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Sunday or Saturday?
I live by the Bible and the Bible only. If something can't be proved with the Bible I won't believe it. Can someone give me any Biblical evidence that the day of worship was changed from Saturday to Sunday?
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The Bible says that the day of the Sabbath no longer matters and that no one is to judge anyone with respect to the day of the Sabbath, because the Sabbath was prophetic of the coming of Christ and is fulfilled in Him.
Col 2:15-17 16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ. NKJV |
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 Originally Posted by Tj3
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Have you read this thread: https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/christ...ay-255389.html ?
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Originally Posted by willyb78
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Originally Posted by willyb78
Matthew 18 18 Amen I say to you, whatsoever you shall bind upon earth, shall be bound also in heaven; and whatsoever you shall loose upon earth, shall be loosed also in heaven. This is seen even in Apostolic Times that the Church began to assemble on the First day of the Week, which is Sunday: Acts Of Apostles 20 7 And on the first day of the week, when we were assembled to break bread, Paul discoursed with them, being to depart on the morrow: and he continued his speech until midnight. Sincerely, De Maria |
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Originally Posted by De Maria
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Originally Posted by Tj3
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Originally Posted by De Maria
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Originally Posted by willyb78
Acts 20:7-8 7 Now on the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul, ready to depart the next day, spoke to them and continued his message until midnight. NKJV 1 Cor 16:2-3 2 On the first day of the week let each one of you lay something aside, storing up as he may prosper, that there be no collections when I come. NKJV
Those same Christians call Sunday "the Sabbath".
As a related aside, I find that many people who feel that the Sabbath is important to keep are only referring to one of the Sabbaths - the seventh day (Saturday), but these same people typically do not keep the other Sabbaths which were commanded in Old Covenant law.
Also, the text you gave says nothing about the Sabbath day not being required anymore. It just says that we shouldn't judge those who don't worship on the day that you do. It doesn't say that the Sabbath isn't important or that it doesn't matter what day you choose, it just says not to judge
Now, to understand why the Sabbath no longer needs to be kept, we need to examine what scripture says the purpose of the Sabbath was, and indeed, since this is part of the law, what the purpose of the law is. Another member on this thread pointed you to another recent thread on the same topic, and I would highly recommend that you read through that thread (it is short) to avoid unnecessary repetition. The Sabbath was prophetic of Christ. Just as Passover was prophetic of the sacrifice of His blood for our sins. That is what scripture tells us in these passages: Col 2:16-18 16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 wWhich are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ. NKJV The fact that He established the prophesies of Christ's coming in the Old Testament rituals speaks volumes about God's perfect knowledge. Indeed, we also see in Galatians 3 and others that Jesus was the fulfillment of the law. The law (including the laws about the Sabbaths) were put in place to point us to Christ. The Sabbath was part of the law which was fulfilled in Christ. Matt 5:17-18 17 "Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. NKJV The remainder of the law also serves a purpose which is to show us how far we are from meeting God's standards Gal 3:19-22 19 What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. 20 Now a mediator does not mediate for one only, but God is one. 21 Is the law then against the promises of God? Certainly not! For if there had been a law given which could have given life, truly righteousness would have been by the law. 22 But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. NKJV And the fact that we cannot be saved through the law because no one have ever kept the law perfectly (Rom 3:23). That is why Jesus has to come. But once we have received Him as Lord and Saviour, we no longer are under the law because the law has been written in our hearts through the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. Gal 3:23-25 23 But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. 24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor. NKJV The law is for the unrighteous (unsaved), not those who are saved: 1 Tim 1:8-11 9 knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, 10 for fornicators, for sodomites, for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine, 11 according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God which was committed to my trust. NKJV We no longer are under the letter of the law which we could not obey, but rather the Holy Spirit indwells us and helps us to obey the spirit of the law. Jer 31:33-34 33 But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. NKJV And because we who are saved are no longer under the law, and the law (specifically the Sabbath since that it the topic of your question), we are no longer judged according to whether we keep the Sabbaths or when we kept the Sabbaths. We who are in Christ have received the fulfillment of our Sabbath rest in Jesus. |
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Originally Posted by willyb78
Ex 16:29-30 Or the LORD has given you the Sabbath; therefore He gives you on the sixth day bread for two days. Let every man remain in his place; let no man go out of his place on the seventh day." 30 So the people rested on the seventh day. NKJV |
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Originally Posted by willyb78
Also, the Bible verse in Acts 20 doesn't say that they were worshiping,
The Liturgy of the Mass has always been first the reading of Scripture and then the "breaking of the bread" otherwise known as Communion, the participation in the Eucharistic sacrifice. Here's the rest of the context of that verse: Acts Of Apostles 20 7 And on the first day of the week, when we were assembled to break bread, Paul discoursed with them, being to depart on the morrow: and he continued his speech until midnight....11 Then going up, and breaking bread and tasting, and having talked a long time to them, until daylight, so he departed. Note how first he taught and then he broke bread and tasted. We only get a taste of the consecrated bread and a taste of the consecrated wine. Here's another more brief description of the Mass. Acts Of Apostles 2 42 And they were persevering in the doctrine of the apostles, and in the communication of the breaking of bread, and in prayers.
