[Merris]

Socialism has been a big word around here lately mainly because McCain and Palin are equating it with Obama's plan to roll back the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy and go back to Clinton's tax rates in the 90's. Hmmm... Well let's look at John McCain's own quotes on these same tax cuts before his nomination:

John McCain's Top 10 Class-Warfare Arguments Against Tax Cuts
by Human Events

1. “I don’t think the governor’s tax cut is too big—it’s just misplaced. Sixty percent of the benefits from his tax cuts go to the wealthiest 10% of Americans—and that’s not the kind of tax relief that Americans need. … Gov. Bush wants to spend the entire surplus on tax cuts. I don’t believe the wealthiest 10% of Americans should get 60% of the tax breaks. I think the lowest 10% should get the breaks. …

“I’m not giving tax cuts for the rich.”

—Discussion with media, reported in “Bush, McCain Snip Over
Tax Cut Plans,” Los Angeles Times, and “GOP Rivals Bicker on Taxes,”
Washington Post, Jan. 5, 2000.

2. “I have never engaged in class warfare. I am very much in favor of tax cuts for middle-income and lower-income Americans. I’m deeply concerned about a kind of class warfare that’s going on right now. It’s unfortunate. There’s a growing gap between the haves and have-nots in America, and that gap is growing, and it’s unfortunately divided up along ethnic lines.

“I feel very strongly that we ought to have middle-income and lower-income tax cuts, and we’ll be getting into it, I’m sure, later on in this program. Mine are basically comparable to Gov. Bush’s, in some cases far better. But I’m not sure we need to give two-thirds of that tax cut, of that money, to the wealthiest 10% of America.”

—Michigan Republican Debate, Jan. 11, 2000.

3. “I always thought that class warfare was to take away from the rich. I always believed that that was what class warfare was all about. As I said, there are tax breaks and money for the richest in America and the very rich, but I think that it’s clear that there’s a growing gap between rich and poor in America, the haves and the have-nots. And many studies have indicated that, and I think that the people who need it most and need the relief most are working middle-income Americans and that’s what I want to give to them. And at the same time, the greatest benefit that I can give them is to make sure that their Social Security benefits are there. And I also don’t think it’s fair for us to lay a $ 5.6 trillion debt down on future generations of Americans.”
—NBC’s “Meet the Press,” Jan. 16, 2000.

4. “We give the millionaire a $2,000 refund. Gov. Bush gives him $50,000.”

—Quoted in “John McCain: How Straight a Shooter?” by Jeff Jacoby, Boston Globe, Jan. 27, 2000.

5. “There’s one big difference between me and the others—I won’t take every last dime of the surplus and spend it on tax cuts that mostly benefit the wealthy. I’ll use the bulk of the surplus to secure Social Security far into the future to keep our promise to the greatest generation.”

—McCain campaign commercial, January 2000.

6. “I don’t think Bill Gates needs a tax cut. I think you and your parents do.”

—Michigan State University rally, Feb. 20, 2000.

7. “Mr. President, the principle that guides my judgment of a tax reconciliation bill is tax relief for those who need it the most—lower- and middle-income working families. I am in favor of a tax cut, but a responsible one that provides significant tax relief for lower- and middle-income families. And I commend Sen. Grassley for moving in that direction. But I am concerned that debt will overwhelm many American households. That is why tax relief should be targeted to middle-income Americans. The more fortunate among us have less concern about debt. It is the parents struggling to make ends meet who are most in need of tax relief.

“I had expressed hope that when the reconciliation bill was reported out of the Senate Finance Committee, the tax cuts outlined would provide more tax relief to working, middle-income Americans. However, I am disappointed that the Senate Finance Committee preferred instead to cut the top tax rate of 39.6% to 36%, thereby granting generous tax relief to the wealthiest individuals of our country at the expense of lower- and middle-income American taxpayers.”

—Senate floor statement during debate over President Bush’s tax relief package, May 21, 2001.

