[geekpipe]

Hi,

I have a second floor bathroom that is 6 feet wide. Toilet is on left side wall and looks to be a foot away from wall. I want to move toilet to the right side wall. So this would require a move of about 4 feet. Two things need to happen of course: water supply must be available and the drain as well.

Looks to be 3/4 inch plywood subfloor. When I rip it up, is it possible to just extend the waste pipe drain to meet the new position or does it need to be pitched properly? I guess I should ask is this possible at all to move it this far and what things do I need to account for (vent?). I am very handy just lack the proper knowledge.

Second is to run water to this wall. There is water lines on the left wall, and none on the right wall. This would require running a pipe along the exterior wall. Is this OK? How do I tap into a copper water line without water gushing all over the house?

Thanks kevin

[speedball1]

Hi Kevin,
"is it possible to just extend the waste pipe drain to meet the new position or does it need to be pitched properly? I guess I should ask is this possible at all to move it this far and what things do I need to account for (vent?).

First take up the toilet and then the floor. You may now remove the closet bend and extend the drain pitching it 14" to the foot. You will not need to vent the toilet in its new location

"Second is to run water to this wall. There is water lines on the left wall, and none on the right wall. This would require running a pipe along the exterior wall. Is this ok?"

Yes it is, but why not extend the water supply from the old stubout under the floor right along side of the drainage.

"How do I tap into a copper water line without water gushing all over the house?"

You shut the entire house down at the house shut off or the meter stop.

Good luck, Tom

[geekpipe]

Thanks Tom!

I ripped up the plywood. I now see what is going on but not sure how to tackle it. I have posted a picture here:

http://prourl.com/bfloor1.jpg WARNING LARGE IMAGE =500k

Hopefully you can see on the left side the bottom corner is the old vanity hot & cold. Towards top on left you see water line for toilet and toilet waste pipe flange. Seems toilet waste pipe is tied in with shower drain... to the main waste pipe? Then is a series of studs on top of joists? Of course these run front to back and I would like have to cut into the floor joists to get the bowl waste pipe over there. Maybe it is easier to move the vanity to that wall? Other problem is there is a recessed light on the right side near where the bowl would be but not sure if this is a problem?

Once I get this then I can figure out the water line issue.

Thanks so much... any advice is greatly appreciated.

Kevin

[speedball1]

Hi Kevin,
No joy with your picture. It won't show much beyond the closet bend and flange. Can you possibly take another? Regards, Tom

[geekpipe]

Hi Tom...

What kind of pictures do you need? What are you looking to see?

Thanks!

[speedball1]

Hi Tom....

What kind of pictures do you need? What are you looking to see?

thanks!

I can't see anything from the closet bend/flange to the left of the room. I need to see the whole room. Cheers, Tom

[geekpipe]

OK the shower and floor is not out under it.. can to that tonight... again I appreciate you taking the time to help me :)

[geekpipe]

OK tried running this myself but cannot get it right. So many water lines and pipes under floor. Spend hundreds of $$ and 2 full days trying to do this and now toilet flange sits way too high above floor... not sure what to do next other than call in a plumber which will be 500-1000.

I posted pics here to illustrate what is happening. There are water lines all throughout the floor. I got the toilet moved but since beams are there I have no way to make flange sit flush. So now I found another crazy way to run it but there is a hihat light so close. Is it safe to run PVC so close to a hihat light?

Here are pics: PICS ARE 800K EACH

http://prourl.com/floor1.jpg

In this one toilet is trying to go to top right side. Double beam there so can't angle flange right way.

http://prourl.com/floor2.jpg

http://prourl.com/floor3.jpg
This picture shows where the toilet should go.. top right where it says poop. Now there are two beams right before it so when I run pipe across it I have no room for anything such as elbow or flange. So I cut it back and started wrapping it down the floor but now I will run into the hihat light for my kitchen below. There is like a half inch space between pipe and light which I did not think was good. So what to do? I hope not to call in a plumber...

Since so many lines/pipes in pic I will try to explain them. Just let me know.

I really could use all help. I am all beat up physically and lost my 2 days off trying to save some $$ when I ended up losing more.

Thanks kevin

[geekpipe]

Just went to Lowe's and found a flange with 45 degree bend but can someone look at the floor pics as they don't seem right...

Look one post above for links.

Thanks kevin

[speedball1]

OK Kevin,

I guess if you can shave the beam down to where you can fit the 45 degree flange in and a 1/8th bend to level it out won't bring it too low you could fit in in.

