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    Cleaningman23's Avatar
    Cleaningman23 Posts: 255, Reputation: 5
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    #1

    Apr 5, 2009, 02:37 PM
    Hi I currently own my own cleaning company in ILLINOIS.
    I have been cleaning residential homes in Illinois for the past nine months and I am ready to also switch to offices in the night time..

    I am just a little confused on what to do for offices though... Sq footage or hourly rates??

    I went on a bid a month or so ago for a 6000 sq ft office and decided to charged about .06 for general cleaning and then I told them .09 Cents per sq ft for in depth cleaning...

    I never had received a call..

    u also calle dmy competitors in the area and found oud some are charging 140 hr for cleaning a 2 bedroom condo the first time and some quoted me 100-140 hr which is wayy more than what I charge...

    Is offices and residential alike with hourly rates??

    Please help THANK YOU!

    HI I am from the Chicago area and I am inquiring on how to start bids on offices. I currently own a residential cleaning co in the area that is fully insured and incorporated and I am trying to expand my horizon to commercial offices and I am very unsure on how to bid on these jobs.. and what are good hourly rates.. depending on who supplies the paper towel and supplies...
    To if they customer suplies everything.. I just want to know if there's an equation... or some simple rules to follow...

    Any adivce is greatly appreciated..

    [Original questions from two threads merged together.]
    Cheriedow2006's Avatar
    Cheriedow2006 Posts: 32, Reputation: -3
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    #2

    Apr 6, 2009, 05:40 AM

    My friend and I clean offices on the weekend for 3 different businesses. We charge by the job. The insurance company we clean is two floors. We charge $400.00 a month. My friend cleans houses for a living and she charges a daily rate. If she does extra (like carpet cleaning) she will charge extra for that. We live in West Virginia and it's hard to find jobs (even cleaning jobs). I would just look at the job and give them a monthly estimate. You can usually tell how long it will take you to do the job.
    Clough's Avatar
    Clough Posts: 26,677, Reputation: 1649
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    #3

    Apr 6, 2009, 06:46 PM

    Hi, Cleaningman23!

    I know just the person who can answer your question the best, and that would be Stringer. He runs a very large cleaning outfit in the Chicago area.

    I'll let him know about your post.

    If you need help with advertising for free on the Internet in order to maximize your exposure, I'll be happy to help you in that way.

    Thanks!
    Clough's Avatar
    Clough Posts: 26,677, Reputation: 1649
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    #4

    Apr 6, 2009, 06:49 PM
    I just sent Stringer an email. Hopefully, he should be along sometime during the evening. But, I'm not sure how soon.

    He's usually on here most nights...

    Thanks!
    Cleaningman23's Avatar
    Cleaningman23 Posts: 255, Reputation: 5
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    #5

    Apr 6, 2009, 08:43 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Clough View Post
    I just sent Stringer an email. Hopefully, he should be along sometime during the evening. But, I'm not sure how soon.

    He's usually on here most nights...

    Thanks!
    Hi Clough! Thank you for the referral . I seen you guys answer a few other posts on here and have seen good results! I do greatly appreciate any answers or advice from you guys!
    Hopefully I can get this ballpark figure moving as I am well frustrated with some past bids I have done! Thank you again
    Stringer's Avatar
    Stringer Posts: 3,733, Reputation: 770
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    #6

    Apr 7, 2009, 05:42 PM

    Hi Cleaningman.

    May I ask you a few questions?

    How long have you been in the residential cleaning business?

    Are you incorporated? Do you have employees?

    Do you have special equipment such as a carpet cleaning machine, backpac vacuum, etc?

    Cleaning commercial is for the most part a different animal, than residential cleaning. You need the knowledge and proper equipment to do the job properly, quickly and effectively; time IS money especially in this business.

    You say that you bid $.06 for 6,000 sq ft. That is $360.00 per month, I have to assume that that was not 5 days per week cleaning, probably 2 or maybe 3 days per week.

