[NeedKarma]

Yes, Trump is immune to bankruptcies. Hehe.

[tomder55]

Yes he's had some failures and lost $billions . However ,he was put in the Guinness Book of World Records as having the biggest financial turnaround in history. So give him his due for what he does well. I'd rather he build than run for President .

[paraclete]

He has good training for the job, he knows what it is to fail, a important attribute and better still he has learned how to fire

[tomder55]

Maybe he can go to Beijing and fix their looming collapse .

The really worrying financial crisis is happening in China, not Greece - Telegraph

[paraclete]

You seem obsessed with china you should be more concerned about things at home

[tomder55]

The Greek collape is not affecting anything where I live . The China collapse will reverberate around the world .

[paraclete]

Maybe, maybe not, how do we know this is not retaliation for cyber attacks, someone over there would be stupid enough to do it

[tomder55]

Because you know that conditions there are ripe for a crash . The government has already taken it's best short at averting it by artificial intervention . It has not worked. ChiNext Index has lost 42% of its value in less than a month ,and that's just the beginning of the fall.

[paraclete]

Markets come and go, Mr Chicken Little, China's market is some 3 trillion or so so it lost a tillion, nothing in comparison to US debt. It had been primed and a correction was necessary some of us saw the same sort of corrections in 2008 the world didn't end. There is a lot of money in china in savings that has to go somewhere, they don't have the same outlets for spending we do and this was a cowboy market where short selling was rife and opportunists abound

[tomder55]

they don't have the same outlets for spending

and why is that ? Oh never mind .The answer is obvious . There is no personal liberty there .

this was a cowboy market where short selling was rife and opportunists abound

it was exactly what the cadres wanted . They needed something other than real estate to invest in so they encourged people to get in . I have no doubt that part of the decline is the cadres 'wetting their beaks" .

[paraclete]

and why is that ? Oh never mind .The answer is obvious . There is no personal liberty there .

No Tom certain things are more expensive and like the US wages poor

it was exactly what the cadres wanted . They needed something other than real estate to invest in so they encourged people to get in . I have no doubt that part of the decline is the cadres 'wetting their beaks" .

What they really needed was for people to invest in and take up the slack in the real estate market but for the same reasons, see above, that wasn't happening, also the chinese are gamblers and you an I both know stocks are a gamble

[tomder55]

No Tom certain things are more expensive and like the US wages poor

if wages in the US are poor than yours are about the same There is a $5,000 difference in our country's median incomes. If things are more expensive there it's because their government restricts consumer choices.

[paraclete]

Again Tom statistics don't tell you reality, just averages. The minimum wage in US is $7.25 in Australia $17.60. That is the wage factory worker might earn. That $17.60 buys $US14. Now I know that in some US states the minimum wage is much higher and comparisons on this base are useless because of exchange rates, entitlements and general costs of living. So you have to compare the numbers of unemployed, welfare, growth rates in the economy and so on. I found a site which says that the minimum needed per person per day for food is $US9.93 so I don't see how that computes with those minimums but that same site suggests that $A11.93 is needed for the same basket, adjusting for exchange rates that would be $US10.00 suggesting that food costs in both places are the same, which I really doubt. Just on market size alone there have got to be big differentials.

[tomder55]

The minimum wage is bogus !Few work for minimum wage unless they are working for tips or commission in addition to wage. I am in a state with a higher min wage than the national average .If I advertised a job opening for that amt there would be no one applying .
Now if you are looking for a reason why some US wages lag ,all you have to do is look at the open borders that the liberals love so much . The libs cry about wages at the same time they celebrate an influx of hundreds of thousand illegals into the country .
The minimum wage has done enormous damage to the country . Where teens and college students looking for some pocket change used to work starter jobs to gain experience ,now those same jobs are careers for people who are family providers .
Starter jobs are not intended to be lifetime careers . So when those teens now enter the work force they have zero experience . Then the libs cry about the lack of opportunities for teens to work summer jobs and the mischief those idle youth get into.

I stand by what I said . IF the Chinese who have disposable income do not have consumer choices ,or choices that are too expensive ,it is the fault of the central planners who restrict imports .

[talaniman]

Seems to be a conflict with your logic Tom since you don't even acknowledge the decades of job losses overseas that use to be a good middle income base for many adults. Those jobs haven't been replaced, but the service industry that use to be considered entry level has certainly grown because there are few other unskilled choices.

Nor the 10's of thousands of skilled immigrants that business bring in every year to take American jobs.

The economic climate of the 70's/80's is long gone so stop blaming the liberals for what the FREE market has wrought. Looks like we all have to wait until the free market job creators of your fantasies run out of cheap labor to exploit and extract profit.

[paraclete]

Tom the lack of opportunities are because those job creators of yours chose to create jobs in China while being able to exploit the minimum wage at home. You have a different concept of the minimum, I have family members who work in jobs that are only offerring the minimum because there isn't anythingelse available, this is not a youth entry level wage at Mcdonalds, that is something quite different, but an adult minimum imposed by arbitration. Does its existence mean that an employer would opt to export the job, yes but there is no reason to allow that employer to exploit labour on that threat

[tomder55]

manufacturing is making things that are taken from the earth . Everything is made from something .That means mining and doing things that has an impact on the environment . That of course is something that liberal goverments hate . They destroy one market after another with their regulations and other laws.

At every level it is the government that discourages manufacturing at home ,not employers. So you should direct your scorn where it belongs. If employers create jobs elsewhere it's because of an unfriendly environment for job creation at home. Get rid of this administration, the Democrats, , the socialism, unnecessary regulations and unleash the entrepreneurship of the US and no one will be able to keep up.

[paraclete]

More dogma, my scorn is for those who put the profit motive ahead of the country, was it my government or yours that destroyed the auto industry here? No it was the avariscous corporate environment that decided that manufacturing in asia was more profitable. Entrepreneurs are motivated by profit and regulation is just a cost like any other cost. It is an excuse to say regulation prevents them unless it is that industry has undesirable impacts such as CSG. Mining can be carried out without destroying the environment through remediation, just another cost of doing business, but of course you would prefer passing that remediation cost to future generations. You want to see the result of unregulated mining go to Bouganville and who benefited in the end no one, in fact in the end it caused a civil war

http://www.pngmininglegacies.org/min...jects/panguna/

[talaniman]

There you go again with those UNNAMED regulations AGAIN. Of course you believe taxpayers should clean up the mess of big business, and subsides wages for the workers, so the job creators can make mo'money, pay NO taxes, and reduce the workforce to minimum wages and NO benefits.

Wait until they cut YOUR pension, poison YOUR water. We will see how you support unfettered capitalism then.

[tomder55]

Can't recall a time when capitalism was "unfettered " . Maybe we should try it some time .