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duderiffic · Sep 25, 2006, 06:33 PM

Hello

Hi, I'm trying to install a garbage disposal in a 1952 ranch house but I'm having a bit of a plumbing issue. The drain is about 2" higher than the outlet of the diposal. Do I have to get itno the wall and lower than drain down or do I have any other options?

I was thinking that I could lower crossing pipe 2" and the P-trap 2" to make this all work, but then since the outlet for the disposal will be below the drain will that be a problem? See the attached hacked up picture.

Please let me know what you think, if you have any advice for me. :D

Thanks for your help!

speedball1 · Sep 26, 2006, 04:34 AM

Hey Dude,

:"Do I have to get itno the wall and lower than drain down or do I have any other options?"

You ran out of options when you ran out of slope. You can not have backfall.
Sorry but the drain will have to be lowered. Regards, Tom

duderiffic · Sep 26, 2006, 02:12 PM

Tom,

Thank you sincerely for the reply. (Darn gravity :D)

If I may I have a follow-up question, how low should I put the drain? Low enough to use the full elbow the ISE unit has? I'd think as long as it's a few inches below the outlet of the disposer that would be good, but how many inches is a few?

Again I thank you for your help.

speedball1 · Sep 27, 2006, 06:02 AM

"how low should I put the drain? Low enough to use the full elbow the ISE unit has? I'd think as long as it's a few inches below the outlet of the disposer that would be good, but how many inches is a few?"

Back before disposals we roughed in our kitchen sinks at 21" from the floor to the center of the wall stubout. Now we rough them in at 18" off the floor to accommodate a disposal. Since the disposal discharge is a slurry of garbage it's important to have sufficient slope to carry it away.
Good luck, TYom

duderiffic · Sep 27, 2006, 09:34 PM

Tom,

Simple enough... so I'm into the wall now. :D

Now I have a question... there is that kink up there, so I can't really cut directly above the wye-T (if that's what it is actually called) since there is really no space or clean pipe to butt against. I don't know if it's obvious from the picture but the pipe is right against a stud.

What would you do to remove the outgoing section and install the new drain wye-T? Thank you very much for your help, so far I haven't broke anything! :rolleyes:

speedball1 · Sep 28, 2006, 06:47 AM

"What would you do to remove the outgoing section and install the new drain wye-T?"

I would take a Saws-All with a metal blade and make my cut 12 inches below the sanitary tee. I would then cut off or unscrew the sanitary tee from the nipple and toss it
I would convert to PVC using a PVC dresser coupling on the bottom and a female threaded couplimg on top. This frees you up to install a PVC sanitary tee and complete the stubout in PVC and 18" off the floor to center. That's how I would do it! Good luck, Tm

duderiffic · Sep 30, 2006, 07:14 PM

I'm having a very difficult time cutting this.

I'm using a Milwaukee Super Sawzall, but I can only get to one side of it (the right side in the picture) and I haven't been able to cut the back of the pipe (that touches the wall) Any tricks of the trade to get that tight area?

Thanks for your help through this. :)

speedball1 · Oct 1, 2006, 05:43 AM

Would cutting the stud back give you enough room to lay the Saws-All over enough to cut through the back of the pipe? You can always scab the stud back. Cheers, Tom

iamgrowler · Oct 1, 2006, 07:15 AM

You could cut it 3 or 4 inches above the Durham 45 and then starting at the top, use a 1-1/2" No-Hub Band, 1-1/2" ABS 45, and a 1-1/2 Sanitary tee.

And since the wall is already open at this point, stack a 1-1/2 clean-out tee a few inches below the sanitary tee before making the final connection with another 1-1/2" No-Hub band. -- Trust me, having an easily accessible clean out will be a God-Send at a later date.

Also, if this is a brand new disposal, it should have come with a metal collar for attaching the black plastic 90 to the disposal, throw the 90 out and buy a 1-1/2" Flanged-Tailpiece (it's the same type of tailpiece that is attached just under the basket strainer in the picture, only buy one that is at least 18" long.)

iamgrowler · Oct 1, 2006, 08:12 AM

Doh!!

I forgot to warn you about something.

Kitchen vents are sometimes run through the roof by themselves, and the possibility of that vent falling down, especially if it's a straight shot through the roof is a very real one.

Before doing anymore cutting you should strap the vent to the adjacent stud with galvanized plumbers tape.

duderiffic · Oct 1, 2006, 08:16 PM

Where would you attach the plumbers tape to? Should this be removed upon completion?

Can you outline or point me to a source for stud scabbing? I had thought about doing that (removing the stud) but I wasn't sure if that was actually something people did. That would totally fix all the clearence issues and allow me to make the cuts I need to.

