[L2012nyc]

Move to its own thread


My partner of 8 years is gay. He told me 6 months into our relationship that he experimented with men, but that he "was done with that", that he loved me and preferred women. He's never been into kissing either. He has serious intimacy problems. In the beginning he acted like he liked having sex with me, but it was crazy "fetish" stuff (sorry if too personal, but I've been reading a lot lately that is normal for gay men), then after a few years that stopped and when I finally got the nerve to ask he said it was because he "loved and respected me too much". Anyway, we are at our end now. He still hasn't and never will admit he is gay, even though I've been begging him (literally) to admit it for the last 3 years. Most won't admit it. They prefer to hide behind a heterosexual relationship and have the best of both worlds, not caring that they are destroying the self esteem of the women they supposedly love. The sad thing is that these men do love us, just not in the right way. I am so sad lately. I know I am a beautiful 40 yo woman with a great body, but I feel hideous because he hasn't wanted to touch me in 5 of our 8 years together. *** possible advertising edited out*** It really does a number on you after a while, emotionally and physically. I've been breaking out and had to call a hotline for counseling today for an emergency visit because I'm so depressed. I've been holding everything in for years and I'm finally at my breaking point. No man is worth that :-(

[JudyKayTee]

Your partner isn't gay, from my understanding. He's bisexual, and he prefers men.

[L2012nyc]

One would think, yes, but if he doesn't kiss me, that would make him gay. I don't care what anyone says. HE would like to call himself bisexual, but I've seen a video of him making out with a guy and I actually met his first boyfriend who told me they used to "make out all the time". So apparently, his intimacy issues are only with women -- gay. Forcing himself to do something just to prove his masculinity doesn't make him bisexual. A lot of gay men will have sex with a woman, given the chance, because they are very sexual. I know this for a fact.

[talaniman]

Stay away fom the confusion of defining another, and judge them by how they treat you. You have been with this person for 8 years, and not happy, and that's the issue, not whether he is gay, or bi. If he were straight and non affectionate, what would you do??

[none12345]

My question to you is, why does it matter what he is? The two of you has ended, what he prefers is none of your business anymore.

[L2012nyc]

We haven't totally ended, seeing as we are still living together and what he prefers is my business because he flat out LIED to me JUST to keep me. I have told him in the past that it should be MY CHOICE to stay with him if he is with men, not his. YES, we had that conversation a dozen times. Unless you have been in a situation like this, you couldn't possibly understand what it does to a person. I am not here to bash him. I'm here looking for support because I still need to LEAVE HIM.

[talaniman]

What's stopping you?

[JudyKayTee]

We haven't totally ended, seeing as we are still living together and what he prefers is my business because he flat out LIED to me JUST to keep me. I have told him in the past that it should be MY CHOICE to stay with him if he is with men, not his. YES, we had that conversation a dozen times. Unless you have been in a situation like this, you couldn't possibly understand what it does to a person. I am not here to bash him. I'm here looking for support because I still need to LEAVE HIM.

So leave him.

It really doesn't matter but why do you think that the fact that he doesn't kiss you means he's gay?

Your situation is no different from any couple where one of the parties cheats on the other. Does it matter if it's another man, a woman? If you don't want to take second place, leave.

This is also the perfect example of what I always preach - believe what a potential "partner" tells you. He says he's gay, believe him. He says he will never get married, believe him. He says he doesn't want children, believe him. You went into this relationship after being forewarned by him. Why didn't you believe him?

It also probably wouldn't be a bad idea to speak to a professional if yourself esteem and sense of how attractive you are is tied to another person's treatment of or feelings about you. You shouldn't need a man to validate how you feel about yourself.

