[galveston]

II SAMUEL 24

The Numbering

AND again the anger of the LORD was kindled against Israel, and he moved David against them to say, Go, number Israel and Judah.

While the author of Samuel 24 above, makes God the boss of the situation, the author of Chronicles below gives credit to the Devil.
I CHRONICLES 21

The Numbering

AND SATAN stood up against Israel, and provoked David to number Israel.

Matthew and Luke are over-zealous in making DAVID the King, the prime ancestor of Jesus, because of that false notion that Jesus was to sit on the "THRONE OF HIS FATHER DAVID" (Acts 2:30). The Gospels belie this prophecy, for they tell us that instead of Jesus sitting on his father's (David's) throne, it was Pontious Pilate, a Roman Governor, a pagan who sat on that very throne and condemned its rightful (?) heir (Jesus) to death. "Never mind,'' says the christians, "if not in his first coming, then in his second coming he will fulfill this prophecy and three hundred others beside But with their extravagant enthusiasm to trace the ancestry of Jesus physically to David, (for this is actually what the Bible says — THAT OF THE FRUIT OF HIS (David's) LOINS, ACCORDING TO THE FLESH" (literally, not metaphorically Acts 2:30), both the "inspired" authors trip and fall on the very first step.

First, it states that the anger of the Lord was kindled.
Second, Satan stood against Israel.

You will find other places where God used even unclean spirits as tools to bring about judgment. Satan himself can do no more than he is permitted.

Have you not read the book of Job, where God permitted Satan to test Job? Additionally, neither historical facts or doctrine hinge on this point.

So now you deny the inspiration of Matthew and Luke. According to the "flesh", that is Jesus of Nazareth, He will indeed sit on the throne of David, that is as absolute king over Israel, and Israel will be the head of all nations, so Jesus will rule all the Earth.

I realize you don't believe that Jesus will return, but that changes nothing. Your thinking falls into the same trap as that of the Jews who could not accept the idea of Messiah both suffering and also reigning.

Now let me get back to the OP.

It is true that there are a lot of different understandings within the Christian community, but when you come down to the heart of it, there are three things basic to all denominations.

1. Jesus was born of a virgin.
2. His shed blood atones or cleanses from sin.
3. He walked out of the tomb alive and now sits at the right hand of the Father.

You will see in other threads that we argue strongly on various points, but on the basics, we are pretty much in agreement.

[arcura]

galveston,
There are and additional 2 basics that almost all Christian denominations agree on and those 2 are that Jesus is the son of God and the trinity.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

[Leviston]

When he does come back and sits on the throne please do let me know until then we can play these games all day long.Also make sure that your childern do read Read Genesis 19, verses 30 till the end Do not hesitate and procrastinate. Your Bible will become a priceless heirloom for your children


"history" has it that, night after night, the daughters of Lot seduce their drunken father with the noble motive of preserving their father's seed.Seed" figures very prominently in this "Holy Book": forty seven times in the little booklet of Genesis alone! Out of this another incestuous relationship come the "Ammonites" and the "Moabites," for whom the God of Israel was supposed to have had a special compassion. Later on in the Bible we learn that the Jews are ordered by the same compassionate God to slaughter the Philistines mercilessly — men, women and children. Even trees and animals are not to be spared, but the Amonites and the Moabites are not to be distressed or meddled with because they are the seed of Lot! (Deuteronomy 2:19)

[arcura]

Leviston,
So your point is??
In my view that since God is infinitely wise He had reasons He did things or allowed them that we mere mortals have a hard time trying to understand.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

[classyT]

Arcura,

God is sovereign, and in general it seems to string man's bean so to speak. For some reason they want to JUDGE him. Like they even have a right... I

[Leviston]

Sounds more like someone's sick fantasy rather than God's work

[galveston]

Here are some of the contradictions that i have noticed

II CHRONICLES

CHAPTER 9

25. And Solomon had four thousand stalls for horses and chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen; whom he bestowed in the chariot cities, and with the king at Jerusalem.

I KINGS

CHAPTER 4

26 And Solomon had forty thousand stalls of horses for his chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen.
.

505 'eleph (eh'-lef);
Prop, the same as 504; hence (the ox's head being the first letter of the alphabet, and this eventually used as a numeral) a thousand:
KJV-- thousand.

702 'arba` (ar-bah');
Masculine 'arba` ah (ar-baw-aw'); from 7251; four:
KJV-- four.
The word "arba" is used in both the passages and is the same number. Why it was translated differently I have no idea.


.

[Leviston]

505 'eleph (eh'-lef);
prop, the same as 504; hence (the ox's head being the first letter of the alphabet, and this eventually used as a numeral) a thousand:
KJV-- thousand.

702 'arba` (ar-bah');
masculine 'arba` ah (ar-baw-aw'); from 7251; four:
KJV-- four.
The word "arba" is used in both the passages and is the same number. Why it was translated differently I have no idea.