I'm not sure if I can cut above that Durham 45 because the bottom of that is more or less even with the basin of the sink so it is almost impossible to get anything (other than a camera lens) up there. :D

Any more input would be great... as always... really appreciate it. :D

duderiffic · Oct 4, 2006, 07:45 AM

What tool would you recommend to cut back the stud? I am looking at cutting a 2" by 2" square out of the back of the stud to finish the cut, I don't have a hole saw, and that seems like probably the best tool... what do you think?

Also, with my limited access how would you recommend securing that pipe? If more pictures would help I could take them.

Thank you. :)

iamgrowler · Oct 4, 2006, 09:08 PM

Originally Posted by duderiffic

What tool would you recommend to cut back the stud? I am looking at cutting a 2" by 2" square out of the back of the stud to finish the cut, I don't have a hole saw, and that seems like probably the best tool... what do you think?

Also, with my limited access how would you recommend securing that pipe? If more pictures would help I could take them.

Thank you. :)

There are some things that simply cannot be described within the limitations of this forum.

I know I could make these cuts without cutting into the adjacent stud -- But I also know that it would take a while, that it would take several mangled sawzall blades, a great deal of cursing and pleading to the deities and most likely a few skinned knuckles.

It's difficult to explain just where the shoe of the sawzall should rest, just as it is difficult to explain the length of the stroke of the sawzall, which is important, because that is the difference between smashing the tip of the sawzall into the interior of the pipe, and plunging through to the exterior of your siding.

There are some things that are simply best left to the professionals, and I think this is one of those things.

Sorry.

duderiffic · Oct 4, 2006, 09:58 PM

Well I got further into the wall and cutting the stud isn't an option. The supply lines are on the other side.

I agree about the professional thing... however I have more time than money at this point in time and I have a bit of a grudge with this pipe... hopefully it doesn't turn into a hole in the outside of the house.

Either way, whatever I do I'll post another message. Just for completeness, and to let a total another person such as myself looking into doing this know what they're getting into. :)

speedball1 · Oct 5, 2006, 06:57 AM

Growler hit a nerve when he warned you about securing the vent.
"I forgot to warn you about something.
Kitchen vents are sometimes run through the roof by themselves, and the possibility of that vent falling down, especially if it's a straight shot through the roof is a very real one.
Before doing anymore cutting you should strap the vent to the adjacent stud with galvanized plumbers tape."

If there's a window in front of the sink then there's a horizontal arm inside the wall running through the studs that will help support the vent pipe. However, The vent should be strapped and secured to the studs with "galvanized plumbers tape" which is nothing more then metal perforated strapping tape in a roll that can be purchased at any plumbing or hardware store.
Which brings up the question. Since you're going to hafta, (1) open up the wall and secure the vent. (2) cut and lower the stubout. (3) reconfigure the drainage to accept a disposal unit.
Is tearing up your kitchen for the privilege of introducing garbage in your drainage system worth the hassle? As you might have figured out by now I am no fan of garbage disposals. Too often the kitchen is tied in with the washer drain and the resulting clog of garbage matted with grease and fiber from the washer keeps us busy snaking out the drain liines.
Having said that I will help you all I can to get your disposal installed and working. Regards, Tom

duderiffic · Oct 13, 2006, 08:43 AM

Tom,

I made sure to toss a shim under that vent where it cross the stud and did my best to wrap plumbers tape around it to secure it to the stud.

I finally got that pipe out after MANY hours of cutting on my back with that mini-hacksaw. The rest of pretty simple after that. No leaks or anything (yet) and the disposal is working just great. Thanks so much for your help I couldn't have done it without you.

iamgrowler · Oct 13, 2006, 05:08 PM

Originally Posted by duderiffic

Tom,

I made sure to toss a shim under that vent where it cross the stud and did my best to wrap plumbers tape around it to secure it to the stud.

I finally got that pipe out after MANY hours of cutting on my back with that mini-hacksaw. The rest of pretty simple after that. No leaks or anything (yet) and the disposal is working just great. Thanks so much for your help I couldn't have done it without you.

Nice job.

But you neglected to put in a clean-out tee.

duderiffic · Oct 14, 2006, 09:13 AM

There is one below it outside... is that normal?

iamgrowler · Oct 14, 2006, 09:23 AM

Originally Posted by duderiffic

There is one below it outside... is that normal?

Poking out of the siding?

If so, then yes, this is normal.

Sorry for sounding so snarky, but clean-outs, especially on an older undersized kitchen sink drain with a garbage disposal are a pet peeve of mine.

My advice to you would be to run lots of hot water down the disposal when you run it and for about 8 or 9 seconds after you switch it off.