However I see mistakes and errors that should be addressed.
(1) Starting with the lavatory. You have built a illegal "S" trap with the drain.
You should have picked up the lav with a 3 X 1/2" Sanitary tee about 3/8ths. lower then the stubout.
(2) Double fittings work just dandy when they're placed vertically. The discharge hits the bend in the throat and gravity takes it down the stack.
However, laid on its back is a different story. Since the toilets discharge will run right into the lowest opening in the bathroom what's to stop the discharge, including the solids and paper from shooting directly across and building up a clog or just draining over into the tub/shower trap?
You should have used 2 combination wye and eighth bends and connected the tub/shower upstream from the toilet.
(3) What in the world is that maze of 2" elbos draining that set under the 3" toilet run? I see return bends, dog legs and offsets. What's all that?
kevin you should have got a plumber in for a hour or so and paid him for a service call to help you with the layout and material list after you opened up the floor. Changing the water pipe will be easy but you're going to hafta rework the drainage. Sorry to be the one to rain on your parade but In wish you had brought me in sooner. Good luck, Tom

[geekpipe]

HI

Called in the plumber and he was shocked as to what he saw which I expected. First thing is he is going to sister some lumber to make sure everything is structurally sound. Next he mentioned he would be reworking the whole maze of pipes, lines and so on. His words were he was going to rough in everything but the priced kind of shocked me... $1500 as he said it will take 1-2 days to do everything the right way. For that price he is also doing the structural parts (which I provide) and also setting up the shower base. In NY seems the rate is $100+ an hour which to me is crazy lol..

Anyway, I am waiting for a call back to go over exactly what he will be doing, what I provide and what will be the expected result. For that price I want to walk in and see everything tied up including all lines for the shower (drain, and base installed), toilet (in new spot with water line), vanity lines (hot, cold, and drain), and baseboard raised as he mentioned floor might have to be raised slightly. He also asked if I had plywood so as to do the floor. If he does that I will ask him to throw down the 3x5 wonderboard sheets I have to have it ready for tile.

My questions are:

1. what else should I insist on or be looking for when he does this work. I won't be here but wife (who is quite knowledgeable about construction) will be here. She will be making sure it is all done along with pictures.

2. I always wanted a shower base that was not one of those fiberglass ones you buy but someone to build it so I can tile it. Plumber mentions it would be very expensive as compared to a fiberglass base which is $120. Why is it so expensive and how much more could I expect the rough in of the tile base to be - size is 3 x3. Or is this job for tile man?

3. when he says he is going to rough in everything does this include moving the hot and cold and drain pipe for the vanity? I told him what I was doing and where but didn't specifically mention this. I will surely tell him before proceeding but how difficult is it to move hot and cold lines in the wall 2 feet to the right? We had a 2 foot vanity in the middle of one wall and this will be replaced by a 4 foot vanity so the pipes are not in the right spot for the sink.

4. Is that price very high?

Thanks
Kevin

[speedball1]

Hey Kevin,
I think your decision to call in outside help was wise. Had you have brought me in at the start I could have walked you through the rough in a step at a time. But you're on the right track now.
1. "What else should I insist on or be looking for when he does this work. I wont be here but wife (who is quite knowledgeable about construction) will be here. She will be making sure it is all done along with pictures."

It's out of your hands now. Your only concern should be where you wish the fixtures placed.

"2. I always wanted a shower base that was not one of those fiberglass ones you buy but someone to build it so I can tile it. Plumber mentions it would be very expensive as compared to a fiberglass base which is $120. Why is it so expensive and how much more could I expect the rough in of the tile base to be - size is 3 x3. Or is this job for tile man?"

A custom tile shower costs more because there's so much more labor and so many more treads involved.
First a carpenter frames the shower base around the shower stub up and studs out for drywall or cement board for a enclosure. Then the plumber installs a flange type shower drain and forms the plastic shower pan. Next drywallers come in and form the enclosure and then the tile man comes in and tiles the base and walls. The labor's the reason for the differences in cost.

3. "When he says he is going to rough in everything does this include moving the hot and cold and drain pipe for the vanity? I told him what I was doing and where but didnt specifically mention this. I will surely tell him before proceeding but how difficult is it to move hot and cold lines in the wall 2 feet to the right? We had a 2 foot vanity in the middle of one wall and this will be replaced by a 4 foot vanity so the pipes are not in the right spot for the sink."

How much is included in the rough in should be decided upon before he starts the job. Plumbing work follows three phases.
Rough in, which includes running the drainage and stubbing up the water lines and doing a static water test on the drainage. For the inspector.
2nd Rough and tub set, which include bring up the water pipes and stubbing them out in position. Also setting the tub or building the shower. This is also inspected before moving on.
And last the trim out stage. This is where the fixtures get set and connected, tested and the job gets a final inspection.
Be very sure that you're on the same page as the plumber about what he's to do and what you will do. A contract will help to avoid any differences.

4. "Is that price very high?"

I don't get into prices. Different areas, union or non-union will determine the labor price. I just help with the job itself and not the cost of installation.
Good luck and if you have more questions I'm as close as a click. Tom