[NeedKarma]

Quite a few of the people who work in my plant don't like overtime because of the additional taxes they pay.

They are clearly idiots.

[tomder55]

After you tell me why the Bush tax cuts DIDN'T create the jobs they were supposed to.

After Bush got the comprehensive tax reductions in May 2003 ,job growth began in September and continued for 51 months for a total of 8.1 million new jobs.

[tomder55]

'the answer is easy... spend less'

What's the Deal with Debt? - CNBC

[excon]

'the answer is easy....spend less

Hello again, tom:

No, that's the simple answer. Let me ask you this... Let's say your car broke down. Now you COULD buy a new car, but NOT if you're listening to simple answers.. For ME, investing in a new car WOULD be the solution to a broken down car.. You?? Walking, I guess.

excon

[tomder55]

I guess you come from the Paul Krugman school that says if you waste a trilllion in stimulus and it doesn't work ,then triple down.

[speechlesstx]

I guess you come from the Paul Krugman school that says if you waste a trilllion in stimulus and it doesn't work ,then triple down.

And wasn't he among those chastising Bush for his reckless spending?

[excon]

I guess you come from the Paul Krugman school that says if you waste a trilllion in stimulus and it doesn't work ,then triple down.

Hello again, tom:

Of course, the stimulus DID work. Where do you think the shortlived recovery we DID have come from? It didn't just magically happen... The stimulus actually MIGHT have FULLY worked if Obama didn't cave to right wing pressure to make HALF the stimulus be in the form of tax cuts, which don't stimulate crap. But he did, and we've got what we've got.

When business isn't spending, and consumers aren't spending, government needs to spend. Now is NOT the time to worry about the debt. NOW is the time to worry about jobs. We have the NEED for infrastructure repair. We have the PEOPLE ready to do it. We have the equipment standing idly by... It's time to put the country back to work...

Yes, we'll pay the debt down WHEN we've RECOVERED. That's what you do in your OWN life isn't it? You BORROW what you can't pay for NOW, and pay it back when you can. That's called a mortgage... I'll bet you've used one.

excon

[tomder55]

You BORROW what you can't pay for NOW, and pay it back when you can. That's called a mortgage... I'll bet you've used one.

Still do ;and I prioritize my spending to live within my means too. I bet you do to . We do that because we can't QE out of our problems and we don't borrow in excess of our ability to pay it.

[Wondergirl]

Still do ;and I prioritize my spending to live within my means too. I bet you do to . We do that because we can't QE out of our problems and we don't borrow in excess of our ability to pay it.

But you haven't lost your job, right?

[tomder55]

But you haven't lost your job, right?

What if I did ? I wouldn't go on a spending spree if that's what you mean .

[Wondergirl]

What if I did ? I wouldn't go on a spending spree if that's what you mean .

How would you pay your mortgage with no money coming in?

[tomder55]

I fail to see your point. This is about the government that is spending at a rate of spending equal to a quarter of the total GDP . It is not in a position where it is not getting revenue (income ) ;it is rolling in revenue . It is just spending too much ;and that is what needs fixing.
When I was unemployed I used reserve capital;unemployment compensation . When I was underwater with my mortgage I negotiated a short sale and did not default . At no time when times were tough did I think I could go on a spending binge to solve my problem.

[Wondergirl]

When I was unemployed I used unemployment compensation

Government support, a type of social welfare benefit?

My point is too many people are out of work right now, prices on goods are high, short sales can't be easily negotiated, and the debt ceiling must be raised.

Wouldn't corporate profits suffer if it weren't, i.e. there'd be a domino effect?

[excon]

At no time when times were tough did I think I could go on a spending binge to solve my problem.

Hello again, tom:

From a businessman's perspective, that's exactly the time I DID invest (spend). In fact, investing is the ONLY way out of our problem... We'll pay the debt when we're rolling... JOBS are what's needed now.

Yeah, yeah, yeah... I know you're going to tell me that business's won't hire if we have too much debt... I'm telling you that business's will hire when the demand for their product is there. When people work, like repairing bridges and stuff, money flows and DEMAND for products manifest...

Investing is GOOD. Really. It is.

excon

[talaniman]

Leave it to the repubs, everybody and his mama is hollering for a job, even the tea party, and other repubs, and what do they do, protect the rich and screw the poor. And everybody who ain't rich deserves to be poor. I don't get how anybody that needs a job can vote republican.

[Wondergirl]

protect the rich

I'm waiting for the wealthy businessmen to create all those jobs. Their tax breaks haven't been touched nor have their corporate jets.

[tomder55]

Leave it to the "progressives " to triple down on failed solutions . The President bragged his policies would "save" or create 3-4 million jobs. Way to go! A trillion dollars squandered has not created one net permanent job ;eradicated poverty ,or built any meaningful infrastructure. Instead it has contributed to the making an already shaky economy and the nations fiscal health worse .We were told that if we didn't pump a trillion stimulus into the system that we would face 8% unemployment . Well we have and this week we learned unemployment is at 9.2% .
[ "All in all we're going to be creating somewhere between 100,000 and 200,000 jobs next month, I predict" (Joe Biden) ] He was a little off. Only 18,000 jobs were created and the May job report was revised down by 44,000 jobs to a net gain of 25,000 .

