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Dear expert:
Recently, I am kind of disturbed and contradicted. As I am a woman, of course, I do want 100% equality in job opportunities and other areas of life as well. However, I am not totally sure if it is right that for me "ALSO" to get benefits of traditional courtship, like being treated for dinners, or should I fight for the check, pay for it to prove my financial viability ?
From a doubtful Asian woman
This is an opinion, not expert advice. Early in a relationship, I believe you should allow the man the honor of paying the bill. If the relationship progresses, you can voice your willingness to split the price of have an occasional "ladies treat" night where you pick up the tab.
Best wishes,
Dwalex
Dear Kelly,
Is he telling you to get in the kitchen, cook his meals, bear his children, iron his shirts? Does he say things like woman are worthless, mindless, weak, can't do anything without a husband? If so, that's bad! If he just
Holds doors, and pays for dinner, I'm sure it's OK and nothing to worry about yet. And if you have to prove your financial viability... It's not worth it! They deserve to be kicked in the teeth!
I think you need to look at this from a different perspective. Paying for a dinner date should not be a way to prove your financial freedom, but a way to prove that you are compassionate and willing to share financial burdens with your date. Add a romantic and human perspective and let your financial freedom be a way to get closer to another person, not farther away.
That's an interesting and thoughtful question for today's changing world. Myself, I wouldn't apply a cut and dried "rule." I'd see how I felt according to each specific situation, and then act accordingly. If you're going out with a very traditional guy (assuming you are hetero.. ), then you might act one way. If you're going out with a liberal or progressive guy, you might act another way. Or... You might just act according to what you feel is right, regardless of whether the guy is traditional or progressive..
Play it by ear, as they say. That's what life is all about.. ;)
You know a gentilmen is a gentilmen when h epicks up the tip, you don't have to prove you have money, if he invited you he should pay... Godd luck and God bless
Chaz :)
You know that is all fine and dandy but stick to the old traditions you don't have to prove anything to anyone... let the man be resposible and enjoy... good luck and God bless
Chaz :)
You know if he takes you out then let him pay that would make any man mad to see a woman try to pay the bill stick to traditions...
Chaz :)
Get a grip live what ever way you see fit... but paying the bill is sometimes offensive to the male ego... where are you looking for these man that you feel this way? Best of luck and God bless
Chaz :)
Always let the man pay darling... it is the American way and don't let anyone tell you anything different!
Do what feels right to you.
Forget about how anyone else expects you to behave.
But if you do demand equality with men in all areas, then some men will notice if you do not wish equality when it comes to paying the bills. So consistency of personal policy is best in order to avoid giving the impression of hypocrisy.
Hello Kelly,
Well in my opinion equality means that you don't have the automatic right to be treated in any special manner just because you are a woman - apart from specific issues to do with health or safety for example. This means that you shouldn't assume that any man should always pay for your dinner, buy you big presents etc. If he wants to, fine in my opinion, but you should not make a habit of being paid things if you don't intend to return the favour.
It's a favour and not an obligation if a man pays your dinner. Therefore, you shouldn't exploit any person's goodwill (OK maybe he just wants to get his evil way, but let's assume it's in good faith).
Reciprocity is the key to equality. If someone pays you dinner, well if you feel like having dinner with that person again why don't you just ask him if he'd like to go to dinner, on you, at another time.
If you think he's a creep and don't want anything from him, split the cheque.
Hope that helps,
Julthefool
I'm sure if you let a man pay for dinner, he isn't going to assume that you aren't financially responsible for yourself. You seem like a strong woman and most men would most likely be honored to buy you dinner. If you aren't that close and it makes you uncomforable, offer to split the check. That's what I usually do.
I am no expert on the matter but I will try and help.
I personally believe women should be treated equally to men, the belief that women are inferior to men is a very out dated frame of mind I think.
I am very independent so when I go out with my boyfriend I always try and pay for things. He does feel quite offended because he just wants to do something for me, so sometimes I think we may have to stand back and let the male pay. If you really like this man, then just because he pays for meals sometimes, you shouldn't feel like you have to prove anything to him. I'm sure he knows you can pay your own way, but he wants to treat you to show you that he likes you.
