[binx44]

I have a friend who bought an alapha blue blood bulldog from a breeder in denver Colorado. He lives in Nova Scotia. The deal was he was to get a breeding quality pup free of any health problems of any kind. He paid through pay pal and visa. The deal was the pup was to be shipped from denver to halifax airport. Then with no warning he was told he had to go to toronto to get the dog due to an "embargo" . He got someone to transfer the dog down here. But has not been re-embursed for part of the shipping like was decided (he has e-mails saying this all) Ontop of it all the pup arrived with what looked like a shattered elbow (he has taken it to the vet. And the vet says the pup was born that way and there is nothing at all that can be done about it.) And also the vet discovered the pup has a hernia so it is unbreedable now also.so we called the vet in denver. The vet in denver said there was nothing at all wrong with the dogs leg and that the dog was completely healthy. Upon more discussing with the vet we have come to be pretty sure (all of us) that the dog that was taken to the vet was not the same dog. We also are worried because the pup is VERY underweight and walks with a severe limp. He can't even go up or down stairs because his leg cannot bend properly. Also in the states it is legal to give your dogs their needles yourself. Is there any way we can determine if the dog got dewormed or even its shots? Its awefully skinny for being a healthy pup. It was also shipped from denver in a medium to large size cat crate. Which seems quite small for a dog of his size. He's 11 weeks old.


We do now believe the guy was running a puppy mill. Because when we tried to contact him to send him Our vet x-rays and information. He claimed not to mail anything as they are moving across state.

Is there anything that can be done about this concerning helping the pup. And/ or getting the 2000 dollars plus shipping back at all?? And also what is something to help him Gain some weight.

[twinkiedooter]

You can contact Ebay and Paypal and dispute this transaction if the puppy was not the same one that was sold to you. It's a shame that some people don't go in person and buy an animal. This would have totally eliminated any messy transaction such as your friend is now going through. Hopefully he can nurse the little fellow back to good health and have a good pet. $2,000 for a dog is very pricey to pay signt unseen in my mind. He should have known better.

[binx44]

Well he thought it to be a reputable breeder . This was also the first pup the breeder had "shipped" out of country. Thanks for your input though :D

[bushg]

What I'd lke to know is what airline allowed an animal to be shipped in a crate that is too small? The FAA needs to be contacted as well as the humane society in that area.

[Alty]

Buyer beware. You can try and get your money back if you can prove without a doubt that the dog you ended up getting is not the dog you thought you were purchasing. Small claims court sounds like a possibility, but even if a judgement is made in your favor, it's really hard to collect the money.

My main concern is that poor puppy. It is disgraceful what some people will do to make a buck. This man and his puppy mill deserve to be put in jail, a small cell, just like that puppy was made to travel in a small crate. Let's see how he likes it. If it were me, I'd be doing everything in my power to put a stop to this person so that he cannot hurt anymore dogs.

Good luck with your pup. Do you have a picture?

[froggy7]

What I'd lke to know is what airline allowed an animal to be shipped in a crate that is too small? The FAA needs to be contacted as well as the humane society in that area.

Not knowing how big the dog is, it's debatable about whether the crate is too small. It has to be large enough for the puppy to stand, turn around, and lie down. But you don't want to have too much space, because then the dog can get banged up by hitting the inside of the crate if there's turbulence. Most people over-estimate how much space an animal needs. My "normal" cat carrier is probably 2, 2.5 times as big as it needs to be, and could easily handle a puppy.

I will state that it sounds like the puppy buyer was scammed. Actually, I'm surprised he even got a puppy. Quite often, these turn into a case of "there's problems with customs, but if you can send me $200, I can clear up the paperwork", followed up by a new problem that takes money to solve.

If you are going to buy a puppy, never buy one that you haven't been able to handle and see in person. Even assuming that this was a legitimate breeder, there might be a different puppy in the litter that gets along with you better.

And now that I have jumped all over the puppy breeder, I am going to jump all over the OP's friend. He's spending big bucks on a "breeding quality" puppy, of a breed that is not recognized in any of the major registries (AKC, etc.). He's buying that puppy sight unseen, and I have a feeling he did not pour over whatever pedigree the puppy has. Which has all the earmarks to me of someone who is looking to become a backyard breeder, not someone who is getting a dog because he loves the breed and wants to improve it. (Although how you improve a breed that doesn't have a breed standard is beyond me.) So a part of me is happy that this dog is not breeding quality, although I do feel sorry that the puppy is in such bad shape. And I hope the OP's friend takes this lesson to heart: being a responsible breeder is a serious investment of time, money, and energy. This 2K down the drain is only the first of the costs that he will come across in this "hobby".