Lets do it again! Brilliant ! We were told by Madame Mimi that passing Obamacare would create 400,000 jobs immediately.. bwahaahaahaa! They shot their bullets . All the have left is class warfare rhetoric.

By the way... calling corporations evil and bandits ;calling profits bad or ill gotten ,and piling on to an already burdensome regulatory regime does not create an environment of certainty in the market place. Boeing wants to create jobs and the Obots won't let them . The energy companies want to create jobs and they are prevented from doing so.

Now before you mock the concept of certainty being a factor let me quote the President's presser this week.
"The sooner we get this done, the sooner that the markets know that the debt limit ceiling will have been raised and that we have a serious plan to deal with our debt and deficit, the sooner that we give our businesses the certainty that will need in order to make additional investments to grow and hire".
He undertands the concept of certainty when it's convenient to his agenda while not understanding the effect of his polices on business confidence.

This is all you need to know about the President and his outright hatred of the private sector.
From his commencement address to Arizona State 2009 :
"You're taught to chase after all the usual brass rings,”..“Yah try to be on this 'who's who' list or that 'top 100 list'…ya chase after the big money, ya figure out how big your corner office is…ya worry about whether or not ya have a fancy enough title, or a fancy enough car…Now you can take that road, and it may work, for some. But at this critical juncture in our nation's history, at this difficult time, let me suggest that such an approach won't get you where you want to go. Did you study business? You can go start a company…or, why not go help a struggling not-for-profit find better and more effective ways to help folks in need?”

Ex is right in that we need investment in the economy... private investment. But investors have noted the Obots hostility to the private sector and have voted with their investment choices. Americans invested $351 billion dollars overseas last year .

[NeedKarma]

leave it to the "progressives "

I'm progressive, aren't you?

–adjective
1.
Favoring or advocating progress, change, improvement, or reform, as opposed to wishing to maintain things as they are, especially in political matters: a progressive mayor.
2.
Making progress toward better conditions; employing or advocating more enlightened or liberal ideas, new or experimental methods, etc.: a progressive community.
3.
Characterized by such progress, or by continuous improvement.

This is all you need to know about the President and his outright hatred of the private sector.
From his commencement address to Arizona State 2009 :
"You're taught to chase after all the usual brass rings,”..“Yah try to be on this 'who's who' list or that 'top 100 list'…ya chase after the big money, ya figure out how big your corner office is…ya worry about whether or not ya have a fancy enough title, or a fancy enough car…Now you can take that road, and it may work, for some. But at this critical juncture in our nation's history, at this difficult time, let me suggest that such an approach won't get you where you want to go. Did you study business? You can go start a company…or, why not go help a struggling not-for-profit find better and more effective ways to help folks in need?”

Where does that show hatred of the private sector? To me it shows trying not to put material possessions as the ultimate goal - that's noble isn't it?

BTW here's the ACTUAL quote:

Now, in the face of these challenges, it may be tempting to fall back on the formulas for success that have been pedaled so frequently in recent years. It goes something like this: You're taught to chase after all the usual brass rings; you try to be on this "who's who" list or that top 100 list; you chase after the big money and you figure out how big your corner office is; you worry about whether you have a fancy enough title or a fancy enough car. That's the message that's sent every day, or has been in our culture for far too long -- that through material possessions, through a ruthless competition pursued only on your own behalf -- that's how you will measure success.

Now, you can take that road -- and it may work for some. But at this critical juncture in our nation's history, at this difficult time, let me suggest that such an approach won't get you where you want to go; it displays a poverty of ambition -- that in fact, the elevation of appearance over substance, of celebrity over character, of short-term gain over lasting achievement is precisely what your generation needs to help end. (Applause.)

[excon]

Hello again,

Like this forum, there seems to be NO movement toward a deal. But, WE'RE not responsible for governing. They are, and they're STILL playing chicken with OUR future.

Obama offered to cut TWICE as much as was offered before, in exchange for SOME revenue enhancements... The Republicans, of course, said NO. They're probably going to say NO this afternoon, too. (Actually, Boehner would probably say YES, but Cantor say's no, and he's really the one in charge.)

Certainly, the president is going to USE this fact as a hammer to BEAT the Republicans... Only, the Republicans think THEY'RE the ones who are going to be using the hammer...

I don't know WHO is going to win this fight. I only know WHO'S going to lose. It's you and me, and our children.

excon

[talaniman]

Let me see. Repubs have been redistributing the wealth from the bottom up since the Bush tax cuts started and they have never been raised since. Matter of fact They have gotten a few bucks from the Government when they screwed up the whole freaking world economy.

Now yet again they threaten the whole freaking economy to get what's leftover from they're last screw up. Did I miss anything? Oh yeah, they still blame Obama and the Dem's for not cleaning their mess up they caused in the 2 years they had control. Those are the facts fellas, plain and simple, because every time you blame the president for what he ain't doing, its only to dodge responsibility for what you have done, which is sink the world economy, screwed billions of us ordinary people, and haven't circulated not one freakin' dollar since George gave you the keys to the vault.

Its not a spending problem you crazy people, its robbery. Don't call a politician, call the dang sheriff, get the posse, together. Lets get them varmits, and get OUR money back!!

But the repubs have the horses, guns, and grub, and they ain't selling none of it. As in every crisis, they ain't helping, and stand in the way of those that want to help.