[excon]

Hello again,

This is all too complicated for me.. I hate everybody.

excon

[talaniman]

liberal arguments promote serfdom to the state.

No Tom, they promote serfdom FROM the state, and that's what its about, service to the people.

[smoothy]

Conservative arguments are valid because they support complete slavery to corporations. They are only valid to you, because I reject their premise and misrepresentations of facts. Repeating lies doesn't make it true.


Yes it is, rich people create wealth for themselves, they pay you as less as possible to do so because they need your labor, and set the value of that labor. They tell YOU what you are worth to them to create wealth for themselves. Thats slavery, as a slave cannot talk to master about compensation, safety, or benefits or his own value. Thats what makes him a slave.

Thats what they hate about unions, it gives the slave an effective voice for his own value.

Really... then prove those claims... particularly the zero sum gain part of it. This ought to be interesting. Because you can't have economic growth in a zero sum environment... you start with X and you can never have more than X...



Plus point out which corporations have slaves... Slaves don't get paid... and aren't free to go anyplace else. It will be interesting to hear which places you are saying this happens at.

[speechlesstx]

No Tom, they promote serfdom FROM the state...

That doesn't even make sense, but nevertheless I don't want to be a part of any serfdom.

That's slavery, as a slave cannot talk to master about compensation, safety, or benefits or his own value. That's what makes him a slave.

Nope, we're all free to seek employment elsewhere or start our own business.

That's what they hate about unions, it gives the slave an effective voice for his own value.

A) The Boeing workers in SC overwhelmingly voted out their union. They're doing fine - until the anti-job mornons in this administration cause them to lose their jobs. We have an Owens-Corning plant here that has voted down union representation consistently for its existence. The workers do great and it's a plant that's never mentioned when talk of downsizing comes up.

B) Unions make union bosses 1 percenters. The occupiers should be pissed at the salaries bonuses passed out to union operatives.

[speechlesstx]

Being of the Pong generation I have always been a gamer. It gave me great pleasure yesterday to complete my first mission in the just released Call Of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 - securing the New York Stock Exchange located at 11 Wall Street.

Of course I was fighting Russians and not the "occupiers". If I were fighting the occupiers I wouldn't need the M4A1 or XM25, I could just invade with a battalion of homeless people.

[talaniman]

No Tom, they promote serfdom FROM the state, and thats what its about, service to the people.

Elected officials work for us, not the other way around.

[smoothy]

Elected officials work for us, not the other way around.

That's how its supposed to work... I recommend the DNC inform his majesty of that.

And give Harry a call while they are at it.

[talaniman]

QUOTE by smoothy;
Really... then prove those claims... particularly the zero sum gain part of it. This ought to be interesting. Because you can't have economic growth in a zero sum environment... you start with X and you can never have more than X...

There is no growth now to keep up with population. Except among the rich who circulate the money among themselves, and enjoy a collective trillion dollars in tax cuts.

Plus point out which corporations have slaves... Slaves don't get paid... and aren't free to go anyplace else. It will be interesting to hear which places you are saying this happens at.

Slavery is working at a wage that cannot afford you to buy the products you make.
Slavery is working 3 jobs to live on. Slavery is needing assistance for the basics. Slavery is being told your job was outsourced to a third world country with cheap labor and sweat shops. Slavery is thinking your job of 20 years is secure, until they down size or move the company. Slavery is no job, and a mortgage when you are 45 and two kids.

Slavery is being told what to do with your $7.65 an hour. Slavery is a rich guy telling you what you are worth.

[talaniman]

QUOTE by speechlesstx;
That doesn't even make sense, but nevertheless I don't want to be a part of any serfdom.

Serfdom/slavery doesn't make sense, not supposed to, and they will never tell you that's what you are. They will instead call you a trusted employee, until they lay you off, to keep the bottom line sound. But my reference was to elected officials, ones that are supposed to serve at YOUR behest. They don't, they serve at the campaign donors behest.

