically unpopular. Their plan is to get it through in Obama's 2nd term. This is what they could've done. They could've passed a budget ;and the House passes an alternate budget. Then they could've ironed out the differences in a Conference Committee. But that would've meant compromise ;and as the Obamacare lesson shows... Dems are only willing to compromise with members of their own caucus .

We aren't like your system where the party in power has total control.

[paraclete]

I wouldn't say total control Tom, it was only for a very small window that the Howard government controlled the senate but there is an unwritten convention not to block supply bills so it gets worked out one way or another.. Unlike your system, the budget must be voted every year, they cannot go on indefinitely with last year's budget. If the budget bills don't passed it becomes a constitutional crisis, the last time this happened was in 1975 and the government was sacked. That meant an immediate election and a nasty polarisation of the electorate. This government does not control the senate, we take the convention seriously that the senate is a house of review

[talaniman]

Upon checking I have to admit to your correctness, and have found that this has happened before a number of times. I also found that a budget resolution was agreed upon through 2103 in the debt ceiling agreement.

Jack Lew’s misleading claim about the Senate’s failure to pass a budget resolution - The Washington Post

Republicans also failed to pass budget resolutions that reconciled differences between the House and Senate in 1999, 2005 and 2007, when they controlled Congress, according to the Congressional Research Service. But money ultimately was still appropriated for government programs.

So this is nothing new, its just you guys turn to holler and make hell of it, but its happened a lot lately.

We might be tempted to think Lew misspoke, except that he said virtually the same thing, on two different shows, when he was specifically asked about the failure of Senate Democrats to pass a budget resolution. He even prefaced his comment on CNN by citing the “need to be honest.”

He could have tried to argue, as some Democrats do, that the debt-ceiling deal last year in effect was a budget resolution. Or he could have spoken more broadly about gridlock in the Senate, after acknowledging a traditional budget resolution had not been passed. Instead, the former budget director twice choose to use highly misleading language that blamed Republicans for the failure of the Democratic leadership.
We wavered between three and four Pinocchios, in part because the budget resolution is only a blueprint, not a law, but ultimately decided a two-time budget director really should know better.

There are many ways toskin the

[excon]

....Dems are only willing to compromise with members of their own caucus .

Hello again, tom:

The problem is, you actually believe this tripe. Koolaid anyone??

excon