it is just saying that they gathered to break bread. People gather on the first day of the week all the time for prayer meetings, bible studies and whatnot, but when I read this, I don't get the impression that they are worshiping as on the Sabbath day
Hebrews 10 22 Let us draw near with a true heart in fulness of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with clean water. 23 Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering (for he is faithful that hath promised), 24 And let us consider one another, to provoke unto charity and to good works: 25 Not forsaking our assembly, as some are accustomed; but comforting one another, and so much the more as you see the day approaching. 26 For if we sin wilfully after having the knowledge of the truth, there is now left no sacrifice for sins, 27 But a certain dreadful expectation of judgment, and the rage of a fire which shall consume the adversaries. 28 A man making void the law of Moses, dieth without any mercy under two or three witnesses: 29 How much more, do you think he deserveth worse punishments, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath esteemed the blood of the testament unclean, by which he was sanctified, and hath offered an affront to the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know him that hath said: Vengeance belongeth to me, and I will repay. And again: The Lord shall judge his people. Sincerely, De Maria |
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Originally Posted by Tj3
Mark 1 21 And they entered into Capharnaum, and forthwith upon the sabbath days going into the synagogue, he taught them. Mark 6 2 And when the sabbath was come, he began to teach in the synagogue: and many hearing him were in admiration at his doctrine, saying: How came this man by all these things? and what wisdom is this that is given to him, and such mighty works as are wrought by his hands? Luke 4 16 And he came to Nazareth, where he was brought up: and he went into the synagogue, according to his custom, on the sabbath day; and he rose up to read. Luke 4 31 And he went down into Capharnaum, a city of Galilee, and there he taught them on the sabbath days. Luke 6 6 And it came to pass also on another sabbath, that he entered into the synagogue, and taught. And there was a man, whose right hand was withered. Acts Of Apostles 13 27 For they that inhabited Jerusalem, and the rulers thereof, not knowing him, nor the voices of the prophets, which are read every sabbath, judging him have fulfilled them. Sincerely, De Maria |
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Originally Posted by De Maria
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Originally Posted by De Maria
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Rest on the seventh day, it does not matter whether it is on a Saturday or Sunday. As long as one day is set aside per week to rest.
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The disciples broke bread together many times, not just on Sunday or Saturday for that matter, but there was no hint of the changing of the weekly rest. Paul, Barnabas and all the other apostles kept the seventh day sabbath, so the notion that because they met one day to break bread means the holy day wasn't kept is a fallacy. Read in Acts chapter 13 for example. The Jews listened every Sabbath in the synagogue to hear the word of God. Then, if you read into verse 44, it describes the "whole city", Gentiles as well as Jews, coming to the synagogue to listen to the word of God. Also, one simple instance when the Sabbath was mentioned in the New Testament, which the Sunday keepers like to say that the Sabbath is the only commandment not restated in the new testament, is when Mary Magdalene comes to embalm the body of Jesus in Luke 23:56. They actually stopped embalming the saviour of the world to keep the commandment! I stop to think of how I don't even guard the edges of the Sabbath when something isn't important, much less something of this magnitude! This simple example shows that even after the work of Christ was fulfilled as the spotless lamb, the commandment still holds. Regarding laying aside money on the first day of the week; since when is that a commandment to keep holy the first day? He's merely talking about setting the money aside so he can pick it up and take it to the believers in Jerusalem. This is a weak argument. We do not keep the monthly, yearly, or other periodic Sabbaths because they were given as part of the law of Moses for the Israelites. Hebrew as I understand, does not have another word for rest that would differentiate the weekly Sabbath from the ceremonial Sabbath. One key element of the Sabbath that many Sunday keepers don't take into account is this: the Sabbath was given at creation, in Genesis 2, BEFORE sin entered the world, just as Marriage between a man and a woman was instituted before sin. If something was made before sin, why would there be a need to change it? Also, he is trying to say that we should FORGET the only commandment that begins with the word REMEMBER, referring to creation. But keep the other 9? It's not logical. He then begins to get into the law/grace debate. He essentially is saying in a roundabout way that the law is abolished. Of course, he must quote scripture when he states that we're under grace, but he is saying the law is gone. Remember the story of Joseph and Potifar's wife? Joseph new adultery was a sin. This was LONG before the ten commandments were written. How did he know? God's law was passed down the ages from father to son by word of mouth. Moses had a lot of new rules given to him at Sinai, but he had a lot of old rules restated as well. The clean and unclean meats law is one good example. Noah was instructed to lead the clean animals in by sevens and the unclean by twos. Noah was not Jewish! He came long before Abraham and the Jewish nation. The Sabbath pointed back to God's creative genius, hence the first word of the 4th commandment, "REMEMBER". The Sabbath was not a shadow, because it came before the system of shadows was instated. Another thought: did God need to rest on the 7th day? He's God. He doesn't