Cool. I guess there really isn't a problem in the US.
So how does the hospital get paid for the homeless guy's treatment?
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Cool. I guess there really isn't a problem in the US.
So how does the hospital get paid for the homeless guy's treatment?
Read wondergirls response.. as that is really quite broad...Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
If your Canadian system was so wonderful and perfect... why do you have waiting lists for everything... (organ transplants are exempted from this argument for obvious reasons).
After all... remember your Prime Minister came to the US for surgery rather than use the Canadian system remember.
Taxpayers and people with insurance bear the burden of their lack of responsibility.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Who pays for everything in Canada? You didn't think it was really free did you?
That's quite an ignorant statement. We all know how our system works... except for you I guess.Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
That's everywhere. Did you miss this post:Quote:
Originally Posted by smoothy
There isn't a 1 to 1 ratio of equipment to patients.Quote:
In my area of the East Coast, it takes 2 months to get an appt. with most specialists, even when I lied and told them I was severely ill
Medicaid kicked in. Who pays so that Medicaid exists?Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Quote:
In my area of the East Coast, it takes 2 months to get an appt. with most specialists, even when I lied and told them I was severely ill
Move to Chicago. If I have a legitimate problem, my primary doctor can get me an appointment with a specialist in snappy-foo time.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Its not everywhere... I'm not talking making an appointment for a routine checkup, I'm talking about things that need taking care of... if you are sick today... they don't make you wait a week to see a doctor... If you need a hip replacement you don't get put on a 6+ month waiting list to get one... If you need a pacemaker.. you don't get put on a waiting list to get one if you live longer enough... you get them in a matter of days (if not sooner) assuming there isn't a active infection or a medical reason the requires a delay. Not unheard of with hip related issues as one exaple I am using.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Its not everywhere... I'm not talking making an appointment for a routine checkup, I'm talking about things that need taking care of... if you are sick today... they don't make you wait a week to see a doctor... If you need a hip replacement you don't get put on a 6+ month waiting list to get one... If you need a pacemaker.. you don't get put on a waiting list to get one if you live long enough... you get them in a matter of days (if not sooner) assuming there isn't a active infection or a medical reason the requires a delay. Not unheard of with hip related issues as one exaple I am using.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
I've lived and visited in three states on the east coast and doctors and hospitals in them in my 50 years walking this earth ( not counting the District of Columbia). And I've not had to wait ever in the number of times I've needed to see a doctor at a private practice or when I walked into the emergency room in all that time. And by wait... since some people like to parse words... I mean more than an hour or two wait. Not days... not weeks... and certainly not months for real medical issues. But making appointments for routine annual physicalls etc.(non-urgent medical issues) for a future date are not uncommon anywhere.
And the post you mentioned is obvious they are a member of a crappy HMO plan which is one step better than socialised medicine... you get what you pay for. You don't get a Mercedes if all you are willing to pay for is a KIA.
I had the same excellent service when I had a meniscus problem. My doc got me an MRI right away.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wondergirl
Glad you get excellent care, NK.
Medical wait times worsening in some provinces: report
Report Card on Wait Times in Canada (.pdf)Quote:
The Canadian Press
Date: Tuesday Jun. 19, 2012 2:06 PM ET
OTTAWA — After several years of progress, it appears some provinces are slipping in their quest to reduce the time it takes to receive a number of benchmark medical treatments.
Part of the slide can be attributed to hospitals being overcrowded by elderly patients with dementia -- a problem that can only get worse as the population ages, said a report from the Wait Times Alliance issued Tuesday.
"Canada needs a national dementia strategy that formally integrates the functions of primary care, specialist care and home-care services with a strong focus on keeping seniors in the community, out of the ED (emergency department) and out of hospital," the alliance recommended in its 2012 report.
The report showed a decline in performance for patients receiving care in the five government-identified priority areas -- diagnostic imaging, hip and knee replacement, radiation for cancer, cataract surgery and heart bypass surgery.
Prince Edward Island received an F for knee replacements and a D for hip replacements.
Manitoba earned a D for hip and knee replacements and cataract surgery.
Ontario scored the best with As across the board and no significant changes in wait times.