8. “During the debate on the Senate version of the tax reconciliation bill, I had urged my colleagues that substantial tax relief to middle-income Americans should be our top priority. While I regret that my amendment to cut the top rate by one percent to 38.6% so millions more middle-class Americans would fall into the 15% tax bracket failed on a tie vote, Sen. Grassley did move in that direction in the Senate bill by insisting that the top rate should be cut to only 36%. As a result, I reluctantly voted for the bill but pledged to vote against the conference report should further reductions in the top tax rate be made at the expense of the majority of Americans who are in much greater need of tax relief.

“Unfortunately, the conference report did just that by jettisoning the commendable work both Senators Grassley and Baucus did in crafting a Senate reconciliation bill that provided more tax relief to middle-income Americans. This conference report lowers the top rate cut to 35%, at the cost of delaying, for several years, much needed tax relief for married couples unfairly penalized by our tax code. …

“We had an opportunity to provide much more tax relief to millions of hard-working Americans. . . . I cannot in good conscience support a tax cut in which so many of the benefits go to the most fortunate among us, at the expense of middle-class Americans who most need tax relief.”

—Senate floor statement before voting against President Bush’s tax cut, May 26, 2001.

9. “I am concerned that repeal of the estate tax would provide massive benefits solely to the wealthiest and highest-income taxpayers in the country. A Treasury Department study found that almost no estate tax has been paid by lower- and middle-income taxpayers. But taxes have been paid on the estates of people who were in the highest 20% of the income distribution at the time of their death. It found that 91% of all estate taxes are paid by the estates of people whose annual income exceeded $190,000 around the time of their death. …

“We have no idea what our financial or economic situation will be ten years from now. … We may want to have the flexibility to provide significant tax relief for lower- and middle-income taxpayers. Other unforeseen issues may arise. The point is that we must think beyond the horizon. Making the repeal of the estate tax permanent fails to take these new circumstances into account.

“We will need resources to deal with … responsible tax reform that benefit lower- and middle-income taxpayers.”

—Senate floor statement opposing HR 8, a bill to permanently eliminate the death tax, June 11, 2002.

10. MCCAIN: “Shouldn’t we give relief to average citizens who also are double taxed every single day?”

HOST KATIE COURIC: “But, Sen. McCain, if you listen to Commerce Secretary Don Evans, and he just appeared on this program, working Americans, the middle-class Americans, under the Bush proposals will get a major break. A family of four making $39,000 a year, according to Mr. Evans, will get a $1,100 tax cut for several years, allowing them to plan their individual budgets. That sounds like something that won’t just simply benefit the wealthy.”

MCCAIN: “Well, I think it will. But when you look at the percentage of the tax cuts that—as the previous tax cuts—that go to the wealthiest Americans, you will find that the bulk of it, again, goes to wealthiest Americans. … A lot of Americans now are paying a very large a—low and middle-income Americans are paying a significantly larger amount of their income in taxes. I’d like to see them get the bulk of the relief.”

—NBC’s “Today,” Jan. 7, 2003.

Now all these quotes are from the man who says "Obama will say anything to get elected."

How funny is that... It's one thing to argue against Obama's philosophy but quite another to vote for McCain, who is attacking his opponent for saying things that have fallen out of his own lips. Hypocrisy, anyone?

[NeedKarma]

Or this:

[ZoeMarie]

I can't believe there's even people that support McCain. It's like voters are going into this election without listening to the words coming out of his mouth.

[tomder55]

Obama is not saying he will bring the taxes back to Clinton levels . He is saying he will give a tax cut or a credit for people who do not pay taxes at the expense of the top 2% (they will get plundered ) . The only simularity to Clinton is that it is a similar lie that Clinton told to get elected.

As far as McCain goes;he has always identified himself as a "moderate " Republican which means he has some socialist tendencies . You know that by some of the legislation he has sponsored as he "reached across the aisle" in bipartisanship. If he loses it will teach him a valuable lesson about the people he has tried to suck up to over the years like Ted Kennedy and Russ Feingold.