sleep, nor needs to. He did this for our benefit, so that we might follow his example. Galatians 3, that he quotes, says "the law was added because of our transgressions." It was added because we didn't obey Him in the first place! He got tired of us disobeying his word that was verbally passed down, so He wrote it on stone so we wouldn't forget it! Then, because we still wouldn't obey it, he wrote the same law on our hearts and gave us the Holy Spirit to give us power to obey it! But still... some people just refuse to obey even now! Unbelievable! There is ceremonial law and then there is the everlasting covenenant described in Deuteronomy as the 10 commandments. We must not get them confused. The ten commandments will never be erased, for they were not a shadow. The ceremonial laws were shadows, because they had us jumping through all the hoops to show us how a perfect sacrifice must be treated. Another great point on the law and the keeping of the law: If we don't believe that we have a Redeemer who not only conquered sin's consequences for us, but also gives us the power to conquer sin's power in our lives, then we are essentially saying our deciever is stronger than our Redeemer! Sobering words, huh? And if we say sin is just too strong, and God's law is just too hard to follow, then exactly which sin is it that has you by the throat and you have no power to resist? We are called to be holy, just as our Father is holy. Read in Romans where Paul directly says "do not sin. But if you sin, you have an intercessor that you can plead to." (not an exact quote) We can come directly to our High Priest. Why? Because he calls us priests of a royal priesthood (1 Peter) We don't have to plead a literal lambs blood, but we plead Christ's. The lamb was the shadow of the real LAMB. And regarding the letter of the law versus the "spirit" of the law. Name one law that you can break the letter but not the spirit. You murder someone with a happy spirit? You cheat on your wife with a fantastic woman of God? You steal something from the rich and give it to the poor? LUDICROUS! Do you get the idea? It's impossible to obey the spirit and not the letter. This is Jesuit teaching. They teach that as long as your needs are met, you can have someone steal something from you and it's OK. etc. Remember, not all those who cry Lord! Lord! Will be saved. One last FANTASTIC point that I'll make before I go to bed. We are saved by the grace of God, but only by believing that Christ truly took away your sins and the power of sin in your life. This is Faith. We do not earn the gift by our works. The salvation is given by the goodness of God's heart. BUT, we CAN lose the gift by our works. Understand? We receive it out of no merit of our own, but we can lose it by not obeying and following Christ's example. If we do not make an effort to "come out of her my people" then we are essentially choosing the world over the Saviour. He takes us back over and over again, but the time comes when the line is drawn. Read about Sodom and Gomorrah in Genesis 14. They were saved at one point, then they strayed away and were burnt with "eternal hellfire." This was to be an example of what the wicked as well as the lukewarm will inherit if they don't repent and turn from sin.
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Originally Posted by willyb78
BTW, if you want your responses to be read in detail, might I suggest that you break it up into paragraphs. |
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Biblical evidence that the day of worship was changed from Saturday to Sunday?
One man considers one day more sacred than another; another man considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind. He who regards one day as special, does so to the Lord... Romans 14:5-6 I think all God cares about here is that you worship Him, not what day. |
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It's not like we changed the Law of Moses. Jesus simply fulfilled it. It still stands for those who are still UNDER it and not fully walking by Grace and being led fully by the Holy Spirit.
The Ten Commandments still tell us the will of God. But, as Jesus said, the complete fulfilling of those commandments is summed up in "loving God above all things and loving your neihbor as yourseld". If one is still under Moses, then they have to keep every commandment perfectly, all the time, for every moment of their life OR they are still under its curse! Those in Christ Jesus are led by His Spirit and will always seek to do the will of God. But we are not under the curse of the Law: Rom 8:1-4 8:1 Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, 2 because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in sinful man, 4 in order that the righteous requirements of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the sinful nature but according to the Spirit. NIV This verse is difficult to understand by those still seeking self-righteousness. And self-righteousness is easily discerned in those who wish to have "condemnation" for those who don't do as they believe and practice. Rom 9:30-32 30 What then shall we say? That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness , have obtained it, a righteousness that is by faith; 31 but Israel, who pursued a law of righteousness , has not attained it. 32 Why not? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by works. NIV Rom 10:1-4 10:1 Brothers, my heart's desire and prayer to God for the Israelites is that they may be saved. 2 For I can testify about them that they are zealous for God, but their zeal is not based on knowledge. 3 Since they did not know the righteousness that comes from God and sought to establish their own, they did not submit to God's righteousness . 4 Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes. NIV Why would anyone want to remain UNDER the Law when they know the freedom in Christ? Those in Christ don't limit ourselves to ONE DAY in our worship of our loving God. We see His wonderful power in what He accomplished in six day, but we honor that creation every day. |
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