[jlisenbe]

Just as I figured, WG. You will not answer the questions. I suppose it is because it might require you to actually think about what you believe, and that would require courage.

I'm guessing a c-section would be done. Why would the doctor cut up a dead baby? Or even a living baby? That's not how it's done. (Are you reading Stephen King again???)

Actually, that is exactly how it is done in second trimester abortions. They cut up and remove a living baby. It's called dilation and evacuation. You don't know the subject, and that is part of the problem. You find it much easier to simply bury your head in the sand and remain ignorant, and that is appalling.

I am against abortions personally and that's my business,

Why are you personally against abortions, Tal?

Honestly, as two confessing Christians, I cannot understand how you two are so content to stand on the sidelines and do nothing. I guess that is necessary for you to stick to your liberal political philosophy. Politics above ethics. If you took a genuine position against abortion, you might have to actually be critical of Obama or HC, and you are unwilling to even consider doing that. What a tragedy.

Yes, WG. I know you are a registered republican. I frequently don't agree with Tal, but he will at least put his views out there and answer questions. WG, your evasiveness get frustrating. Answer the questions. Put your beliefs on the line for examination.

[jlisenbe]

[talaniman]

Abortion is unnecessary in today's society. There are other options that are healthier and safer, just ask any female that has means and resources. I cannot get pregnant, nor do I ascribe to any religion, but I think any woman has a right to plan there own family, and make their own choices, within very reasonable limits, one being early in the first trimester, cases of rape or incest, and medical considerations for the health of the mother. Science has evolved and given us many options, and indeed the data has shown abortions falling steadily, especially among young teens. I think we should evolve and use those new options. The only women that those choices can be taken away from are the poor who are neither as aware of the options, or cannot afford them as indeed many poor females have support for their decisions and that matters.

I must point out though JL, the notion of choice is not just a democrat or liberal thang and many church going conservative republicans are prochoice, and pro gay marriage also. Been that way for a long time and likely always will be. You would do well I think to get facts and review data rather than presume assume and pigeon hole people into neat categories for judgement. So, I ain't buying and totally reject the notion that God appoints our leaders. Just saying.

[talaniman]

[paraclete]

. So, I ain't buying and totally reject the notion that God appoints our leaders. Just saying.

So your Obama wasn't God appointed, well I understand that, and Hilliary certainly wasn't.

Why is it you contradict Scripture, do you only believe what you want to believe?

Romans 13.1

Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.

[talaniman]

I don't consider any bible the word of God, but the words of ancient man, though ALL have wisdoms and insights for the order of man that can apply today, and it's flawed, as the humans that wrote it, and those that read it, and those that try to understand it.

My personal relationship with a God that I understand requires no book of instruction, but if that's what you need then go for it. You should know by now you have to do more than quote scripture to convince me of anything. As for the dufus being the cohead of our government, bound to happen sooner or later and before him we had Nixon so turds can ascend to high office, and be flushed just as fast.

Doesn't bother me a bit what you beleive Clete, or JL or anybody else. You can beleive whatever you want it's all good to me...well for the most part anyway.

[Wondergirl]

Abortion is unnecessary in today's society. There are other options that are healthier and safer, just ask any female that has means and resources. I cannot get pregnant, nor do I ascribe to any religion, but I think any woman has a right to plan there own family, and make their own choices, within very reasonable limits, one being early in the first trimester, cases of rape or incest, and medical considerations for the health of the mother. Science has evolved and given us many options, and indeed the data has shown abortions falling steadily, especially among young teens. I think we should evolve and use those new options. The only women that those choices can be taken away from are the poor who are neither as aware of the options, or cannot afford them as indeed many poor females have support for their decisions and that matters.

I must point out though JL, the notion of choice is not just a democrat or liberal thang and many church going conservative republicans are prochoice, and pro gay marriage also. Been that way for a long time and likely always will be. You would do well I think to get facts and review data rather than presume assume and pigeon hole people into neat categories for judgement. So, I ain't buying and totally reject the notion that God appoints our leaders. Just saying.

A thousand greenies!

[Wondergirl]

Just as I figured, WG. You will not answer the questions. I suppose it is because it might require you to actually think about what you believe, and that would require courage.

I thought you said you're a Christian. If you are, why the insults and shaming?

[jlisenbe]

I thought you said you're a Christian. If you are, why the insults and shaming?

Why not answer the questions? What are you afraid of?

I don't mean to be ugly to you. I guess you have your reasons for your consistent evasiveness. I have beliefs that I am not only unafraid to defend, but even eager to do so, so I guess I think everyone is that way, but evidently not. Honestly, I don't like discussing things with you because of that never-ending unwillingness to be honest and courageous enough to really state your beliefs openly.

Well, you won't answer the questions, so that's it. I think you won't because you know there are no good answers to those questions. When it comes down to how to kill a third trimester baby, it leaves most honest people speechless. It is horrifying.

[Athos]

I thought you said you're a Christian. If you are, why the insults and shaming?

A thousand greenies!

