[speechlesstx]

Do you may remember when Sen. Jay Rockefeller attacked McCain's military service a while back?

"McCain was a fighter pilot, who dropped laser-guided missiles from 35,000 feet. He was long gone when they hit," Sen. Jay Rockefeller, D-W.Va. Said.

"What happened when they [the missiles] get to the ground? He doesn't know. You have to care about the lives of people. McCain never gets into those issues."

Iowa Sen. Tom Harkin got in on the action Friday:

Republican presidential candidate John McCain's family background as the son and grandson of admirals has given him a worldview shaped by the military, "and he has a hard time thinking beyond that," Sen. Tom Harkin, D-Ia. said Friday.

"I think he's trapped in that," Harkin said in a conference call with Iowa reporters. "Everything is looked at from his life experiences, from always having been in the military, and I think that can be pretty dangerous."

Harkin said that "it's one thing to have been drafted and served, but another thing when you come from generations of military people and that's just how you're steeped, how you've learned, how you've grown up."

"But now McCain is running for a higher office. He's running for commander in chief, and our Constitution says that should be a civilian," Harkin said. "And in some ways, I think it would be nice if that commander in chief had some military background, but I don't know if they need a whole lot."

Also, Democratic congressional candidate and Obama supporter Bill Gillespie threw his two cents in as well:

"Admirals' sons," Gillespie said, unopposed for the Democratic nomination in the 1st Congressional District held by Republican Rep. Jack Kingston, "were treated like royalty. They were privileged people. They were given a silver spoon. Their careers were prepared for them."

Gillespie, a former Army officer who served in Iraq, said McCain was the kind of admiral's son who became a "maverick."

McCain, Gillespie added, was "somebody who needed to stand out, someone that needed to draw attention to themselves and ... was usually out for themselves."

He said his "heart grieves" for McCain's suffering as a POW.

"After that," Gillespie said, "he was somewhat of a celebrity and it went to his head.. . I think he was a self-promoter for the last four years (in the Navy.)

Asked to cite specific examples, Gillespie responded, "I don't have one right now."

It was just a short while back that McCain was a hero, now he has no compassion, he's an elitist only in it for himself and he's "dangerous." Has the swiftboating of McCain begun? How long before another Democrat complains of "the politics of personal destruction" and "fear mongering?"

[tomder55]

Let's start with the fact that McCain's actions were often heroic not only during his time in captivity ;but also during the fire on the USS Forestal . After the war this silver-spoon son of an Admiral (only the Democrats could make that sound like a curse) rehabilitated until he could again qualify for flight status. Then he moved on the administrative functions in the Navy ;first as the executive officer of Replacement Air Group 174 and later as Squadron Commander .His career culminating in becoming the number-two man in the Navy's Senate liaison office.

Yes no doubt the mud will be slung at him for his "maverick "ways while in the Navy . I'm sure that there is plenty of dirt to dig up for a "swift boating "... mostly involving drinking and carrying on like a sailor . He admits his conduct was not the best . Still ,one cannot dispute a stellar career during his military service.

[inthebox]

Only to some democrats can service to your country be a negative. :confused:


As to Harkin, I think he is jealous of McCain's service record.

The Wall Street Journal Online - Extra

"In explaining his Vietnam experience at that congressional round-table in 1979, Sen. Harkin says that in retrospect "maybe I didn't say it right."

Harkin: McCain too 'military' | DesMoinesRegister.com | The Des Moines Register

Check out the first couple reader comments.

[Skell]

I think Harkin makes a good point. Do you not think that that his family history of military involvement could perhaps blur his vision and impact his thinking? I do. If a child grows up with a racist father and mother than I bet chances are he will be a racist. I don't see mud slinging. Just commentating.

[speechlesstx]

Skell, Harkin isn't just offering commentary, he's definitely slinging mud. It's all part of the story line painting McCain as an insensitive "war monger" running for a "third Bush term." One's upbringing certainly affects their values - and McCain's discipline is a plus.

[inthebox]

So comparing military upbringing with racism Skell?

In 2004, did Harkin ever state that Kerry's service in Vietnam made Kerry unfit?

[Skell]

If you want to read it that way inthebox you can. I don't know Harkin's past comments and who he is and how he fits into this whole situation. That may be a problem. But regardless I think a fair argument can be made that John McCain's proud military hisotry in his family (nothing wrong with that whatsoever) may influence his views in favour of military action as opposed to diplomacy. Or is too far fetched a conclusion to reach?

[BABRAM]

The initial funding of the swift boat charades 2004 Kerry bash was compliments of Bob J. Perry, who has also given millions to the Republican party and Republican candidates, mostly in Texas, including President Bush and Republican Majority Leader Tom DeLay. I think this chicken$#!t kind of stuff got to stop. Sure old man McCain has some health issues, but it's his ideology I don't support. And although I'm not voting for McCain, the man served his county well, as did Kerry that deserved credit, not criticism.

[BABRAM]

If you want to read it that way inthebox you can. I dont know Harkin's past comments and who he is and how he fits into this whole situation. That may be a problem. But regardless i think a fair argument can be made that John McCain's proud military hisotry in his family (nothing wrong with that whatsoever) may influence his views in favour of military action as opposed to diplomacy. Or is too far fetched a conclusion to reach?

McCain wants to come on like the six shooter take-no-crap tough guy. That's the persona his campaign advisers want him to present. But fact is he has to be diplomatic and he knows it. His problem though is a lack of communication skills when upset, his anger is known problem, and his stubbornness has sometimes reared it's ugly head.

[tomder55]

As I recall LBJ had a similar anger and stubborn streak problem... but in his case it was considered a plus.

I think his military career and Kerry's is a legitimate matter of scrutiny .Both men use it to explain their development and character .President Bush's Air National Guard service was examined with a fine tooth comb. I had forgotten about Harkin's embellishing his record .