Check out some similar questions!

TxLobo · Aug 27, 2008, 01:16 PM

I have a similar question but in our case we cleaned up the spill but it left a stain from hyraulic fluid. The customer wants us to SEALCOAT his entire 12000 ft driveway. It was new just before the stain occurred.

We power washed the driveway so that is not the issue, he just wants it to be BRAND NEW looking again.

Driveway Stain Question. One of our tow trucks had a hydraulic line break in a customers drive way. We were invited into the driveway to pick up the vehicle. In our case we cleaned up the spill but it left a stain from hyraulic fluid. This was a standard $50 local tow.

There was no contamination of the grass etc as we contained the spill. The stained area is about 100 Sq Ft. The area was power washed so that is not the issue. Even offered to sealcoat the area affected at our cost of $50.

However He just wants it to be BRAND NEW looking again all the driveway, so the customer wants us to SEALCOAT his entire 12000 ft driveway so it is all the same color shade. It was new just before the stain occurred. The quotes to Sealcost the entire driveway are $1000 to $1400.

ScottGem · Aug 28, 2008, 07:18 AM

You are not responsible for anything more than restoring the driveway to the condition it was in before you damaged it.

If he doesn't like it then tell him to sue you. Its unlikely he will, but if he does, you can show that you contained and cleaned up the spill.

froggy7 · Aug 28, 2008, 07:42 AM

This is a toughie. You are only required to make him whole. However, if he had a brand new driveway, and your truck damaged it, that means that he is entitled to have his driveway look brand new. If it was a standard "used" driveway, you'd have a stronger position on it not currently matching. So I would sealcoat the area, and see how it looks. It may be that that fixes the problem. If it doesn't, then I as the homeowner would expect you to do more to put me back in the position I was before your truck damaged the property, and this may well end up in small claims court.

JudyKayTee · Aug 28, 2008, 08:36 AM

Originally Posted by TxLobo

Driveway Stain Question. One of our tow trucks had a hydraulic line break in a customers drive way. We were invited into the driveway to pick up the vehicle. In our case we cleaned up the spill but it left a stain from hyraulic fluid. This was a standard $50 local tow.

There was no contamination of the grass etc as we contained the spill. The stained area is about 100 Sq Ft. The area was power washed so that is not the issue. Even offered to sealcoat the area affected at our cost of $50.

However He just wants it to be BRAND NEW looking again all the driveway, so the customer wants us to SEALCOAT his entire 12000 ft driveway so it is all the same color shade. It was new just before the stain occurred. The quotes to Sealcost the entire driveway are $1000 to $1400.

You have to make the other person whole. You have no legal obligation to make him "better."

rockinmommy · Aug 28, 2008, 08:43 AM

Originally Posted by TxLobo

However He just wants it to be BRAND NEW looking again all the driveway, so the customer wants us to SEALCOAT his entire 12000 ft driveway so it is all the same color shade. It was new just before the stain occurred. The quotes to Sealcost the entire driveway are $1000 to $1400.

You seem to be contradicting yourself, or I don't understand something...

He wants his NEW driveway to look BRAND NEW... go figure. I would want my new driveway to look NEW, too. Wouldn't you?

I would assume that your company would be "bonded and insured" to cover this kind of "accident"

I'm sorry... I don't understand why you feel he's being unreasonable? I agree it stinks for you, but that's part of the cost of doing business. Every type of business has unfortunate aspects of it, and it appears to me that this is one of those unfortunate aspects of your business.

TxLobo · Aug 28, 2008, 08:43 AM

There is no Damage to the drive way in the sense that the hydraulic fluid deteriorated his asphalt or anything along those lines. This is purely a cosmetic issue.

We are sympathic to his comments, but the driveway has a functional purpose as well and it did that job very well. He just doesn't want the different shades of asphalt in his driveway.

To add the Seal Coat would be making it better too, since the Asphalt was not seal coated before.