[Wondergirl]

Why not answer the questions? What are you afraid of?

Please restate the questions you want answered. I've lost track of them in all this verbiage.

I don't mean to be ugly to you. I guess you have your reasons for your consistent evasiveness. I have beliefs that I am not only unafraid to defend, but even eager to do so, so I guess I think everyone is that way, but evidently not. Honestly, I don't like discussing things with you because of that never-ending unwillingness to be honest and courageous enough to really state your beliefs openly.

Wow! More shaming!

Well, you won't answer the questions, so that's it. I think you won't because you know there are no good answers to those questions. When it comes down to how to kill a third trimester baby, it leaves most honest people speechless. It is horrifying.

Our furnace stopped this afternoon, so my husband and I have been a bit busy. There's freezing rain/sleet headed this way, and we wanted to have heat in the house. Thanks for another bout of shaming.

[jlisenbe]

If it is OK to abort (kill) a living fetus at eight months because you have discovered it is deformed, then would it be OK to kill the baby a week after delivery for the same reason? If not, then why not?

Is it OK for a doctor to perform an abortion for any and all reasons in the final trimester when the baby is viable and able to feel pain? If not, then will you stand against the new law in New York and oppose the governor's support of the proposed law in Virginia?

[Wondergirl]

If it is OK to abort (kill) a living fetus at eight months because you have discovered it is deformed, then would it be OK to kill the baby a week after delivery for the same reason? If not, then why not?

If it is my baby, I would expect to undergo a c-section (depending on the deformity). My pediatrics team would do what they could early on to first make the baby comfortable (if that's an issue) and figure out, with my and my husband's input, what to do immediately to begin to repair or correct the baby's physical problems and what can be done in the future -- or perhaps the disability is so major that just keeping the baby as comfortable as possible will be all that can be done. Nowadays, with medical technology as advanced as it is, there is usually something can be done to improve the situation.

Is it OK for a doctor to perform an abortion for any and all reasons in the final trimester when the baby is viable and able to feel pain? If not, then will you stand against the new law in New York and oppose the governor's support of the proposed law in Virginia?

If the mother's life is at serious risk, then the (at risk) baby may have to be sacrificed as humanely as possible. Medical science has advanced enough that this situation occurs probably very infrequently.

Please read for yourself what that NY law actually says and stop listening to those who have an agenda.

[jlisenbe]

You didn't answer either question.

1. Is it OK to kill a fetus at eight months because it is deformed?

2. Is it OK for a doctor to perform a third trimester abortion for any reason?

The questions are simple. Didn't say your baby. Didn't say the mother's life was at risk. Is vague your maiden name??

[Wondergirl]

You didn't answer either question.

1. Is it OK to kill a fetus at eight months because it is deformed?

2. Is it OK for a doctor to perform a third trimester abortion for any reason?

The questions are simple. Didn't say your baby. Didn't say the mother's life was at risk. Is vague your maiden name??

Your questions are not black or white, and shouldn't demand answers that are yes or no. Okay, I'll do it your way.
1. No.
2. Yes.

[jlisenbe]

Your questions are not black or white, and shouldn't demand answers that are yes or no. Okay, I'll do it your way.
1. No.
2. Yes.

How can you rule out abortions for deformities (question 1) but then say it is OK to have a third trimester abortion for any reason?? Wouldn't that automatically make the answer to question 1 "yes"?

If you agree with abortions for any reason in trimester three, you are saying that a baby can be killed for being the wrong gender, wrong race, not ideal physically, mother simply changed her mind because she got mad at her boyfriend, of any one of dozens of other hideous ideas.

Oh well. At least you did answer the questions. It is not possible to put into words how glad I am that I do not share your views, especially with the knowledge of how third trimester abortions are performed. I am just beyond amazed that you would be in agreement with it, but that is your decision.

• Dilation and Extraction: a surgical abortion procedure used to terminate a pregnancy after 21 weeks of gestation. This procedure is also known as D & X, Intact D & X, Intrauterine Cranial Decompression and Partial Birth Abortion."

[Wondergirl]

You do realize that you cannot answer "no" to question 1 and then answer "yes" to question 2??

Now you're lecturing me on how I answered your poorly worded questions? More shaming?

[jlisenbe]

Not lecturing but questioning. The answer to 1 cannot be no and then answer 2 yes. At least not and be consistent in your thinking. It is a plain contradiction.

Well, if you are comfortable with your position, I don't know what else to say. You believe killing babies is OK up to and including the ninth month. I just don't know what else to say. At least your belief on the matter is plain. I'm just glad to Almighty God I don't have to live with that belief in my own heart. It is heart breaking to me and the greatest tragedy of our day that we will not step up and defend those who absolutely cannot defend themselves. What a cowardly culture we have become.

[paraclete]

Arguing this in an insane world gets nowhere. The rights of women have become a religious belief, they know no God but themselves, something akin to the demonrats

[jlisenbe]

they know no God but themselves

I fear that has become true for many, men and women alike. Another good post.