[Merris]

Obama is not saying he will bring the taxes back to Clinton levels . He is saying he will give a tax cut or a credit for people who do not pay taxes at the expense of the top 2% (they will get plundered )

This is not true. It's just not true. You are saying it's true because you've bought McCain's SLANDER. You know what McCain has done? He's shown the American people that he isn't an honorable person. He will speak any lie to achieve his goal. He will pull any stunt, even though it puts American's safety at risk to try to win this election. Is that the type of person you want leading our country? What McCain is doing is unethical and he is nothing but a hypocrite. Obama has stated that he wants to roll back Bush's tax cuts that went into effect for the very wealthy that McCain himself thought were too pricey for our country at the time. You can read the article here....

These two guys feel the same way... You know what the difference is? Obama is up front with the people and McCain is misrepresenting himself and is too old to realize that regular ol' people like you and me have access to everything he's ever said on the internet. He thinks he can just change his position, slander his opponent and no one will ever be the wiser. So when McCain says verbatim what Obama has said and more, he is considered a moderate republican with "socialist tendencies" but yet you think Obama is a Marxist?
It's unbelievable.

[ZoeMarie]

You know what McCain has done? He's shown the American people that he isn't an honorable person.

Pretty much!

[tomder55]

I got more than one phone call from Seniors without access to everything ...on the internet who Obama is trying to scare in Florida .

He has been running ads that are fantastic distortions of McCain's positions about Medicare. He is saying McCain plans to cut $800 billion from Medicare through "cuts in benefits, eligibility or both."

His charge has been refuted by a number of independent sources as a complete fabrication and distortion of McCain's position . So let's not talk about speaking any lie to achieve his goal.
Even the Washinton Compost says Obama is lying .
Obama Scares Seniors - Fact Checker

The fact is that McCain has changed his mind about tax cuts because he did see that they were effective.

Obama's plan is a lie. What he calls tax credits are in fact new government giveaways. He parses it by calling those tax credits to people who don't pay taxes "refundable." He would give significant tax credits even though Congressional Budget Office data shows the bottom 40% of income earners already pays no income taxes.So how can he cut taxes for 95% when only 60% pay taxes ?

The top individual income tax rate would be increased by 13%, to 39.6%; the next-highest rate would be raised to 36%. The top rates on capital gains and dividends would rise by a third, to 20%
The Social Security payroll tax would be raised between 16% to 32% for families making over $250,000 a year. This means that the real returns these people get from their lifetime payments into the retirement program will be driven below 0%. Social Security fundamentally changes from an insurance contract to just another welfare plan.

He uses Marxist like platitudes to justify his unfair taxation. He says he wants to create "a sense of balance fairness in our tax code"....or... "spreading around opportunity""
He might just as well say "From each according to their ability to each according to their means".
The only fair tax is a flat tax where everyone pays the same percentage with no exemptions. You'ld still be getting more money from the rich ;and they would not be able to manipulate the code to hide the money.

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover they can vote themselves largess from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury..."
[Alex Fraser Tytler ]

Got to continue this later...

[Galveston1]

This is not true. It's just not true. You are saying it's true because you've bought McCain's SLANDER. You know what McCain has done? He's shown the American people that he isn't an honorable person. He will speak any lie to achieve his goal. He will pull any stunt, even though it puts American's safety at risk to try to win this election. Is that the type of person you want leading our country? What McCain is doing is unethical and he is nothing but a hypocrite. Obama has stated that he wants to roll back Bush's tax cuts that went into effect for the very wealthy that McCain himself thought were too pricey for our country at the time. You can read the article here....

These two guys feel the same way... You know what the difference is? Obama is up front with the people and McCain is misrepresenting himself and is too old to realize that regular ol' people like you and me have access to everything he's ever said on the internet. He thinks he can just change his position, slander his opponent and no one will ever be the wiser. So when McCain says verbatim what Obama has said and more, he is considered a moderate republican with "socialist tendencies" but yet you think Obama is a Marxist?
It's unbelievable.