Nope, we're all free to seek employment elsewhere or start our own business.

Where does that seed money come from for a new business start up? Where are those jobs you can just seek elsewhere? Where are all these poor people coming from? The American ones? Saying you are free to do something is easy, try it, and let me know how that relocation thing works for you!

A) The Boeing workers in SC overwhelmingly voted out their union. They're doing fine - until the anti-job mornons in this administration cause them to lose their jobs. We have an Owens-Corning plant here that has voted down union representation consistently for its existence. The workers do great and it's a plant that's never mentioned when talk of downsizing comes up.

Sure they do, for now. I live in Texas too, and this is a non union state, but there are unions, but quiet as its kept, other unions help you to, by keeping an industry standard for non union jobs, or else you would earn a lot less than you do know, especially if you are a skilled tradesman. Yeah that's right, YOUR boss would pay you less if he didn't have to compete with union wages, AND union safety standards. If he didn't he would be hiring a different worker every week. A cheaper worker.

As to the specific company you cite, OC is a big company, all over the country. They have laid off workers at other plants and it has nothing to due with unions, its lack of demands for its products. Nice try, but Amarillo laid off a bunch of folks a few years ago when the recession started.

B) Unions make union bosses 1 percenters. The occupiers should be pissed at the salaries bonuses passed out to union operatives.

Don't even go there, union bonuses vs. wall street bonuses, or corporate bonuses?? Which one would YOU take??

[talaniman]

Thats how its supposed to work.....I recommend the DNC inform his majesty of that.

And give Harry a call while they are at it.

Call the RNC while you ar at it.

[smoothy]

There is no growth now to keep up with population. Except among the rich who circulate the money among themselves, and enjoy a collective trillion dollars in tax cuts.


Slavery is working at a wage that cannot afford you to buy the products you make.
Slavery is working 3 jobs to live on. Slavery is needing assistance for the basics. Slavery is being told your job was outsourced to a third world country with cheap labor and sweat shops. Slavery is thinking your job of 20 years is secure, until they down size or move the company. Slavery is no job, and a mortgage when you are 45 and two kids.

Slavery is being told what to do with your $7.65 an hour. Slavery is a rich guy telling you what you are worth.

Your argument doesn't hold water. Because that's not how it works.

In a zero sum environment, nobody could create a new service that never existed without another different service dissappearing... nobody could ever get a pay raise without another individual taking a pay cut.







Nobody is telling you what you are worth... they are saying I am willing to pay THIS amount to do THIS job.. If its not enough you can go to another employer... nobody MAKES you take that. And quite honestly... people that get $7.65 an hour get that, because a trained monkey can do the job... they have no real skill that has value. Otherwise they could get a beter job. Some of them are lucky they get paid that much.

You don't buy a house you can't afford to pay for... that mortgage is something YOU get into on your own free will. You can always RENT a place. And if you can't afford to raise kids... you don't have two of them.





Anyone that has ever earned a paycheck deals with that.

[tomder55]

San Diego occupiers attack some of the 1%ers

The coffee and hot dog carts were located in Civic Center Plaza, the same location as the Occupy San Diego protesters.

That group first settled in to the plaza Oct. 7 and set up a tent city which has since twice been taken down by police.

Coffee cart owner Linda Jenson and hot dog cart operators Letty and Pete Soto said they initially provided free food and drink to demonstrators, but when they stopped, the protesters became violent.

And according to one city councilman, bodily fluids were used in the attacks.

“Both carts have had items stolen, have had their covers vandalized with markings and graffiti, as well as one of the carts had urine and blood splattered on it,” said Councilman Carl DeMaio.

The damages will likely require at least a complete cleaning if not a replacement of the cart covers, DeMaio said.

The lovely, peaceful and tolerant occupiers are also said to have hurled death threats at the food vendors.

