[Allheart]

Out there that may preventing others from wanting to know God?

What I mean by that is, could it be possible that "evil" does not wish all to know God and so penetrates and swirls around and gives God and religion a very bad name?

That the negative forces dress up as God fearing people but only harshness and unkindness come out and pushes away those that possibly would be interested in knowing if there was or was not a God.

The forces try and use the bible in a negative fashion and damn one and all and preach unkindness that makes people want to run away from God not to him? Truly, why would anyone want to move towards what appears to be a harsh slap?

False prophets perhaps?

Help me out here? It is possible? Or am I just in a bad mood?

I thank you in advace for your thougths as I really am beginning to believe there are negative forces attempting to prevent the spreading of God's love. And not by non-believers, but by self-proclaimed believers.

[Allheart]

I feel like the Maytag repair man :(

Anybody - I know I need to be patient :D

Sorry.

[N0help4u]

Yes that is stated ALL through the Bible.

"Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's
clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Ye shall
know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns,
or figs of thistles? Even so every good tree bringeth forth
good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. A
good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a
corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Every tree that
bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into
the fire. Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them."
Matthew 7:15-20, KJV

"And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive
many...For there shall arise false Christs, and false
prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch
that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very
elect."
Matthew 24:11, 24, KJV

"For such are false apostles, deceitful workers,
transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no
marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of
light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also
be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end
shall be according to their works."
2 Corinthians 11:13-15, KJV

"For the time will come when they will not endure sound
doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to
themselves teachers, having itching ears;"
2 Timothy 4:3, KJV

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? And in thy name have cast out devils? And in thy name done many wonderful works?
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Matt 7:21-23

[ordinaryguy]

Is it possible that there are negative forces

Sure it's possible, but even if there are, it's really no big deal.

"Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good." Romans 12:21

[Cody413]

Out there that may preventing others from wanting to know God?

What I mean by that is, could it be possible that "evil" does not wish all to know God and so penetrates and swirls around and gives God and religion a very bad name?

That the negative forces dress up as God fearing people but only harshness and unkindness come out and pushes away those that possibly would be interested in knowing if there was or was not a God.

The forces try and use the bible in a negative fashion and damn one and all and preach unkindness that makes people want to run away from God not to him? Truly, why would anyone want to move towards what appears to be a harsh slap?

False prophets perhaps?

Help me out here? It is possible? or am I just in a bad mood?

I thank you in advace for your thougths as I really am beginning to beleive there are negative forces attempting to prevent the spreading of God's love. And not by non-believers, but by self-proclaimed believers.

Well I do think there is. First of all, god is supposed to be some almighty being and he can make our decisions and all this other , but then why did 9/11 happen, why are all these bad things happening. Because no one is living in all these situations, people just start to not care anymore and they won't believe.

[Allheart]

Sure it's possible, but even if there are, it's really no big deal.

"Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good." Romans 12:21

But OG I am finding that it is in a way a big deal. If the picture they are painting of God or of faith or of belief, is turning off ones that may have opened their hearts to believe, I find that to be a very big deal.

I know that they who do not believe are quite happy not to, but who could blame them with some of the reteritc being laid at there feet.

Even is some of these threads, folks are so fed up of "Christians". Again, who could blame them.

I guess I wonder if the non-believers see all believers the same. And if they were allowed to see with their own eyes instead of having things forced on them... would they see and believe things differently?

[De Maria]

Out there that may preventing others from wanting to know God?

Scripture says that Satan masquerades as an Angel of light:

2 Corinthians 11:11 Wherefore? Because I love you not? God knoweth it. 12 But what I do, that I will do, that I may cut off the occasion from them that desire occasion, that wherein they glory, they may be found even as we. 13 For such false apostles are deceitful workmen, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. 14 And no wonder: for Satan himself transformeth himself into an angel of light.

What I mean by that is, could it be possible that "evil" does not wish all to know God and so penetrates and swirls around and gives God and religion a very bad name?

That particular Evil has a name. He is a being named Satan. However, people also generate their own evil:

Mark 7 21 For from within out of the heart of men proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders,

That the negative forces dress up as God fearing people but only harshness and unkindness come out and pushes away those that possibly would be interested in knowing if there was or was not a God.

There are also those who paint God as a wimpy, permissive parent who does not punish anyone.

However, Scripture is clear that God is just. He is loving and kind and merciful, but those who disobey Him will be punished:

Hebrews 10 31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

The true Apostle of God, follows the example of St. Paul and teaches both aspects of God's Love, His Mercy and His Justice.

The forces try and use the bible in a negative fashion and damn one and all and preach unkindness that makes people want to run away from God not to him? Truly, why would anyone want to move towards what appears to be a harsh slap?

Why do we love our parents even when they punish us? Because their harsh slaps are done for love of us. In fact, Scripture says that if God does not punish you, you are not his child.