.

WHAT DID THE LORD DECREE 3 YEARS FAMINE OR 7 YEARS FAMINE?
II SAMUEL 24:13


13.So Gad came to David, and told him, and said unto him, Shall seven years of famine come unto thee in thy land? Or wilt thou flee three months before thine enemies, while they pursue, thee?

I CHRONICLES 21:11

11. So Gad came to David, and said unto him, Thus saith the LORD, Choose thee
12. Either three years' famine; or three months to be destroyed before thy foes, while that the sword of thine enemies overtaketh thee;

EIGHT OR EIGHTEEN?

9. Jehoiachin was eight years old when he began to reign, and he reigned three months and ten days in Jerusalem: and he did that which was evil in the sight of the LORD.

II KINGS 24

8. Jehoiachin was eighteen years old when he began to reign, and he reigned in Jerusalem three months. And his mothers name was Nehushta, the daughter of Elnathan of Jerusalem.

700 or 7 000?
GOD CONFUSED BETWEEN "CAVALRY" AND "INFANTRY" ?

II SAMUEL 10

18. And the Syrians fled before Israel; and David slew the men of seven hundred chariots of the Syrians, and forty thousand horsemen, and smote Shobach the captain of their host, who died there.

I CHRONICLES 19

18. But the Syrians fled before Israel: and David slew of the Syrians seven thousand men which fought in chariots, and forty thousand footmen, and killed Shophach the captain of the host.

[galveston]

When he does come back and sits on the throne please do let me know untill then we can play these games all day long.Also make sure that your childern do read Read Genesis 19, verses 30 till the end Do not hesitate and procrastinate. Your Bible will become a priceless heirloom for your children


"history" has it that, night after night, the daughters of Lot seduce their drunken father with the noble motive of preserving their father's seed.Seed" figures very prominently in this "Holy Book": forty seven times in the little booklet of Genesis alone! Out of this another incestuous relationship come the "Ammonites" and the "Moabites," for whom the God of Israel was supposed to have had a special compassion. Later on in the Bible we learn that the Jews are ordered by the same compassionate God to slaughter the Philistines mercilessly — men, women and children. Even trees and animals are not to be spared, but the Amonites and the Moabites are not to be distressed or meddled with because they are the seed of Lot! (Deuteronomy 2:19)

The Bible is among other things history. People's actions are reported whether those acts were good or bad. There are a lot of bad things that went on but that does not mean that God authored them or approved of them.

The subject under discussion is whether there are internal contratictions in the Bible. We are not trying here to understand everything that happened.

[Leviston]

N the introduction to his translation of the "Gospel of St Luke" a christian scholar, j. b. phillips, has this to say — "on his own admission luke has carefully compared and edited existing material, but it would seem that he had access to a good deal of additional material, and we can reasonably guess at some of the sources from which he drew.

[galveston]

Nice try but in hebrew the numbers were written out for e,.g for 21 they wrote twenty one not a 2 and 1, so your explanation is garbage .Its not liked whjen copying someone missed a 0.Quit playing games.You can maybe foul these people, but not me, i have spent almost half of my life studying different religions.As for more contradictions there are millions of them.I would have to write a book.

Also read the rules on when to gives reddies, just like your bible i am sure you have not read the rules either

Okay, I won't give you any more reddies even when your facts are wrong.

Your statement about "millions" of conrtadictions is absured.
There are only 30,811 verses in the whole Bible.
You seem to be hung up on numbers. What you have posted so far has no bearing on the history or teaching of the Bible. Whether God offered 7 or 3 years of famine is immaterial, since neither one happened.

Goldenwolf, the reason you can't find examples of contradictiions within the Bible is because there are none that affect history or teaching.

[galveston]

n the introduction to his translation of the "Gospel of St Luke" A Christian scholar, J. B. Phillips, has this to say — "ON HIS OWN ADMISSION LUKE HAS CAREFULLY COMPARED AND EDITED EXISTING MATERIAL, BUT IT WOULD SEEM THAT HE HAD ACCESS TO A GOOD DEAL OF ADDITIONAL MATERIAL, AND WE CAN REASONABLY GUESS AT SOME OF THE SOURCES FROM WHICH HE DREW.

And you are saying,----what?

[sndbay]

Out of this another incestuous relationship come the "Ammonites" and the "Moabites," for whom the God of Israel was supposed to have had a special compassion.

Is this the example of compassion shown by God for either Ammonites or Moabites? I don't see compassion for them..

Noted as strange... 1 King 11:1 But king Solomon loved many strange women, together with the daughter of Pharaoh, women of the Moabites, Ammonites, Edomites, Zidonians, and Hittites;

11:2 Of the nations concerning which the LORD said unto the children of Israel, Ye shall not go in to them, neither shall they come in unto you: [for] surely they will turn away your heart after their gods: Solomon clave unto these in love.