[L2012nyc]

Thank you. And you are 100% absolutely right. The problem is I have no friends. Zero. I haven't discussed this with anyone. I actually called the crisis hotline yesterday and one of the things they recommended was to search support groups (real and online--that's how I found this). It's a long story with him. I'm not very affectionate either and embarrassing to say, in the beginning our relationship was just long distance and sexual. He straight out told me "I don't like to kiss" and I was okay with it. I never expected for us to stay together. I had a lot of sexual hangups

Sorry, that sent before I was finished. Anyway, he sort of helped me out of my "frigity", I guess. We only seen each other once a month for the first 4 years. Perfect for him. He is a great guy, my best friend, it's just killing me that he still tries to carry on the way it's always been because I keep hanging on hoping he can change, when the smarter part of me knows he can't. I love this guy more than anyone I've ever loved, but the thought of him being with a man then coming home to me breaks my heart. He has recently admitted it to me (not sure if I mentioned that it's not just my mind going wild) and all his friends are gay as well. Btw, when he did admit it, I told him it was okay, I want him to be happy, but he still insisted he prefers women and men are just "occasional". That's what keeps me hanging on and feeling sorry for him, I guess. I'm sorry if I sound like I'm a mess... I am.

[JudyKayTee]

Sorry, that sent before I was finished. Anyway, he sort of helped me out of my "frigity", I guess. We only seen each other once a month for the first 4 years. Perfect for him. He is a great guy, my best friend, it's just killing me that he still tries to carry on the way it's always been because I keep hanging on hoping he can change, when the smarter part of me knows he can't. I love this guy more than anyone I've ever loved, but the thought of him being with a man then coming home to me breaks my heart. He has recently admitted it to me (not sure if I mentioned that it's not just my mind going wild) and all his friends are gay as well. Btw, when he did admit it, I told him it was okay, I want him to be happy, but he still insisted he prefers women and men are just "occasional". That's what keeps me hanging on and feeling sorry for him, I guess. I'm sorry if I sound like I'm a mess.....I am.

No, you don't sound like a mess. You sound like someone who is hurting, looking for answers, upset - for good reason. I am very much impressed by your honesty. Although this is a totally anonymous site people very often post, hold back, don't tell the full story, are embarrassed - and then it's difficult to understand the situation.

Let me just throw a thought out there - at least one bisexual person is a very respected member of AMHD. That doesn't mean that that person isn't 100% faithful to that person's partner. It's not who you are attracted to, it's who you have sex with that matters. I'm married, I'm attracted to other men (I'm married, not dead, as the saying goes), but I've never cheated, never would. Could you live with that type of arrangement? Not saying it's an option, just asking. Of course, that's more his choice than yours... but it is an option.

My other concern, of course, is whether your partner practices safe sex. Whatever, wherever he's been he's bringing home to you.

In the event I was harsh in my "believe what people tell you" comment - I'm an investigator for law firms. I've probably done 4 or 5 matrimonial/relationship surveillances a year for the past several years, tons more before that. I continue to be amazed by men and women who say, "Well, he/she said he/she was gay but I didn't believe it" OR "he/she said he/she didn't think he/she could be faithful but I didn't believe it"... and so forth. I wonder what they were thinking... and how "charming" the other person could possibly be.

Self esteem? I know about that. My "ex" (and I've seen remarried and been widowed and then remarried) cheated with one of my family members. It almost knocked the legs out from under me. I was more upset (believe it or not, and I'm sincere) I was more upset by the fact that both of them looked me in the face and lied to me than I was about the sex. I know, it makes little sense. It also didn't change how I felt about myself. Interestingly he then cheated on her and they split up and then he cheated on that cheater and they broke up and he's since moved to another State where I'm sure he's cheating on.. you get the picture.

This man does not validate who and what you are. Yes, get help if you need it BUT you cannot change who/what HE is. That doesn't mean he's not a great guy. It just means he's not the great guy for you.

The time in your life when you needed what he offered has passed. It's time to find what you need NOW - and you're taking the steps to do that.

Hang in there.