JudyKayTee · Aug 28, 2008, 08:46 AM

:D

Originally Posted by TxLobo

There is no Damage to the drive way in the sense that the hydraulic fluid deteriorated his asphalt or anything along those lines. This is purely a cosmetic issue.

We are sympathic to his comments, but the driveway has a functional purpose as well and it did that job very well. He just doesn't want the different shades of asphalt in his driveway.

To add the Seal Coat would be making it better too, since the Asphalt was not seal coated before.

Well, I'd like to be First Assistant to the Easter Bunny but I don't think that's going to happen, either.

Nor is his entire driveway going to be resurfaced as long as it's adequate for its purpose - driving cars on/over. :D

If he decides to press the issue the Judge will end the whole argument very quickly - that's my prediction.

amricca · Aug 28, 2008, 08:47 AM

I agree with rockinmommy, your insurance shoud cover it. If not or you don't want to file a claim, why don't you seal coat it yourself. It is easy to do and will cost less than $1200.

TxLobo · Aug 28, 2008, 08:56 AM

Insurance company says that there is no Damage to the property and they would not cover it, besides the deductible is $1000 so it probably would be under the deductible or close to it.

JudyKayTee · Aug 28, 2008, 09:01 AM

Originally Posted by amricca

I agree with rockinmommy, your insurance shoud cover it. If not or you don't want to file a claim, why don't you seal coat it yourself. It is easy to do and will cost less than $1200.

The property owner does not have to accept a job not performed by a professional.

rockinmommy · Aug 28, 2008, 09:01 AM

Ok, I don't want to beat a dead horse, here. I'm a business owner, and I can completely sympathize with your position, from that angle.

Is this a residence? A new residence? I assume we're talking about a concrete driveway.

I still feel like the guy is entitled to having his driveway made so that the stain doesn't show.

If you accidentally stained someone's new leather coat, had it cleaned, but the stain still showed, would you say, "it's still functional." "They can still wear it."?? No, you'd replace the coat.

JudyKayTee · Aug 28, 2008, 09:23 AM

Originally Posted by rockinmommy

Ok, I don't want to beat a dead horse, here. I'm a business owner, and I can completely sympathize with your position, from that angle.

Is this a residence? A new residence? I assume we're talking about a concrete driveway.

I still feel like the guy is entitled to having his driveway made so that the stain doesn't show.

If you accidentally stained someone's new leather coat, had it cleaned, but the stain still showed, would you say, "it's still functional." "They can still wear it." ??? No, you'd replace the coat.

Ahh, we're on different sides of the argument here - so I'm going to smack that dead horse one more time.

A coat has a dual purpose - to keep you warm AND look good. Driveways are to drive on. I don't think you can make a comparison.

Will be curious to see how this one plays out -

rockinmommy · Aug 28, 2008, 09:38 AM

Originally Posted by JudyKayTee

A coat has a dual purpose - to keep you warm AND look good. Driveways are to drive on. I don't think you can make a comparison.

I think it depends on the location and aesthetic of the driveway. If this is an upscale location, a big stained blotch in the middle of the clean, otherwise unblemished expanse of concrete could very well interfere with the "look" of the property.

It would bother the heck out of my husband, I can tell you that. He expects his driveway to not just be driven on, but to LOOK good, as a part of the whole look of the property. I don't think that you can say a driveway is just for driving on anymore than you can say carpet is just for walking on (for example.) I know many, many men whose garages and driveways you could eat off. To THEM it needs to look a certain way.