There were there steps in Solomon fall. wealth.. weapons.. women.. (Deu 17:16-17)

1 King 11:6 And Solomon did evil in the sight of the LORD, and went not fully after the LORD, as did David his father.

resulted to: 1 King 11:11 Wherefore the LORD said unto Solomon, Forasmuch as this is done of thee, and thou hast not kept my covenant and my statutes, which I have commanded thee, I will surely rend the kingdom from thee, and will give it to thy servant.

exception to: 1 King 11:13 Howbeit I will not rend away all the kingdom; but will give one tribe to thy son for David my servant's sake, and for Jerusalem's sake which I have chosen.

One tribe Benjamin

Reap what you sow.. of choice the adversary was stirred up = satan

[sndbay]

From the time after the flood when God made HIS covenant with Noah, the promise was to Noah and all Noah's seed. God's promise was true, and it has been man that make the choices toward the adversary satan in pride.

Satan continues to beguile man as done in the beginning with Adam and Eve. The choice has always been man's, in answering to God's calling to follow HIM willingly.

Wealth weapons and woman are the lust of man among many others. I think drink has to be another when you think of Noah not watching carefully to protect his home, and seeing satan beguile his son Ham.

The world today examples this same pattern of works. Rather then the righteous following of God's will. Man continues to enjoy the delusion of his choice in lust to be filthy. (Psalm 4)

But know that the LORD hath set apart him that is godly for himself: the LORD will hear when I call unto him.

`Simplicity in Christ.. Faith, Love, Trust, Hope

Revelation 22:11-12 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still. 12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.

[arcura]

classyT,
Yes God is sovereign. It is He only who is the judge.
Fred

[ironsheik7]

Got to share a story here that I heard . Since its to do with bible contradictions .

There was a guy he was probably 18 or 19 . And he was a christian . And he couldn't understand about Jesus dying on the cross. And he asked his preacher about it if he could explain things that he Just could not understand.

And this preacher told him bible is full of Contradictions its not supposed to make any since Just agree with what ever it says weather it makes since or not. So this young Guy went out through his bible in the trash . And became an atheist for a while.


Then the guy had a couple of things happen to him he got robbed at gun point. Guy pulled trigger on him . But the guys gun Jammed so he made it out alive. Second he later got in a car wrecked flipped his car it was totally destroyed but he lived through it. He said a woman officer came up to him when he was laying on the ground hurt and said your lucky you made it out of this alive. God must really be looking out for you. I suggest you go find him..

He said later at the hospital he asked about the female officer . Turns out there was no female officer on duty that night .

He said it must have been an Angel from god letting me know he is still there for me. He said I struggled through religion trying to find out which one was right

And in the end he ends up becoming a Muslim . He does not believe god had a son or that Jesus is his son. He does not believe that Jesus ever died on a cross for sin. He now believes Jesus is a man Just like Moses or John the baptist...

Thought it was sad. All he went through because of an Idiot preacher who should have spent less time preaching and more time studying his bible. This kid now has denied the only one who can save his soul... And believes Christ to be nothing more than a lowly human

[arcura]

ironsheik7,
Your point is VERY well made.
I was given a book about angel stories as a Christmas gift.
That particular story was not in it but there was one quite similar.
It is amazing how many people have seen angels.
I have seen them very rarely but always in Church.
Angels without wings are very hard to identify for they can appear as almost any living thing.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

[Leviston]

Gotta share a story here that i heard . Since its to do with bible contradictions .

There was a guy he was prolly 18 or 19 . And he was a christian . And he couldn't understand about Jesus dieing on the cross. And he asked his preacher about it if he could explain things that he Just could not understand.

And this preacher told him bible is full of Contradictions its not supposed to make any since Just agree with what ever it says weather it makes since or not. so this young Guy went out through his bible in the trash . and became an atheist for a while.


Then the guy had a couple of things happen to him he got robbed at gun point. guy pulled trigger on him . but the guys gun Jammed so he made it out alive. second he later got in a car wrecked flipped his car it was totally destroyed but he lived through it. he said a woman officer came up to him when he was laying on the ground hurt and said your lucky you made it out of this alive. god must really be looking out for you. i suggest you go find him..

he said later at the hospital he asked about the female officer . turns out there was no female officer on duty that night .

he said it must have been an Angel from god letting me know he is still there for me. he said i struggled through religion trying to find out which one was right

and in the end he ends up becoming a Muslim . He does not believe god had a son or that Jesus is his son. He does not believe that Jesus ever died on a cross for sin. He now believes Jesus is a man Just like Moses or John the baptist....

Thought it was sad. all he went through because of an Idiot preacher who should have spent less time preaching and more time studying his bible. This kid now has denied the only one who can save his soul.... And believes Christ to be nothing more than a lowly human

Maybe the preacher was right,

[galveston]

Maybe the preacher was right,

And maybe the Earth is flat!

[Leviston]

And maybe the Earth is flat!

The church did actually believe for the longest time that the earth was flat,