[talaniman]

You are hardly the first person who has spent a lot of time making a partner happy, giving them what they want for years, and now finding out they have given you very little in return. All you wanted was the love, security, and commitment of an exclusive relationship, never got it, and want out.

I think it always best to have a life that makes you happy, and for whatever reason you have never sought to build this for yourself, with family, friends, and activities that you enjoy, start doing so now. Maybe you have always thought he would provide those things but since he has not, then you have to start being honest with him, and let him know its not okay to leave you while he seeks his own adventures and happiness without you.

Being honest with him, and yourself will boost your own confidence, and break the unhealthy dependence on him to make you happy, because he cannot, nor wants to. Yes it's a difficult thing after so long, and it's a long hard road to face alone, but if you see it as an opportunity, and embrace it, I think in time you will have a very happy with the results.

Start packing his stuff up, is the first step, of many to getting yourself back. Commit to yourself, not him. Stop allowing him to be happy with what you do for him, I mean, what has he done for you lately? Just stay willing to do what it takes for YOU to be happy, because you deserve it as much as anyone, don't you?

[L2012nyc]

I feel like you just hugged me, lol. I read this as I am walking down a busy Manhattan street and I am crying my eyes out. Everything you say is true and I DO believe it, but I do have a long road ahead of me. It is going to take a while to rebuild what has been broken emotionally. I have an appt with a therapist today at 1:30, so that is a start. I thank you so much for your time. Xo

[EmberStudios]

He probably does love you.

I am bisexual myself, and I was with a man for a long time before I realized I wasn't sexually attracted to him. I thought I was mad- he was amazingly attractive,strong, talented and with a fantastic personality. But I just felt like I was kissing my best friend, and that is a really, really awkward feeling. But I really loved everything about him- he was the epitaph of an amazing boyfriend. There was no one else- I didn't feel that was about any of my peers or friends. But I just couldn't make myself sleep with him. He got really upset about it, and so did I. I was crazy about him- he was everything I wanted in a partner. I knew in the past I had been attracted to women, and he started blaming it on my sexuality. That really hurt, because it felt like he was acting like I was unfaithful. I didn't want to lose him- everything outside the bedroom was fine, we had an amazing friendship, we did everything together, we shared the same interests. But gradually, we were just slipping into becoming friends. I never saw anyone else, neither did he. One day we just sat down to talk and he suddenly looked at me and asked me if I would mind if he started seeing someone else. I was a bit surprised, and it was a bit of a crush of my ego, but I suddenly realized that I could have our platonic, fantastic relationship outside any bounds of 'Boyfriend Girlfriend'. Now I am still single, but he is getting married in August, and I'm really happy for him. I've met a few girls and men since, but I think I want sometime to myself before I leap into another relationship. But I still love him, just not in the same way. And it had nothing to do with my sexuality. I just saw him as a really close and amazing friend.

A relationship is a lot more than sex and romance, and I really hope this helped x

[L2012nyc]

Yes, it did help. Thank you. I know he loves (loved?) me, that's why he never wanted to let me go. Unfortunately, I'm not a soft girl (until now). At one time he told me he would do anything to "keep" me. He even told me in the beginning he didn't care if I slept with other guys as long as I wasn't with the same guy twice (no attachments, lol). I'm not like that, so it didn't go beyond that. Can I ask you something since you say you are bisexual? It always bothered me with him. Sometimes a gay man would ask him what he was and he would say "bi" without hesitation. That would really upset me. Why say your bi when you are in a committed relationship with a woman? To me, being bisexual is an excuse to cheat--unless, of course, you plan to stay single or find a partner who is into that lifestyle as well. Do you agree?

I have no idea what I was trying to say about being soft. I meant I'm like one of the guys and never used to get emotional. It made no sense, I know, lol.

[talaniman]

His idea of committed is not the same as yours, and best to believe him when he says he is bi since he is with you, and goes with gay guys, therefore, BI! Are you confusing sexuality, with character, and commitment? Obviously his idea of commitment doesn't have any part of "exclusive" in it.