SoCal Street Cart Vendors Hurting After 'Occupy' Group Splatters Blood, Urine CBS Los Angeles

[smoothy]

San Diego occupiers attack some of the 1%ers

SoCal Street Cart Vendors Hurting After ‘Occupy’ Group Splatters Blood, Urine CBS Los Angeles

Yes... more wonderful examples of liberals in action... showing their true colors.

[talaniman]

QUOTE by smoothy;
Your argument doesn't hold water. Because that's not how it works.

In a zero sum environment, nobody could create a new service that never existed without another different service dissappearing... nobody could ever get a pay raise without another individual taking a pay cut.

Tell that to the people whose job was out sourced

Nobody is telling you what you are worth... they are saying I am willing to pay THIS amount to do THIS job.. If its not enough you can go to another employer... nobody MAKES you take that. And quite honestly... people that get $7.65 an hour get that, because a trained monkey can do the job... they have no real skill that has value. Otherwise they could get a beter job. Some of them are lucky they get paid that much.

You can pay a monkey bananas, but if YOUR job gets outsourced or cut, or the business climate goes down as in like NOW, YOU will take less, OR lose your job, OR go get another one somplace else, I wish you better luck than the 14 million who are there already, and losing there A$$es, in the meantime. Like the boss says, be grateful you have a job, and its telling that you think EVERYBODY who doesn't have one its their fault, "but for the grace of God..........."! But then you probably are a big fan of Herman Cain. You guys talk the same way.

You don't buy a house you can't afford to pay for... that mortgage is something YOU get into on your own free will. You can always RENT a place. And if you can't afford to raise kids... you don't have two of them.

What if you have had a mortgae and a couple of kids for 15 years, BEFORE they laid you off, and moved the whole operation over seas???

Anyone that has ever earned a paycheck deals with that.

I heard your complaints, you like ex, hate everybody. And there are million who are dealing with it.

[smoothy]

That outsourcing started hard and heavy under Bill Clinton... I know because it took up a big chunk of my day at work for a good while.

No job is worth more than the person who is willing to do it for the least amount.

You don't buy a house you can barely afford ASSUMING its going to increase in value faster than your paycheck does... or if it requires TWO incomes to qualify for it.

I followed that rule... I could have gotten a much bigger house than I did... I still could. But I like not being overextended on my finances. I don't have $40K in credit card debt either. Because I live within my means including setting money aside for retirement and a rainy day fund.

I've been laid off before... thats how I learned you have to be proactive in your life... and expect that sort of thing to happen. Unlike a lot of people... I don't waste a lot of money on expensive new cars or expensive clothes hoping to impress others.

That means I've prepared for the worst when it happens next time...

I could actually survive on less than 1/3 my current income if need be. That would be below the poverty level.

Its not about hating everybody... just hating those that put themselves in a situation, then expect everyone who was smart enough not to be to bail them out.

[talaniman]

You are luckier than most, count your blessings.

[smoothy]

You are luckier than most, count your blessings.

Its not luck... it was a hard earned lesson from my 20's that got me into that mindset. And to never allow myself to get into that position again. Because I did make those mistakes in my early 20's.

I learned that lesson because I worked myself out of it (I got myself into it, I was going to get myself out of it)... I wasn't handed a bailout, and I didn't walk away from my responsibilities.

[talaniman]

Good for you. To bad the rest of us humans aren't as smart, hardworking, frugal, or gifted with uncommon good sense.

Yes I am being sarcastic, because as tough as you talk, you are probably the biggest softie around. You don't fool me at all brudder.

Just so you know!!

[Wondergirl]

*group hug for smoothy*

We've been in our small one-bath, two-bedroom (10x10 each) starter home since 1972. No cc debt. College bills for us and one kid paid off. Five cats who want for nothing. Retired now, but no cruises or European vacations on the horizon.

Group hug for me now.

[cdad]

Ill just drop this here.. nuff said.

A Day in the Life of an Occupy Wall St. Participant - YouTube