[DanPatrick10]

I believe my 4th amendment rights were violated and I want to sue the state for damages. I believe I have sufficient evidence for a case, but the nature of the case is not popular among many lawyers. Therefore, I want to do it by myself. Is this possible to do without a lawyer? What forms does one usually need and where does one obtain those forms? Would this be a small claim or Supreme Court case?

[Hazel1220]

Have you searched free legal advice in your area? Before pursuing it might be best to really educate yourself on the amendment and to make sure you have a case. These kinds of cases usually go unprosecuted for many reasons but if you have a solid caes then I personally say go for it!
Ihave an expereince where my 4th was violated but I did not prosecute because the man scared me into thinking I would get charged and had no case. I do not know about the forms all I can say is BE PREPARED! Educate yourself in EVERY way possible.Read read read.

[excon]

Hello Dan:

Tell me more, and I'll tell you where to file, or whether you SHOULD file.

excon

[bobloblaw]

If an attorney declines your case, its because they don't believe they can win it. If multiple attorneys decline your case... Then multiple legal professionals think you have no case. But you still are SURE you want to continue?

[macdabby]

I say go for it - I'm not sure what your claim it - yes research it and make sure it's valid - but the government is really taking advantage of people right now - esp since they know that many of these cases never make it into court. I think the reason for that is not that the attorneys don't think you can't win, but that they are so thirsty for money that they don't want to take a case where there would be no reward. From what I can see, if you sue a state based on a violation of rights, you can sometimes only get them to correct that and you won't get much cash out of it.

If you are suing the state you first need to find out if you can do it in Federal court (go straight for the jugular) or if you have to do it in state court. There is a cover sheet you need to get, but the complain itself needs to be written up like a letter almost with all kinds of special formatting rules, leaving space for the court clerk to stamp it on the front page. You need to list your "case of actions" and what you are requesting the court to do about it, then sign it under penalty of perjury. Google some complaints and you can find a few PDFs of actual complaints and try to mimic them. Each court has it's own rules on how the complaint should look, so look up the courts website and see if you can find it there. Be prepared to spend a lot of time on it - in LA Superior court, they don't even have the cover sheet on their website - just the cover sheet adendum (stupid if you ask me) so I have to get the cover sheet from the court.

Also Google for other people to see if anyone has had a similar complaint - see if they won or lost and why. Look up "case law" where another court has made a decision. Such as the spreme court which usually has something on it like "327 US 180" at the end. Cite as many supreme court cases as you can, a lower court can't oppose those decisions. Also see if you can find statutes that were violated... kind of like the 4th amendment you are claiming.

Remember, you must be actually damaged - so if it was an illegal search, you have to show that you were damaged by that search (mentally, property was damaged, or even if it held you up and prevented you from getting to where you were going on time and caused you to lose money)

GOOD LUCK!

[ScottGem]

Unlawful search and seiuzure is very hard to prove. First it must be willful, not just a mistaken address. Second, for you to sue, you would have to show damages. How were you damaged.

Of course you can represent yourself. But that further decreases your chance of winning.

[macdabby]

Don't forget to ask for a fee waiver so you don't have to pay the $350. Yes your chances are decreased by not using an attorney, but if it's the only way you can afford to do it, then do it! Just do lots of research. Very first, see if you can find out the statute of limitations on your claim, so you know how much time you have to file. Once you file you will have to serve the paperwork to the state - I assume to the district attorney - I am in the process of suing my state as well, so I'm still researching some of this. Make friends with some attorneys, even if they are in a different area of law, they might have some good info for you.

I realize the original post is dated way back, but I'm putting this information here for anyone who stumbles across it like I did. I realize its not complete, but hopefully we can all do some research and make this complicated system easy to understand. Once they become vulnerable to attack for their illegal actions, they will have to stop.

[excon]

Hello mac:

Look. I'm big on stopping the cops from their illegal actions... But, suing them for a Fourth Amendment violation makes NO sense...