The Bush tax cuts were NOT just for the wealthy. Any family with dependent children got a sizable tax cut. If the Bush tax cuts are discontinued, these families will LOSE.

[Merris]

The fact is that McCain has changed his mind about tax cuts because he did see that they were effective.

Oh and when prey tell, did this revelation occur? When he looked around and saw how GREAT the economy was doing? LOL. No... it happened when he was stumping and decided he had to say anything that worked to get elected.

He uses Marxist like platitudes to justify his unfair taxation. He says he wants to create "a sense of balance fairness in our tax code"....or ..."spreading around opportunity""

You know you can twist around what Obama is saying as much as you want. He wants to cushion the middle class or around 95 % of the people in the country during an economic downturn. Our nation is in the hole, and we can talk about politicians until we're blue in the face, but I think this article from the Brookings Institution (oh, but wait... are they liberal too? Good Grief) says it best:

"Americans have been living beyond our means, individually and collectively, for a long time. We have been spending too much, saving too little, and borrowing without concern for the future from whomever would support our over-consumption habit—the mortgage company, the new credit card, or the Chinese government. We indulged ourselves in the collective delusion that housing prices would continue to rise. The collective delusion affected the judgment of buyers and sellers, lenders and borrowers, builders and developers. For a while the collective delusion proved a self-fulfilling prophecy—house prices kept rising and all the building and the borrowing looked justifiable and profitable. Then, like all bubbles, it collapsed as housing prices leveled off and started down."

It's time for all of us to take some personal responsibility, here.

You mentioned capital gains tax which is currently at 15%. For the wealthiest people in our nation, 60% of their income comes from capital gains, whereas most of the middle class have no income from capital gains. Obama wants to raise the capital gains tax to 20% and McCain wants to lower it to 7.5%.

From what I've been reading, lowering the CGT doesn't have much of an effect on real investment growth it just costs the government a lot of money without helping the economy. I also came across an article in Forbes that stated that investment growth is dependent on... the people. Americans just aren't big savers it turns out and it's hurting our country. The more money we put into savings the more of a pool of money our nation has to draw for loans on new business and equipment. Republicans like to say "Go out and shop!" That mentality is perpetuating our economic woes because Americans also need to save. To make matters worst... we're just buying junk... that falls apart and ends up in a landfill. We need a value shift in America and McCain is not the one to offer leadership in this shift.

Republicans are all about excess... whether it's "Drill Baby Drill" or running up the deficit for an extremely unpopular war that doesn't seem to be ending after 7 years and billions of borrowed dollars.

During the second debate a caller asked the question "What sacrifice can Americans make?" McCain completely missed the point of her question when he answered and said "We can get rid of those earmarks and the pork spending!" He was out of touch with what she really meant. Obama, on the other hand DID know what she was talking about. And his answer is that Americans need to pitch in to... conserve and an extension of that philosophy is to save.

Vote Obama 08.

[Merris]

The Bush tax cuts were NOT just for the wealthy. Any family with dependent children got a sizable tax cut. If the Bush tax cuts are discontinued, these families will LOSE.

No they won't. That is not true. Do you just not believe the words coming out of the man's mouth? Obama isn't planning to increase any taxes for families as long as they aren't making over $250k per year. Read that sentence over and over. Because the man has been saying it until he is hoarse. Is it just impossible for you to believe?

[tomder55]

Cap.gains and dividends taxes is double taxation . Even worse ,it is a tax penalty imposed on productivity, investment, and capital accumulation.
80 percent of those claiming capital gains or dividends report earnings of less than $100,000 and 47 percent have incomes less than $50,000. Why do you want to penalize these middle class workers and business people ?