[turtlegirl16]

K. I have a bulldog and it is completely normal for it to have problems. I think the elbow must have happened while it was being shipped. And you said the dog has a hernia and its unbreedable, well bulldogs aren't supposed to be bred because of birth problems and the female bulldog and her puppies could be seriously hurt so the elbow and the hernia could have happened during birth and the vet just didn't know it then.
I don't know how you could figure out the deworming stuff.

[binx44]

FIRST OFF he's not a damn breeder. My friend got the dog because he loves dogs. All of his dogs cept one have also been fixed within the years of owning them. You should not assume someone wants to become a breeder just because they want a breedable dog. Did you ever think maybe he just wanted a litter of pups eventually. And the vet said the elbow was a genetic default.

[Alty]

[QUOTE=binx44]And also the vet discovered the pup has a hernia so it is unbreedable now also..[/QUOTE]


This part of YOUR post is what lead us to believe your friend intended to breed the dog. We can only give advice or state an opinion based on what you have written. If your friend had no intention to breed the dog then that should have been made clear in your post, it wasn't, that's why you got the opinions you did.

[froggy7]

FIRST OFF hes not a damn breeder. my friend got the dog because he loves dogs. all of his dogs cept one have also been fixed within the years of owning them. you should not assume someone wants to become a breeder just because they want a breedable dog. did you ever think maybe he just wanted a litter of pups eventually.

And this makes him not a breeder, how? Unless he is going to keep all of that litter, he is a breeder. And bulldogs are notoriously difficult and expensive to breed, because the big heads make for difficult deliveries. So he spends 2K for a "breeding quality dog", and pays even more for the cesarean it will probably take to birth those pups, and is not going to try and make some of that money back by selling at least some of the puppies? Pull the other one, it's got bells.

[Alty]

Froggy I agree. I think the OP is just mad that he/she didn't get the opinion that he/she wanted.

Sorry, we aren't here to sugar coat things. You get advice based on the info that's given, and that's what you got. You don't have to take our advice, it's free and unenforceable.

[AlwaysWriting]

First and foremost, you need to contact the ASPCA or the Better Business Bureau, and see if the breeder already has a past history of abuse or running a puppy mill. Sadly, when things are purchased online, it's usually an "as-is" sort of deal. However, you might be able to take the breeder to small claims court, and possibly get a percentage of your money back.

[wildandblue]

I'm assuming the guy is asking, which one is at fault, the breeder or the airline carrier, which one should he try to recover damages from. A "pet quality" animal would be less expensive than a breeding quality animal. If the seller misrepresented the dog in that way he could also get damages. The quarantine is just to prevent unhealthy animals from entering Canada, also some people will try to ship in contraband by feeding it to the dogs, so they hold them at the border to try to prevent that.

[binx44]

It is a male puppy by the way. Its not a female. I may have forgotten to state that

[froggy7]

First and foremost, you need to contact the ASPCA or the Better Business Bureau, and see if the breeder already has a past history of abuse or running a puppy mill. Sadly, when things are purchased online, it's usually an "as-is" sort of deal. However, you might be able to take the breeder to small claims court, and possibly get a percentage of your money back.

Yes, you can take the seller to court. However, this is an international transaction, so I don't know if it's as simple as filing in small claims court. And if the OP goes that route, there are things that she needs to have done in a timely manner to support her case. It's going to be a hard case to prove, especially with the pup having been diverted and held over by the airline, since the OP has a health certificate on his side. All he has to do is say that the dog that the OP got isn't the one that he sent, and he doesn't know who, where, or how they got switched. Heck, he could get all righteously indignant about this person who is trying to get their money back by bringing in this obviously defective dog when he sent them a beautiful dog that they want to keep and just not pay for. And, if the judge says that the OP can have their money back, but needs to return the dog, is that something that the OP is willing to do? And finally, is it worth the costs that it will probably run to go to a different state to present this in court?

[carolbcac]

Anytime you are unsure about when or if a puppy has had shots/deworming, its best to have them done again; at 11 weeks he has not finished his puppy series anyway. I would have thought that airlines would require health certificates and dates of vaccinations to ship a live animal. (I have never flown, so don't know anything about the procedures.)

[binx44]

I'm not 100 % sure about the rules concerning shipping live animals either. We thought we would get health certificates with him. But we did not receive them or his papers either.
So there are no needles that can hurt a pup if he gets them again because we're not sure he got them in the first place. He's been wormed and he seems to be doing a little better now weight wise. But we've been told we need to keep his weight low due to the leg also.

*edit* what does OP mean?

[froggy7]

OP = original poster

[linnealand]

Just an idea... since the dog had to cross the border, I'll bet it was given a microchip! That microchip would trace all of the dog's places in the story AND prove that it's the same dog... or not.

[binx44]

He had the option to pay for the micro-chip but he didn't have enough money for it. We thought about that. The guy was charging a ton to get one put in

And thank you for telling me what op was