So, offer to pay for all, or split the bill when you go out and if he says no he wants to pay, tell him you really don't mind paying your way and if he continues to say he wants to pay then let him, he may get quite offended and upset if you don't let him pay for anything. He's trying to show you he likes you and you won't always let him, men can find this very fustrating.
Just let him know you're independent and you have strong opinions about the equality of men and women.
Being a guy myself I think the man should pay for the dinner... Having the guy pay take the cheak does not show any money differences... Its ussally tradition the what usually happens. Or you could split it too that works.
Be yourself.
Don't worry about things like that. Do what you think is right and fair.
If the guy/women wants to pay let them If it make you feel better offer to pay next time.
If he's a real man, then he'll pay. But show your appreciation towards him.
It is now very approriate for the woman to pay for her portion of the dinner if she is making income comparable to the man's. If she is making a much smaller amount and this is public knowledge then it is not necessary for her to offer to pay for her part particularly if it is a very expensive meal, however it would be a classy gesture.
In a relationship you should not have to prove anything to your partner, getting to know each other is more important. Talk about things such as who pays the bill and decide together if you will share the payments, or if the man will pay for everything. Do not push the subject if the man insists on paying, just enjoy, he will not think less of you unless he is not worth dating. ;)
As I am sure you are aware, social customs are constantly changing, and even now, there are inequalities in social and official treatment of men and women. For example, by law, men and women are entitled to the same rights and benefits of the Constitution, but men are called upon to die in combat while women are not.
Social customs in dating in this country these days are more often than not flexible enough to allow the couple to do just about anything they feel is proper for them. There is certainly no need for you to prove that you have the means to pay for dinner, and you are certainly free to offer to pay if you feel the desire to do so. Getting to know the other person and making the determination that they are or are not right for you is far more important than social custom.
Hi Kelly,
You have to realize that you're dealing with two separate issues here. In a professional environment, such as entertaining a client etc, you should see no difference between yourself and an equally positioned man when it comes to paying for dinners, or giving precedence, etc.
However, romantically, the story is different. In this case you want to appeal to sensibilities -- it is possible that a man of a certain "old-fashioned" school, or even someone who is a little uncertain, and therefore referring to tradition for help, will prefer to pay, and will feel uncomfortable if you pay.
If he is otherwise of a decent sort, there is no harm in letting him "act out". This would be most important on early dates, and I suggest that you play traditional roles here, if that is what your beau is doing. However, beyond the second or third date, and once you get to know each other, the importance of this "role playing" diminishes significantly, and here you can offer to have things in a slightly less traditional manner. He may even be quite relieved if you do so... However, if you find yourself with someone who persists in traditional or "old fashioned" behaviours, then you have to decide if that is what you want from a guy or not.
Paul
It depends on the man you are dating.
If you do not like him enough, pay for yourself.
If you are interested in having a relationship with him,
Why not let him pay.
If you are not really serious about someone, it might be better to pay for yourself, so that you do not have to feel guilty for not seeing him any more. (if he had spend 1000 dollars on you you would feel awkward.)
If the man you like is paying for dinner, you could for example pay for small thing like an ice cream on the way, if you like, but it does not make you unequal if he is galant and likes to pay.
Finally, your equality as a partner does not depend on you paying for dinner, but it should show in the way he treats you as a whole.
Hi there there is not wrong with receiving benefits you should be glad that you get a chance to. There are other ways to show you're a independent person be happy and enjoy life :) take care god bless
Hi It OK to be treated like a queen sometimes ;D. However you may feel uncomfortable cause some people who courtship spent money and then they want something in return. You have to commutate with them and let them know that we are just hanging out and that it. You can treat me today and I will treat you next time. Spell it out!
If you're a wonderful person people don't mine doing nice things for you ;D It not a matter of if you can afford pay yourself it could be someone appreciate what you do and appreciate your friendship.
Just have fun and enjoy life
I have seen this question a few times before and it is always interesting to find that people are so concerned about such issues.
One thing you will find in the United States is that the social customs, particularly dating customs, are generally more flexible than in other cultures. In reality, what two people do on a date, including who pays for what, is pretty much their own business and it doesn't matter one way or the other as far as the customs of this scoiety are concerned. Traditionally, the man pays for the dinner, show, or whatever activities the couple enjoys together, but you can always offer to contribute without fear of violating social custom in this country.