[ashley0716]

I can't wait to see what you Obama-supporters have to say when your social security is pissed away and you start paying out the a** in taxes so people who want to sit on their's get a free ride. It's disgusting, the worst kind of gov't. Obama said he wants to spread the wealth and provide the same opportunity to everyone. Giving people free money doesn't provide opportunity, it's FREE. If you give someone something, it defeats the purpose of working for it. As if American's aren't lazy enough, add Barack Obama into the equation and watch this country run straight into the ground.

[Merris]

Cap.gains and dividends taxes is double taxation . Even worse ,it is a tax penalty imposed on productivity, investment, and capital accumulation.
80 percent of those claiming capital gains or dividends report earnings of less than $100,000 and 47 percent have incomes less than $50,000. Why do you want to penalize these middle class workers and business people ?

Everything I have read states the contrary. Links to back up your claims?

Only 17 percent of households in the bottom 60 percent of the income spectrum own stock in taxable accounts. In contrast, 73 percent of the households in the top 10 percent of the income spectrum own stock in taxable accounts.

**** Among those at the very top of the income spectrum — the top one percent — 84 percent own stock in taxable accounts.

Edited to add: The proportion of those with incomes under $100,000 who receive any capital gains or dividend income is quite small. According to the Tax Policy Center, in 2005, only 12.5 percent of the households earning less than $100,000 received dividend income, and only 6.6 percent received any capital gains income.

[ashley0716]

No they won't. That is not true. Do you just not believe the words coming out of the man's mouth? Obama isn't planning to increase any taxes for families as long as they aren't making over $250k per year. Read that sentence over and over. Because the man has been saying it until he is hoarse. Is it just impossible for you to believe?

Why should anyone one of us have to provide anymore of a handout with our taxes than we already do? Who are you (or Obama) to say someone doesn't need the 40% of taxes they are getting ready to GIVE away. He said 95% won't see a tax increase. That's BS, way more than 5% of people in the US make more than $250000/year. I believe people should keep what they earn, they worked hard for it. People can sit all day long and dream of making a lot of money, but if they want it bad enough, they will get up off their butt and find a way to earn it, not sit there with their hand out.

[NeedKarma]

So you think that if a change of administration occurs people who would be working will stop and expect free money to be given to them?

[Merris]

I can't wait to see what you Obama-supporters have to say when your social security is pissed away and you start paying out the a** in taxes so people who want to sit on their's get a free ride. It's disgusting, the worst kind of gov't. Obama said he wants to spread the wealth and provide the same opportunity to everyone. Giving people free money doesn't provide opportunity, it's FREE. If you give someone something, it defeats the purpose of working for it. As if American's aren't lazy enough, add Barack Obama into the equation and watch this country run straight into the ground.

Are you actually reading any of my posts? It sounds more like you are talking based on some preconceived notion and bias.

[Merris]

People can sit all day long and dream of making a lot of money, but if they want it bad enough, they will get up off their butt and find a way to earn it, not sit there with their hand out.

The whole point of rolling back Bush's tax cuts is to pay for things... like the two wars we are fighting and new infrastructure and energy development and research. I have heard so many conservatives whine and complain about the welfare mother with five kids and I suppose that's who you're referring to when you talk about "hand-out" and "Free ride". Good grief. Our nation needs money and we CAN'T AFFORD BUSH'S TAX CUTS. We need to stop borrowing the money from China. Did you know that the economic stimulus check you received was partly funded by borrowed money from China? Then people went to wal-mart and bought more junk and it went right back to China. It is causing our country to sink.

The republicans have had 8 years and we have a mess... it's time to let the other side give it a go.

[magprob]

Yea, let them give it a go. Aren't the Obama Youth cute? Welcome to the Forth Reich.

YouTube - Cult Of Obama - Missouri Youths' Militaristic Obama Chant

[NeedKarma]

Better than these messed-up people: YouTube - A Nation down the Drain ( Jesus Camp ) part 1

[spitvenom]

I guess Mag likes her black youth running the streets instead of thinking they can be something.