(smack, smack)

I still think it's a "cost of doing business" that the OP is accountable for. If he's not willing or prepared to absorb the costs associated with hydraulic breaks, etc, then he should be in another business where the risks of that happening aren't present.

ballengerb1 · Aug 28, 2008, 09:54 AM

I'm not an asphalt expert but I do think hydraulic fluid will negatively affect blacktop. As a petroleum distillate it, along with brake fluid and gas, will cut into the asphalts strength. Scott said it in post #1 first sentence. You need to restore the driveway to the conditionit was before the damage. I think that includes apparence as well as strength, you did say it was new right before the spill, right? My thoughts are about your insurances company's position that there is no damage, if it looks bad now and it was brand new then I think there is damage. I am speaking from the mechanical and the home owner point of view. The legal experts on this post probably have seen many folks like me go down in flames.

TxLobo · Aug 28, 2008, 10:04 AM

It was Asphalt and we immediately removed the Hydraulic Fluid and it was power washed. The condition of the asphalt is not the question here, the question is the color of the asphalt.

Seal-coating asphalt will extend its life by 50 to 100%.

ballengerb1 · Aug 28, 2008, 10:09 AM

As I closed my post it dawned on me that the fluid proably was not there long enough to dissolve the asphalt. However, appearance and color are still a very strong argument for the home owner. One seal coat job will not extend the life of a driveway by 50 to 100%, yearly coating might. His driveway was new and should not be coated for at least a year. Think of it this way, if a someone shot your car door with a BB or an arrow would you accept a repair and paint job just for a 2" square spot. No, of course not, you'd want the entire door to be painted so it doesn't look patched. I think that's what the HO is looking for.

rockinmommy · Aug 28, 2008, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by TxLobo

It was Asphalt and we immediately removed the Hydraulic Fluid nad it was power washed. The condition of the asphalt is not the question here, the question is the color of the asphalt.

Seal-coating asphalt will extend its life by 50 to 100%.

Ok, now you'll have to enlighten me...

Asphalt, like back-top-ish asphalt? Not light, whitish-grey concrete? If that's the case... I don't know about the break-down issue like the more recent poster was talking about. But that would cause me to back off (somewhat) on my position about the appearance of the driveway. I was picturing a large, light-colored, concrete driveway with a big nasty stain on it.

Do you have a photo?

TxLobo · Aug 28, 2008, 10:22 AM

AceAsphalt.com - Asphalt Seal Coating

Seal Coating protects the asphalt from sun and other environmental issues. I have always been told to seal coat every 5 years. This article recommends every 2 to 5 years.

The contractor we talked with said that it should be done every 5 years and when done will extend the life another 5 years at that point.

Without any treatment an asphalt driveway life is approx 7 to 12 years (we were told 10) but with treatment it is 15 to 20 years. I think both numbers might be a little low but the relationship is consistent

Keep the feedback coming, it has all been useful. We will be talking with the home owner tomorrow and wanted as much feedback as possible

ballengerb1 · Aug 28, 2008, 10:37 AM

Maybe there is a win/win point you can negotiate with the HO. Since his driveway needs to look as good as before but seal coating will actually give him more serviceable life, maybe he will be willing to pay part of the cost. If the coating isn't done now he'd foot the entire bill in a few years. Use that logic, if he benefits from the seal coat he should share in the cost.

rockinmommy · Aug 28, 2008, 10:49 AM

What does the stain look like? Is it a whitish or greyish area now, on the otherwise dark / black asphalt? And so then you sealcoated just over the stain so that's now darker / blacker?

I'm backing off on my original position, somewhat. I still think the homeowner is entitled to have his new driveway look new. But sealcoating (what you're talking about) seems like an excessive fix. We have an asphalt driveway - extending off our concrete driveway outside of our garage. We have it sealed every 4 or 5 years - whenever someone cheap comes through our neighborhood doing it. We were told to wait at least a year after the driveway was originally poured to have it coated anyway.

I just calculated that my driveway is about 1600 sq feet. And it's pretty long? Did you mean that this one is 1200, or is it really 12000? If it's 1200, the cost you were quoted is WAY too high. At least in my area, we pay about $300 to have the whole driveway done. But like I said, they come through my rural sub-division and go door-to-door.

I like ballinger's idea of splitting the cost.