You have gone along with his ideas long enough. They don't fit your thinking at all, and your lifestyles will never line up.

[WisperWill70]

I commend your honesty and congratulate you that you are looking for support and help! Hopefully this issue will help you to see that you're worthy of love and attention from other people. This is not just an issue about your partner's sexual orientation. All relationship problems are "mirror" problems and as such, while you're concerned about your partner's intimacy problems there is the projection of your own. YOU have issues around intimacy, and connection which pre-dates your partner and which has lead to the situation of having "zero" friends and having gotten into a situation where you got involved with a long distance sexual relationship with a man who didn't like to kiss, liked fetishistic sex, sex with men, etc. You have been holding on to hope and hoping that he will change or live up to his assurances about liking women... and not wanting to leave the comfort of his friendship and love (and insistence that he prefers women) is your safety net that helps you avoid getting out there and forming OTHER relationships which honour you and support you and are healthy for you.

It doesn't matter if he is not accepting of himself or if he is "lying" -- as you see it. People have many reasons to hang on to self concepts. He may not want to admit gayness, he may be bisexual and prefer men or he may be sexually wounded and have difficulty being intimate with anyone! (again the mirror!) -- If he is lying, so are you. You're lying to yourself by insisting on living together and holding on to hope. He may accept himself someday but that's not your homework. Your homework is to accept him (that he can't express sexual desires - no matter who/what he is into) and move on with your life.

Your guy loves you... but your relationship is not healthy for either of you. Do yourself a favour and look inward at the hardness and remoteness in your own heart and how this is mirrored in the experiences you have had and commit yourself to opening up to your partner and yourself -- commit to healthy choices for YOURSELF without needing him to be something he's not or to admit to something before you'll consider being free.

Do you really need this guy to tell you he is gay or loves men? Will that stop your attachment to him or heal your holding on to old hopes fears and resentments? Of course not. Only you can do that.

You being cold and hard to avoid being hurt hasn't worked, has it? It might be time to see yourself as a beautiful person who can find ANOTHER layer of love and affection and desire in someone else.

If love (and friendship) is not enough for you in this and you can't accept his sexual desire for other people it's time for you to set yourself free. He can't do that and no choice or understanding of himself matters. It doesn't matter what he admits to himself, you or the moon. His sexual orientation doesn't matter either --- the pair of you have intimacy and affection healing to do...
And I suggest you take the first steps and take care of yourself.

[mmresd]

The answer seems pretty obvious from your post, it is time to leave.

[dandds]

Thank you. And you are 100% absolutely right. The problem is I have no friends. Zero. I haven't discussed this with anyone. I actually called the crisis hotline yesterday and one of the things they recommended was to search support groups (real and online--that's how I found this). Its a long story with him. I'm not very affectionate either and embarrassing to say, in the beginning our relationship was just long distance and sexual. He straight out told me "I don't like to kiss" and I was okay with it. I never expected for us to stay together. I had alot of sexual hangups

Sorry, that sent before I was finished. Anyway, he sort of helped me out of my "frigity", I guess. We only seen each other once a month for the first 4 years. Perfect for him. He is a great guy, my best friend, it's just killing me that he still tries to carry on the way it's always been because I keep hanging on hoping he can change, when the smarter part of me knows he can't. I love this guy more than anyone I've ever loved, but the thought of him being with a man then coming home to me breaks my heart. He has recently admitted it to me (not sure if I mentioned that it's not just my mind going wild) and all his friends are gay as well. Btw, when he did admit it, I told him it was okay, I want him to be happy, but he still insisted he prefers women and men are just "occasional". That's what keeps me hanging on and feeling sorry for him, I guess. I'm sorry if I sound like I'm a mess.....I am.

You cannot have it entirely how you want. Sounds like you want to keep him or are in doubt. If in doubt, do nothing, keep him.