    Getting started in the commercial cleaning business even if you have experience in residential is not always easy. You are almost forced initially to go after the smaller accounts where there isn't too much competition from the mid to larger companies.

    But going after 3,500, 4,000, 6,000 sq ft buildings is a good start. But you want at least 3 days per week, preferably 5 days a week service, that is the boost that is needed to go beyond the 'red line' costs.

    You say that they never called you back? Did you call them back? If I may I would like to say here that 'order takers' give prices, salespeople go after the sale and have much more success. The market presently is extremely competitive and all the salespeople from your competitors are out in force making deals that a year ago they would not have considered.

    You bid $.06 and didn't get the job, to me that was a very low bid. Many things happen in this business, a friend knows a friend kind of thing... your example may be just an abnormally. Have you bid any other commercial jobs, if so please explain.

    Please answer the above and we can get together again to move forward.

    By the way, I am in the Chicago area (and no I do not mind competition at all), what town are you in, if I may ask?

    Thanks,

    Stringer
    Stringer's Avatar
    Stringer Posts: 3,733, Reputation: 770
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    #7

    Apr 7, 2009, 05:56 PM

    HI Cleaningman,

    Do you have two threads open for this question:

    https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/small-...ea-338198.html

    I answered your first thread dated April 4th, that I pasted above... my answer there was directed to those questions...

    Clough, could you straighten this out my friend and maybe incorporate it into one thread, that would be easier?

    Stringer
    Cleaningman23's Avatar
    Cleaningman23 Posts: 255, Reputation: 5
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    #8

    Apr 7, 2009, 07:51 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Stringer View Post
    Hi Cleaningman.

    May I ask you a few questions?

    How long have you been in the residential cleaning business?

    Are you incorporated? Do you have employees?

    Do you have special equipment such as a carpet cleaning machine, backpac vacuum, etc?

    Cleaning commercial is for the most part a different animal, than residential cleaning. You need the knowledge and proper equipment to do the job properly, quickly and effectively; time IS money especially in this business.

    You say that you bid $.06 for 6,000 sq ft. That is $360.00 per month, I have to assume that that was not 5 days per week cleaning, probably 2 or maybe 3 days per week.

    Getting started in the commercial cleaning business even if you have experience in residential is not always easy. You are almost forced initially to go after the smaller accounts where there isn't too much competition from the mid to larger companies.

    But going after 3,500, 4,000, 6,000 sq ft buildings is a good start. But you want at least 3 days per week, preferably 5 days a week service, that is the boost that is needed to go beyond the 'red line' costs.

    You say that they never called you back? Did you call them back? If I may I would like to say here that 'order takers' give prices, salespeople go after the sale and have much more success. The market presently is extremely competitive and all the salespeople from your competitors are out in force making deals that a year ago they would not have considered.

    You bid $.06 and didn't get the job, to me that was a very low bid. Many things happen in this business, a friend knows a friend kind of thing...your example may be just an abnormally. Have you bid any other commercial jobs, if so please explain.

    Please answer the above and we can get together again to move forward.

    By the way, I am in the Chicago area (and no I do not mind competition at all), what town are you in, if I may ask?

    Thanks,

    Stringer
    Hi Stringer! Thank You for any advice and Thank You for responding to my Question. But here it is for you...

    I have been in business since last July. So I've been in the business for about roughly about 9 months. I did have prior cleaning experience but not much about pricing...

    My business is Incorporated ! Right now I am in the process of hiring two employees and finally have built up some steady customers..


    Yes! I do have a Backpack hepa vacuum which I invested 600 into and other vacuums also.

    The carpet cleaning system I offer at the moment is a Dry-Cleaning Carpet system similar to "chem dry". I am currently looking into a steam clean machine but was not sure if it was a safe investment at the moment. Since no one yet has asked me.