The overriding social custom in America is that couples are free to handle such things the way they want to and its nobody else's business!
You are finding yourself in a dilemna because you are not setting out the rules before hand!
Whether you should treat for the dinner should denpends on the situation.If people who have a meal with you is your real friend, I think it is no need to fight for treating the dinner. If not a real friend, just a acquaintance, in that case maybe you should do this. The point I want to emphasize is that sometimes you must do something that you don't want to. You are conditioned by some traditional customs. It means you should do something in order to show your social and financial status.
Excuse me but I am going to disagree with you. If you pay for the check your not going to have sex with him but if you allow him to buy your dinner you will have sex with him ,don't listen to that we don't as a society except those conditions women are not hoe's remember that.Quote:
Originally Posted by fj
True. It really depends on the situation and what the other party feels also comfortable with.Quote:
Originally Posted by liucong1984
Every time you are dating you always want to set the rules for even the first date you have to make the rules . Because if you don't then the guy assumes that he has the right to say he pays for whatever and gets kind of a dominion over the girl but that si for later . So to save your slef the problems just set up the rules right now.
Do you only want equality in some things or in all things.. all means all and that's all all means. A woman's money spends just as well as a mans.. ;) you want to pay for my dinner I will let you. Don't do it to prove anything, do it because it's the right thing to do. Share and share alike.
Here is the thing, dear. On dates, you make the man feel he is a MAN by letting himpay for dinner. After all, it was his invitation,right? However if things are uncomfortable or do not go your way, you can always suggest on going dutch & paying half of dinner. That way you do not owe him anything & you can have a few excuses not to go out on your second date. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by kellycheung
Quote:
Originally Posted by dimples
It should not be assumed that the invitation to date always comes from the man. That was the case once upon a time, but now women are emancipated, dearie, the schue is on the feet of both sexes
Not to date again requires no 'excuses' only the telling that you do not want to see him or her again. Dating is not tantamount to espousal or wedlock.
Equality means paying your way. It is the accepted standard these enlightened days.
If yopu are hesitant, you could make your acceptance of an invitation, or the extension of an invitation to an outing by you, dependent on the strict understanding that each of you go halves in expenses.
MORGANITE
:)
One thing, Morganite is I am referring to the typical Asian female here. Most do not ask out the guy. Something about Asian ways. We feel it is a man's duty to ask us out. & talk about the male ego. Most guys feel better if they pay on their dates. It makes them feel empowered. So, maybe there are instances that the girl asks out but my ASIAN brother tries to come up with his own money & pay for his date rather than going dutch. It may not be the right thing to do paying full for your girl, I mean but tha has practiced by many & still exist even today.Quote:
Originally Posted by Morganite
Coming from an old-fashioned 16 year old (yes I'm sure you'll have complete confidence in my credibility now,but if you're willing to listen I'm willing to advse.)
It's not so much a matter of empowerment or supremacy for me to pay a girl's way,however I offer since in my country it's traditional, if they don't want me to then I respect that. If you find a guy that isn't willing to bend even that much in order to suit your nature then likely isn't going to be a good match for a long term relationship.
As for answer to your specefic question then my personal belief is that you should either ask to pay for yourself,or at times take your significant other to dinner where you pay. Again,just my personal belief,do what you will.
Yes it's OK for a woman to accept traditional courtesies.
It's part of what makes a women attractive.
Being too competitive will drive most men away.
its fine to accept but you sound uncomfortable w the concept.
you can always split things up... guys probably like to buy dinner, you can score the movie tickets.
when my daughter went to HS dances the guys always bought the tickets, but we made sure she'd pay for the pictures.
in the end, if you are uncomfortable accepting these things, find a compromise like I mentioned... if the guy is frustrated, then he's probably not in line with your thinking anyway.
my wife says she went through a phase in her life before me when she had to prove she could do about anything and be independent. She says this jokingly now because she no longer cares to prove she can take out the trash, unclog a toilet, or clean up after the dog... she's more than happy to let me do it. =)
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