[classyT]

I was on a thread last night that I was accused of hijacking... I apologize to anyone who thought so. ANYWAY, I was speaking to people who call themselves Christians and realized I wasn't even on the same page as they were. I do NOT believe that all paths lead to God and I do NOT believe that God placed his spirit in each of us. I do NOT believe that he has written his spirit on our hearts.(.I don't know what that even means? ) I can't find any scripture to even suggests such a thing. I believe the Holy Spirit indwells each believer in Jesus Christ. I don't go by what I feel, I only go by what the word of God says. We got on the subject because someone was on the Christian board looking for God and questioned what he had been taught .

I was surprised to see that someone who calls themselves a Christian, advised the OP to read read read all different types of material from Hindu's, Muslims, wiccan... whatever! This was weird to me. When You have truly found the Living God through Jesus Christ our Lord... aren't you suppose to lead them to him through HIS word? In other words... This is Jesus Christ speaking...


I am the way

I am the truth

I am the LIFE

No one comes to the Father BUT by ME! John 14:6


That is the only Christianity I KNOW. Help me out. Do you as a Christian believe other paths.. (other than the Finished work of Christ).. leads to the Father?

[tickle]

I worship nature in all its glory, and therefore, I am worshipping whomever put it all here. Mother Earth, yes. You might say I worship Mother Earth.

We are all here to worship whoever we want, whichever way we feel most comfortable.

Ms tickle

[Athos]

I realize this is anathema to most fundamentalist Christians but, yes, all paths lead to God.

By "paths", I don't mean some of the more bizarre things like the cults that make the news every so often but other non-Christian religions and philosophies like Judaism, Taoism, Buddhism, Islam, etc. etc. all leading to God. Jesus himself, after all, was a Jew.

The Christian Old and New Testaments can be selectively cited to dispute this, but they can also be cited to support this. All depends on how one interprets. In a series of books of almost a million words written over a long period by different authors, interpretations will necessarily vary. Just consider the different ways on these pages between Catholics and Protestants, and even among Protestants.

Each path often has its own Scripture which its adherents believe as strongly as Christians believe theirs. Who can say which is more true? To simply declaim that Christianity is the only path is based on a kind of uncritical belief that is rarely examined. And, even more troubling, is the tendency to "prove" Christian Scripture by citing the Scripture itself - an irrational method comprising a logical fallacy.

This seems to be threatening to some Christians and the reason why is another question entirely.

[simoneaugie]

To not feel what is right, to only follow rules read, is that what Jesus would have done? Why were we given both brains and feelings?

[Tj3]

Absolutely not. Scripture is abundantly clear on this point.

Acts 4:10-12
10 let it be known to you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead, by Him this man stands here before you whole. 11 This is the 'stone which was rejected by you builders, which has become the chief cornerstone.' 12 Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved."
NKJV

John 14:6
6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.
NKJV

And then a serious warning to those who teach otherwise:

Gal 1:6-10
6 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, 7 which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. 9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed. 10 For do I now persuade men, or God? Or do I seek to please men? For if I still pleased men, I would not be a bondservant of Christ.
NKJV

This is the only place in all scripture where a curse is repeated against anyone for anything. Clearly to suggest that there is any other gospel is considered to be an extremely serious offense by God.

[jakester]

Tess - first off, never apologize for what other people may think... you cannot control what other people think. If you came to hijack the thread, then shame on you ;)

It is logically possible that all paths lead to God. But the obvious question one must ask is, when Jesus said "I am the way, the truth, and the life; no man can come to the Father but through me", was he merely reflecting a warped desire to control people and gain followers? Or did he really convey an objective truth about reality? In other words, was he seriously warped and mistaken about his authority or did he really have the kind of authority that forced men to bow the knee to him in order to see God?