    On the estimate I went on. The client explained to me that they wanted weekly cleaning of the office(once a week) and then a In- Depth Cleaning where we would wipe the conference table down with pledge and dust the tops of cabinets and other misc extra chores. *NOT INCLUDING WINDOWS* To my knowledge they would be supplying the paper towel and garbage bags and we would supply the chemicals and other misc cleaning materials

    I quoted the client .06 per sq ft since he would be a weekly customer and .09 cents for the in depth cleaning.

    That was my only commercial cleaning estimate I have been on so far . I did not call them back and follow up on the estimate though.

    My company is located around Orland Park in the south suburbs.
    May I ask which town are you in currently?


    I am also wondering what is the average out here in our area for commercial bids.. Do you typically go by sq ft? What's a good bid when the customer supplies the materials or when I supply them?

    Thank You So much for your experienced knowledge.

    Btw do you know if there is any cleaning related convention that they have in the chicago-land area?
    Cleaningman23's Avatar
    Cleaningman23 Posts: 255, Reputation: 5
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    #9

    Apr 7, 2009, 08:22 PM

    Yes I did make two. I apologize. I answered Your question on the other forum.. but I quoted you...
    Cleaningman23's Avatar
    Cleaningman23 Posts: 255, Reputation: 5
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    #10

    Apr 7, 2009, 08:22 PM

    I accidentially quoted you not replied.. sorry about that...
    Stringer's Avatar
    Stringer Posts: 3,733, Reputation: 770
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    #11

    Apr 7, 2009, 08:46 PM

    The ISSA had a seminar today in a Melrose Park hotel this morning from 8 am to noon.

    Look into the Bscia and the ISSA, both are organizations for building service contractors with a lot to offer. There obviously is a charge.

    Also join How to Start a Successful Cleaning Business great help to new service entrepreneurs, read the archived articles and you can ask questions.

    My office is in Naperville. By the way, we do quite a bit of business in Orland. From the Wisconsin border north to west of Oswego, to Kankakee south and most of northwest Indiana.

    As I said, commercial cleaning is a different animal Cleaningman. The bidding process is different, the cleaning plan is different, the clients are different and even the employees that you hire for this work are different.

    Bidding is important, but I think that you should be asking about marketing and advertising (clough) and prospecting first, that is important and different also.

    However, bidding a building has many aspects to it:

    Density - amount of staff in the building, number of trash cans, more supplies for the washrooms, more dirt in the lunchrooms, spots on the glass, walls, etc.

    Size: Larger buildings, do you use 'team cleaning' or assigned areas?

    Square footage:
    how much is actually 'cleanable?'

    More:...

    We have a computer program that we use to figure our costs and pricing. This figures in all the costs that we previously have incorporated into the program. (These are available, but not cheap)

    Figure a current sq ft price: sq ft X a price that you have developed from your own experience and from competitors info.

    Walking the building and determining what needs done, how and how long it will take... an hourly price that you will change to monthly (Note: in almost all commercial bids there are monthly bids, but you break it down first to arrive at this)

    And lastly and one of the most important, know your competitors and how they price. Find out who is bidding against you.

    All these methods are used by us each time we bid. Each of these is brought into serious consideration to culminate into our final price. We are very picky as to what we go after and have learned through the last 25 years how to stack the odds in our favor. We basically have built a great reputation in our particular market and we spend a lot of time nourishing it. Most of the buildings we go after are at least 30,000 sq ft, many are over 300,000 sq ft, or they have many facilities.

    I would suggest that you initially bid by figuring by the sq ft. Play with it and determine your price. Example; a 6,000 sq ft building cleaning five days per week (these are way more profitable) should shake out at about $960.00 per month and that is competitive for the most part. ($.16 per sq ft)

    Prospect and bid, always keep something in the pipeline, when you lose a bid call the prospect. Tell them that you are sorry that you lost the bid and if they would be so kind as to help you get better? Tell them that you know that you can do the job properly and make them happy but you need to refine your pricing. You will be surprised how many will take a few moments to help you. Say you bid that $960.00 and you lost... ask them how many bidders there were, where you came in with your bid (second, third, fourth)? Then ask them, for example, if I was second how close was I to the low bidder? They will tell you that before they will tell you exactly how much in dollars. However ask them how much in dollars after you get the other info.