The proper venue for slapping them down is a suppression hearing. That STOPS them from using ILLEGALLY OBTAINED evidence. Does that mean they won't do it again?? Nahhh. Cops are cops, and neither you or I are going to change them.

If they illegally TOOK things from the original OP, and won't return them, there's a much simpler procedure to get those things back short of suing. That's why I asked him to elaborate, but he didn't.

excon

[macdabby]

I agree that unless he was actually damaged, there isn't much he can do - but I have to disagree where you say cops will be cops. Yes, cops will be cops, but, the state hires them, and sets how many to hire, and tells them how to do their job. If the state were to start losing so many lawsuits because the cops are going around hurting people, they will be under political pressure from all of the people to stop doing that - after all, we have to pay for those losses in taxes (and I mean sales taxes, etc, because I am one of those nuts that feels that we shouldn't be paying income tax in the first place). But for us to just sit there and let it happen, will allow them to slowly continue to chip away at our rights.

Look at this - if I break a law and don't wear my seatbelt, nobody is harmed, but I'm asked to pay a fine. If the government starts digging through people's personal property without cause or warrant, there is no penalty? Even if he is not harmed?

The system is not in the favor of the general public and that needs to be changed. This country was created by the people and for the people, not by a bureaucracy and for the abuse of it's people. There weren't really any big city police forces back when this country was created, and for a good reason. A police force falls into the category of an armed army. This is a police state. It needs to end.

I'm not saying there shouldn't be police at all, but I am saying that their power needs to be limited and those limitations need to be enforced properly.

[excon]

Hello mac:

I don't disagree with your sentiments... It's just what we DO about it that differs. Me? I'm going to spend my time trying to elect people who'll change it from the TOP. Suing them one on one, even if you win, ain't going to effect much change.

Don't get me wrong. I LOVED kicking their a$$es every time I did it, and I did it plenty.

excon

[ScottGem]

look at this - if i break a law and don't wear my seatbelt, nobody is harmed, but im asked to pay a fine.

I disagree that no one is harmed. If you decline to wear your seatbelt and are involved in an accident, not wearing your seatbelt could increase your chances of injury. This means you might need a greater degree of medical care. The cost of that care will be borne by an insurance company or, possibly, the state. This may result in increased insurance rates and/or taxes.

Our society is very interconnected. Actions that might seemingly only affect an individual could have a ripple effect throughout society.

[macdabby]

I agree that would be an excellent way to do it, unfortunately most of the people I see running are the same corrupt bribe able people that screwed up the system in the first place. It's people like you and me that should be running, not career politicians - but they are the one's who win because most people don't know what they are voting for, they are blinded by the smoke and mirrors.. and the media. I believe the best candidate we had so far was Ron Paul. Although I saw a few stickers around, I never even knew who he was until well after the primaries were over. Then I see all these claims that (without getting too far into the conspiracy theories) fox and a few other channels intentionally kept him out of debates and other news.

I guess the best solution is really to attack as best we can from both ends.

[macdabby]

Which brings up a good point, a little off topic. I was just pulled over for not wearing a seatbelt, while driving under necessity with a suspended license. So they towed my car. I was cited and told to go to the LA metro court, but that's only traffic. So I am going to try to file my cross claim in the LA metro civil (a different building). It's me as the cross plaintiff, v California as the cross defendant. Basically I am suing to have the 30 day hold pulled off my car, and to make the state or city pay for the towing and storage fees, since there was another licensed driver in the car who could have taken it.

Also I've been looking into this sovereign citizen movement, where the supreme court has upheld that it is a right to travel with your property (your car) and not a privilege, and so long as it's not for commercial purposes, the state can not limit or force you to get a permit for that right.

Any advice on filing this cross complaint? I had to write it out myself and I hope I have everything in there.

[ScottGem]

There is a difference between allowing you to travel with property and allowing you to operate that property.