"Unlike the past several years, the 2012 results show a worsening of performance with regard to patients receiving care within the pan-Canadian benchmarks set by governments," said the report.
"Although some provinces have shown improvement, the overall results point toward lengthier waits."
What's worse is that most of the figures compiled by the alliance only relate to specialist care and don't account for the time it takes to see a general practitioner or to have medical tests completed after visiting the doctor.
In its contribution to the report, the Canadian Association of Gastroenterology concluded that wait times for so-called GI procedures are up significantly in the last seven years.
"Total wait times for Canadians, considering all gastroenterology indications, have increased from 2005 to 2012 and are now 30 days longer than they were in 2005," the association said in an email.
The total wait time for a person seeking a colonoscopy, for example, is 279 days. The target wait time for the procedure is 60 days.
In another paper released Tuesday, the MacDonald-Laurier Institute called on Ottawa to reform the Canada Health Act to allow for extra-billing by doctors and experimentation by the provinces with for-profit medicare.
The paper entitled, First, Do No Harm: How the Canada Health Act Obstructs Reform and Innovation, urges the federal government to remove what it calls the "shackles" the act imposes on health care.
Serious reform can be achieved while retaining the core principles of universality and portability now found in the act, said authors Jason Clemens and Nadeem Esmail.
"In order for Canada to proceed with serious, positive, health-care reform, the CHA must be revised," they concluded.
The paper compares Canada's medicare system with those in other developed nations that provide universal health care.
Among the differences they found were that "all other universal health-care countries allow private, parallel, health care, where patients can choose to purchase health-care services outside of the public system."
A large majority of those same countries allow for delivery of universal care through privately owned and operated surgical facilities and hospitals.
The Liberals pointed to the alliance's report as confirmation that the country's health-care delivery problems are systemic and underscore a need for federal leadership to reform the system.
"Canadians are concerned about what this Conservative government's lack of leadership means for the future of their universal health-care system," Liberal health critic Hedy Fry said in a statement.
"It is time that Stephen Harper stops shirking his responsibilities and convenes a meeting with first ministers to renegotiate the (2004) health accord, instead of leaving the provinces to fend for themselves."
Apparently it's not so great for others and this is not the first call to expand on private healthcare in your country. 279 days for a colonoscopy, let's hope you don't have colon cancer during that wait.
Once my doc ordered it I had my preventative one 3 weeks later. Now it's every 3 years. No, I don't pay a cent nor is there any paperwork. Yes I know it comes off our paycheck.
There are horror stories in the US as well as you know, should we focus on the bad? That seems to be your forte.
In my country we know that relying solely on the "system" could be a death sentence in some instances so we have a two tier system where private insurance is available to enable access to the private hospital system at affordable cost. It is structured so that if you have private insurance you don't have to pay the 1.5% tax levy for the coverage the government provides.
This enables the low risk people to run the gauntlet but they can't opt out of paying something which provides access to the public benefits system. The main point here is that no citizen is without medical expense coverage for essential procedures
I'm sorry but that's your forte. That and distraction, you always have a lame response to your system's failures. Like I said, I'm glad you got excellent care but your system isn't quite so glorious for everyone else. But feel free to find where it takes someone 279 days to get a colonoscpy here and explain the need for more private care in Canada.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Nah, I dwell on the positive in my life, I don't seek out everything that's wrong. That for you guys to do in the Current Events board.
I certainly have never claimed this.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Not really there are many endgames as you call them when it comes to fairness and equity. I will gives examples a bit later.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlessx
For the moment you are providing a false analogy. The analogy falls down because there is no single property of fairness that can be equally applied across different categories (health care and tax) for the following reason.
There are a number of properties that characterize fairness and equity when applied to the health care industry. Equity of good health is something that ought to be encouraged. So it is fair and reasonable that poor people should not suffer from common diseases and complaints associated with belonging to a particular racial and/or socio-economic group. Especially since such diseases may well be less common in more affluent groups. In my country diabetes would be an example.
It is not fair on the individual suffering from the disease to have to continually seek treatment? It is not fair on the medical system (private or universal) that we should have to keep paying for a chronic problem that could have been prevented?