    Keep all this info in general and about each of your competitors... that bid also.

    I am a little tired and I have a staff meeting tomorrow morning so I guess that is all for tonight Cleaningman.

    Oh, I might add that I bid against dry chemical carpet cleaning and win, we can discuss this also later.

    Respond to this and we can continue.

    Thanks,

    Stringer
    Stringer's Avatar
    Stringer Posts: 3,733, Reputation: 770
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    #12

    Apr 7, 2009, 08:58 PM

    Compliments things Clean... answers will be bouncing back and forth...
    Stringer's Avatar
    Stringer Posts: 3,733, Reputation: 770
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    #13

    Apr 7, 2009, 09:26 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by Stringer View Post
    Complicates things Clean...answers will be bouncing back and forth....
    We need to get all this on one thread cleaningman.
    Cleaningman23's Avatar
    Cleaningman23 Posts: 255, Reputation: 5
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    #14

    Apr 7, 2009, 09:28 PM

    Hi Stringer and once again Thank You for your advice with these matters again!
    I am gifted to have come across such a successful person in this area!

    But yea I do agree that I should be asking about advertisement also@ And that was my next step .haha.


    But yes Now your saying a 6000 sq ft office should be around $960.00 a month for a five days a week cleaning? That averages to about $48.00 per night to clean?
    Is that correct?
    You are also saying that most commercial bids are monthly and that you should start hourly? Do you use that to determine the monthly price? And what about the sq footage? Now .16 cents is a good bid for sq foot when using your won materials? Or what I stated?


    You also state that you out bid chem dry?

    Does that mean you have a more cost effective system than them that your customers prefer? Or that your experience prompts you to have customers chose you over the dry cleaning aspect of things?





    I have tried doing my research into commercial aspect with books and internet studying but have not come across a adequate example of the prices in my area at all...
    Cleaningman23's Avatar
    Cleaningman23 Posts: 255, Reputation: 5
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    #15

    Apr 7, 2009, 09:29 PM
    Thank You once again for your time and advice!
    Clough's Avatar
    Clough Posts: 26,677, Reputation: 1649
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    #16

    Apr 7, 2009, 09:38 PM

    Okay, I just now saw this. Let me work on the merger. It would be okay to keep addressing the questions and dialogue while I do that.

    Thanks!
    Clough's Avatar
    Clough Posts: 26,677, Reputation: 1649
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    #17

    Apr 7, 2009, 09:50 PM

    I merged the threads together as well as the questions. It looks like I didn't lose any information when doing that.

    Thanks!
    Stringer's Avatar
    Stringer Posts: 3,733, Reputation: 770
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    #18

    Apr 7, 2009, 10:42 PM

    But yes Now your saying a 6000 sq ft office should be around $960.00 a month for a five days a week cleaning? That averages to about $48.00 per night to clean?
    Exactly $44.31 per day... but remember in this end of the business always think and talk 'monthly.'

    To get an exact price: Take the $960.00 X 12 (months) then divide by 260 (days in a year for 5 days per week)= $44.31 rounding.

    You are also saying that most commercial bids are monthly and that you should start hourly? Do you use that to determine the monthly price?
    Yes, break it down always, you can see SO much more this way. Figure your price in detail then always convert to monthly for your bidding purposes. If you start talking to commercial clients in anything else but monthly or annual they will start questioning your experience.. There is no proven, written thing about this, it's only my experience talking here.


    And what about the sq footage? Now .16 cents is a good bid for sq foot when using your won materials? Or what i stated?
    In this market this will cover your cleaning supplies needed for this job. Consumable supplies such as ; Paper towels, toilet paper, hand soaps, plastic waste bags, feminine products, etc. is best handled by your client. There is very little profit in these items, competitors hold the profit to almost nothing. The 'sweat to reward' just isn't there. Then something is back ordered by the shipper/distributor and you spend all your time on the phone as your client can't wipe their butts. This business is stressful enough, you don't need this pain. You offer to take an inventory every two weeks for them and give them the 'suggested' order. Tell them that they will save money if they purchase it on their own because you would need to mark it up.