Each road (religious perspective) has its own view as to how people will get to God. Christianity has its own as well but it is not inclusive. Jesus is awfully radical if you are really paying attention to his words. He said no one can come to God but through him. Now, it's a matter of desire to accept that Jesus is the only way. But for the sake of intellectual integrity, no one can say with an objective viewpoint that Jesus is saying the same thing as Buddha, Muhammed, et al. You have to look at Jesus and say "you are wrong" or "you are right." But it takes a lot of courage to say one or the other.

[tickle]

This will go into many many many pages folks. Talk about anethema, this is one to a forum like this.

Tick

[Athos]

Absolutely not. Scripture is abundantly clear on this point.

Acts 4:10-12
10 let it be known to you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead, by Him this man stands here before you whole. 11 This is the 'stone which was rejected by you builders, which has become the chief cornerstone.' 12 Nor is there salvation in any other, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved."
NKJV

John 14:6
6 Jesus said to him, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.
NKJV

And then a serious warning to those who teach otherwise:

Gal 1:6-10
6 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, 7 which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. 9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed. 10 For do I now persuade men, or God? Or do I seek to please men? For if I still pleased men, I would not be a bondservant of Christ.
NKJV

This is the only place in all scripture where a curse is repeated against anyone for anything. Clearly to suggest that there is any other gospel is considered to be an extremely serious offense by God.

This is an extremely telling response. Scripture is cited to prove Scripture - a logical no-no.

And then, in case anyone thinks otherwise, it ends in the usual "curse" - no salvation for you, my friend, if you don't toe the line.

The "curse", of course, is what frightens people who don't have the exposure or the wherewithal to examine and/or discern what is being claimed. It's sad in a way to see this kind of thing in the 21st century as though we still lived in a time where people were susceptible to things that "go bump in the night".

This is the problem with interpreting an ancient series of books written when "gods" were a dime a dozen and when gods competed against each other. "Curses" flew like raindrops.

The worst part is how the essential message of the Bible - a long progression of a people slowly coming to understand truth and goodness and behavior and, yes, love - is totally discarded in favor of a fearful threat of being accursed and damned when "right belief" is stuck in a milieu that no longer exists.

It's a shame that this good book is so badly used to instill fear into people rather than love.

[Tj3]

This is an extremely telling response. Scripture is cited to prove Scripture - a logical no-no.

I don't know what you are trying to say there. Scripture is used to validate doctrine. There are many places where Jesus so also. Scripture is also used to clarify the meaning and understanding of scripture - Jesus did that also.

I am not sure what you are exactly claiming that I did wrong.

And then, in case anyone thinks otherwise, it ends in the usual "curse" - no salvation for you, my friend, if you don't toe the line.

So what you are saying is if you teach a false gospel, one other than given in scripture, then you are on your way to hell.

[Athos]

I don't know what you are trying to say there. Scripture is used to validate doctrine. There are many places where Jesus so also. Scripture is also used to clarify the meaning and understanding of scripture - Jesus did that also.

I am not sure what you are exactly claiming that I did wrong.



So what you are saying is if you teach a false gospel, one other than given in scripture, then you are on your way to hell.

Obviously, I am referring to the logical fallacy of proving something by citing the thing to be proved.

Your second comment must be a joke, right? Again obviously, I'm referring to those who say people who don't believe the way you have laid out are "accursed".

[DrJ]

Ive always found it interesting when Christianity is taught with the fear of that "curse"... or with the promise of the "reward".

I would like to take a peak into a world where God said to his followers that they must love and obey Him and by doing so they would be eternally damned to Hell. And all the non-believers would go on to a Heaven where they would spend eternity.

The point being that they should love their God regardless of the reward/punishment. THEN, we could see who the REAL Christians are.

[Tj3]

Obviously, I am referring to the logical fallacy of proving something by citing the thing to be proved.

I don't see that I did that.

Your second comment must be a joke, right? Again obviously, I'm referring to those who say people who don't believe the way you have laid out are "accursed".

Scripture says clearly that those who teach a different gospel are accursed.

Gal 1:6-10
6 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, 7 which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. 9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed. 10 For do I now persuade men, or God? Or do I seek to please men? For if I still pleased men, I would not be a bondservant of Christ.
NKJV

If you have an issue with that, take it up with the author.