Again, not really As I said,there are many different aspects of fairness when applied to health care. Fairness is not an absolute there are many particular instances of how things can be fair and equitable.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlessx
Tut
Hi Tom,Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
Do you mean like the availability of certain types of medicines when there is no market for them?
Tut
It is amazing how the rare exception is used as an example to refute the rule. Yes there is a need for some incentives to induce R & D ;so there is a role for the government in the development and price support for orphan drugs .
But then again ,neither Speech or I are speaking in absolutes. When we speak of limited government we are not speaking of no government.. Maybe I should add that as a caveat in all my comments so I don't have to address the strawmen .
What I'm saying is the common ailments and medical services can easily be handled in a free market,consumer choice environment .
Hi again Tom,Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
What straw man? What absolutes? I was asking a question. Thanks for the answer.
Tut
The same ones that had Ex comment earlier :Quote:
Originally Posted by TUT317
Quote:
I'm for that.. Who needs meat inspectors, anyway? Competition will keep 'em honest, won't it? Who needs to make sure you have clean water to drink? Nobody, that's who. Corporations wouldn't dump poisons that seep into our water supply, would they?? Competition will stop 'em, won't it?
Hi Tom,Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
That's good for Ex, but I am not Ex. I didn't read his earlier comments.
Tut
So you don't think that the orphan drug and orphan disease is the rare exception to the rule ?
I don't know. I'd have to Google it and get back to youQuote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
All of my comments were directed at this country's liberals, and were spot on.Quote:
Originally Posted by TUT317
Dude, you continue to tout the excellence of Canadian healthcare while ignoring the fact that many in your country suffer because of it. Someone has to raise awareness about there plight since you won't.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Hello again, tom:Quote:
Originally Posted by tomder55
It looks like the American people don't agree with you. This morning's Bloomberg poll shows Obama UP BIG!
excon
Yeah ,love the approval rating on issues of jobs ,the economy ,and the budget . Basically he's done a good job wacking terrorists
http://media.bloomberg.com/bb/avfile/rQyA68BW5P20
Also of those interviewed ,only 73% say they are likely voters. Not that I trust polling data too much ;but if I was running a pre-election poll,I would only count likely voters.
That's just the Bradley Effect anyway. With people like Sam Donaldson calling others racist for daring to disagree with a black man's politics you can't blame folks for not wanting to appear racist.
I get it though, the Democrats top priority is re-electing Obama, the country, its citizens and any hint of racial harmony be damned.
The only purpose of a political party is to gain power ;to win elections and to get their agenda enacted.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Yeah ;but Sam Donaldson prides himself as being an unbiased gate-keeper of the dinosaur media. He'll have to put down his pom poms 1st .
So it no longer bothers you that the GOP's top priority is to make Obama a one term president. Cool.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Hello again, Steve:Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
You're missing something here... You got what the PARTY is about, but you miss what the CONGRESS is about. Don't worry. Your Republican brethren agree with you.. Governing be damned.. Let's get rid of the black guy, I mean commie socialist. I'm sorry. I mean Muslim Kenyon anti-colonial, anchor baby..
excon
Just echoing what you guys say:Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/curren...ml#post3151711
Yes I know, you tend to avoid trying to share an original thought.
You mean by reading right-wing blogs and reposting their stuff here? Yea, I don't do that. I have a life.
The words you're looking for are "incompetent boob."Quote:
Originally Posted by excon
That's because you're what, 12 years old?Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
Yes thanks to the wonderful care you get at the expense of others you do have a life. But don't worry, you'll be like the UK in no time...
Top doctor's chilling claim: The NHS kills off 130,000 elderly patients every year
And the liberals everywhere are trying to make... Logans Run... and 1984 into reality.
You keep calling me 12 years old, not sure why, I think you're trying to insult me somehow.Quote:
Originally Posted by speechlesstx
Anyway Canadians love their healthcare system. They are quite proud of it. Funny how you don't see them starting threads here about how messed up it is. Plus you rarely see any canucks in the Health and Wellness threads asking medical questions because they can't afford healthcare; imagine trying to get medical help from anonymous internet people.
But you can keep trying to make others feel bad about what they have. It's more telling about the poster than the content they are posting.
Is the word 'truth' foreign and/or irrelevant to you?Quote:
Originally Posted by NeedKarma
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