    You also state that you out bid chem dry?
    Well, I have been cleaning carpets for a very long time. And I have been to so many seminars that I have lost count.

    Fact: Whatever goes into a carpet can stay in the carpet. No matter what you do, you will, at best, get only 80% of it back out. Think of your kitchen sink... you just cleaned it, it looks great and is clean... but just inches away in the drain trap there are so many germs that you would not want to use your sink Again... The powder will build up over time in the bottom nap of the carpet and will act like sandpaper eventually (although your supplier will not tell you this) and serve to grind and wear that carpet much sooner than necessary. And the wear will begin to show in traffic lanes.

    We only use the hot water extraction method, it sanitizes and cleans as deeply as possible. We have 12 of these commercial machines and they are busy constantly, actually we are considering purchasing several more. There is an art in learning to properly use this method, you can use too much or not enough hot water and either will cause a cleaning, wicking problem.

    Now, have I ever used the dry chem method, yes but rarely. If I have a client with really dirty carpet that just keeps wicking up spots and dirt then I will use it or I will lightly burnish the surface.

    Is this method (hot water extraction) less expensive to the customer? Not always, but close, and I make sure that they understand that their investment is better protected for the long term.

    I have tried doing my research into commercial aspect with books and internet studying but have not come across a adequate example of the prices in my area at all...
    And I don't think that you will... pricing is as close to a personal thing as anything in this business. You must experiment, ask, listen, keep good records and have a gut feel. Go back to my other post about how to find out if you are competitive and profitable.

    Hope this helped, come back and let me know.

    You need to request that Clough get involved with you, he has invaluable information and help that he can offer you.


    ALWAYS REMEMBER: PERSIST WITHOUT EXCEPTION....ALWAYS!

    Stringer
    Cleaningman23's Avatar
    Cleaningman23 Posts: 255, Reputation: 5
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    #19

    Apr 8, 2009, 01:53 PM

    Ok now I understand that this is a monthly system "commercially"

    So your saying that averages to about $44.31 per day.
    Now is that price going to actual cover the employees pay? Is that price with 1-2- or even 3 employees cleaning the building? I am assuming that 6000 sq ft office should not require no longer than 3 hours to clean(basic cleaning)
    Would there be anything that will fluctuate that sq ft price higher or lower?

    My client I had wanted it done once a week.. not five times a week.. since he only wants it done four times a month would that effect the price I charge him? Should I charge him 20 cents? When would a discounted price apply

    Now that I think about it also. Another question that the customer asked when I went on the estimate was if I had a steam machine and I stated that I had the dry clean carpet method. Could that have been another reason?

    THANK YOU FOR YOUR HELP ONCE AGAIN! I HAVE JOTTED SOME OF THIS DOWN FOR MY NOTES IN THE FUTURE!
    Stringer's Avatar
    Stringer Posts: 3,733, Reputation: 770
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    #20

    Apr 20, 2009, 05:52 PM

    #1 If you use one person for three hours, fine... use three and they will have to complete it using an hour each. Total hours dedicated is... 3. Yes that should cover you, but remember, YOU are responsible for all your pricing, not me.

    #2 If the building is obviously empty... sq ft price is less... density dictates pricing.

    #3 Volume always dictates pricing... frequency does also... like I said prior, I do not go after less than 5 day contracts... If you are cleaning less than 5 days... charge a little more. More dirt, more washroom usage, more garbage, etc.

    #4 It is hard to say what the reason was CM, (Could have been anything, even you confidence level... and how you presented yourself.)) but arriving at the best cleaning methods in general is a good idea... always be learning...

    Stringer

    Please rate my answers if they helped you at all, thanks.

    Stringer

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