[Athos]

Tess - first off, never apologize for what other people may think...you cannot control what other people think. If you came to hijack the thread, then shame on you ;)

It is logically possible that all paths lead to God. But the obvious question one must ask is, when Jesus said "I am the way, the truth, and the life; no man can come to the Father but through me", was he merely reflecting a warped desire to control people and gain followers? Or did he really convey an objective truth about reality? In other words, was he seriously warped and mistaken about his authority or did he really have the kind of authority that forced men to bow the knee to him in order to see God?

Each road (religious perspective) has its own view as to how people will get to God. Christianity has its own as well but it is not inclusive. Jesus is awfully radical if you are really paying attention to his words. He said no one can come to God but through him. Now, it's a matter of desire to accept that Jesus is the only way. But for the sake of intellectual integrity, no one can say with an objective viewpoint that Jesus is saying the same thing as Buddha, Muhammed, et al. You have to look at Jesus and say "you are wrong" or "you are right." But it takes a lot of courage to say one or the other.

The only problem with your thesis is that it assumes the words are those of Jesus. Is it possible they are later interpolations? Remember that the Bible, as we have it, comes no earlier than several centuries after Jesus walked the earth. By then, much had occurred in the situation of "Christians". The sect became exclusive as they gained power. Within a short time after gaining political power, they were actually executing those who didn't believe as they did. Do you think Jesus would ever have approved of that approach?

Could the Jesus who gave us the Beatitudes have excluded all those who didn't believe in him? Food for thought.

[N0help4u]

All paths lead to God only if you find the right road off the wrong path. A person can come to God via Satan worship once they realize the path is wrong and it veers them off onto the right road.

Tickle says she worships Mother Earth that is called Pantheism. Romans 1:25 says something about He gave them over to the desires of the flesh because they worshiped the Creation rather than the Creator.

People use the Jew as an example of justifying that all religions lead to God but God has a special place for Jews and you can't compare that to any false religions.

The Bible talks about how even the very elect can be deceived so how much more people that follow beliefs that are far from God.

The Bible even shows that good intentions do not get you to heaven.

The gospel is not a pick thing to our own self interests

[Tj3]

Ive always found it interesting when Christianity is taught with the fear of that "curse"... or with the promise of the "reward".

I would like to take a peak into a world where God said to his followers that they must love and obey Him and by doing so they would be eternally damned to Hell. And all the non-believers would go on to a Heaven where they would spend eternity.

The point being that they should love their God regardless of the reward/punishment. THEN, we could see who the REAL Christians are.

I find it interesting that most people who reject Christianity do so because they disagree with what God said in His word. They believe that they are right and the Bible is wrong. Whereas Christianity believes that we should submit ourselves to God's word, and He is right.

In any case, when push comes to shove, God's word will be the final say.

[classyT]

Could the Jesus who gave us the Beatitudes have excluded all those who didn't believe in him? Food for thought.

That is the GOOD NEWS! He doesn't exclude ANYONE! Whosoever WILL may come! It is a choice! Food for thought.

[classyT]

Whereas Christianity believes that we should submit ourselves to God's word, and He is right.

That is exactly right.

[Athos]

That is the GOOD NEWS! He doesn't exclude ANYONE! Whosoever WILL may come! It is a choice! food for thought.

If we must come to God through Jesus, what about those who never heard of Jesus?

[Athos]

Scripture says clearly that those who teach a different gospel are accursed.

If you have an issue with that, take it up with the author.

Could your interpretation be wrong? Could "Scripture" be mis-translated?

When the "author" posts here, I will take it up with the author. Until then, I will take it up with you.

[N0help4u]

If we must come to God through Jesus, what about those who never heard of Jesus?

God knows their heart and if they would have served him if they knew. The Bible says that God searches the depth of our souls deeper than we even know ourselves. So I believe if the native in the deepest jungle knew deep down there was something that created him then that is all he can be accountable for.