Hebrews 12 6 For whom the Lord loveth, he chastiseth; and he scourgeth every son whom he receiveth. 7 Persevere under discipline. God dealeth with you as with his sons; for what son is there, whom the father doth not correct? 8 But if you be without chastisement, whereof all are made partakers, then are you bastards, and not sons.

False prophets perhaps?

Those who portray God as merciless are wrong.
Those who portray God as a wimp who never punishes His children, are also wrong.

Whether they are false prophets is something which God judges. They may be speaking in earnest and yet be mistaken.

Help me out here? It is possible? Or am I just in a bad mood?

I hope that helps.

I thank you in advace for your thougths as I really am beginning to believe there are negative forces attempting to prevent the spreading of God's love. And not by non-believers, but by self-proclaimed believers.

I believe there are people who are spreading their own religion and not the religion which God revealed. And I believe some are doing that believing they are doing something good. But God wants to be portrayed truthfully.

Jeremias 23 28 The prophet that hath a dream, let him tell a dream: and he that hath my word, let him speak my word with truth: what hath the chaff to do with the wheat, saith the Lord?

God is Love. And God is Just. And God's Justice is perfect love and God's Love is perfect justice.

Sincerely,

De Maria

[N0help4u]

I believe there are people who are spreading their own religion and not the religion which God revealed. And I believe some are doing that believing they are doing something good. But God wants to be portrayed truthfully.

Yep many of the Televangelists have gotten to this point... sadly.
Satan angel of light--And no wonder: for Satan himself transformeth himself into an angel of light. 2 Corinthians 11:14

Principality and powers of the air--For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places. Eph 6:12

[s_cianci]

He's called Satan (or the devil.)

[MoonlitWaves]

I guess I wonder if the non-believers see all believers the same. And if they were allowed to see with their own eyes instead of having things forced on them....would they see and beleive things differently?

Absolutely they would see things differently! Hince the scriptural saying "I once was blind but now I see". This didn't mean literal blindess, but spiritual blindness. We all are spiritually blind until we make that faithful choice to step into God's light and eternal life. God removes the devil's blinders and fills us with His undeniable Spirit.

It's wonderful to see, isn't it??

[Allheart]

[QUOTE=De Maria

Why do we love our parents even when they punish us? Because their harsh slaps are done for love of us. In fact, Scripture says that if God does not punish you, you are not his child.}

Hi De Maria,

Thank you so much for all that you shared. I do agree. God is a loving and merciful God, and yes do believe I will be punished when I step out of His light and away from His will. Yes, I believe.

I guess my concern is that yes, our parents disciplined us when we did wrong. But they did not "slap" us the moment we came out of the womb. They did not hold us in their arms as infants, and yell in our fact, if you disobey me, you will be punished.

We had a chance to bond with our parents, to know and believe and feel there love. We were giving a chance to trust.

I guess I would like non-believers to first know, or given a chance to be exposed to His love and not feel condemned at the start.

When I was "introduced" to God, it was before I can remember - 11 years of Catholic School (1 year public). And I was first taught about God's love and mery and yes also
His wrath. But I was given a chance to walk towards the Father and His light.

I just want everyone to have that same loving experience.

God is stronger then an evil that one can muster up - so the evil ones need to just give it up :).

Thank you again for your insight. I hope you can understand mind. I am just trying to understand it all. I get upset when God is painted so harshly and I am not painted Him as one that does not punish, but His love is such a wonderful and glorious thing and I just think that should be prevalent when sharing our beliefs.

[NeedKarma]

Nah, there's no 'evil' force blocking anyone. People who don't have religion or a god are the same as you. We have happy childhoods, get married, have kids, help out our neighbours, etc. just like you do. It's simply a choice we make. There's no evil force at work. I never abused anyone or any substance in my life. We're just everyday normal people... like you.

Note to Allheart: I went to 12 years of catholic school too. :)

[Allheart]

Note to Allheart: I went to 12 years of catholic school too. :)

Were you an Alter boy NK :D... hmmmm were you :)

But NK then you kind of no what I mean. Don't you think there is a difference between
How it is taught in the classroom verse how some seem heck bent on using the bible as a tool to condemn and if that is the only expoure that someone would have, at least for me, would be a turn off.

I guess I am just trying to sort it all out.

So, what mass time did you serve "young man"?. :)

Do you know I just found out that my hubby ( Mr. rough and tough) was a sweet angel for years and did the readings on Sundays :eek: . I had to verify that with My mother-in-law.
Yup, he once was a little darling.

[NeedKarma]

There was no alter boy services required. It was a French elementary school board. Had catechism class and did first communion and that kind of stuff. I did also go to a Jesuit private boys secondary school (went to my friends' public school dances though :)) for 2 years. Great education, no bible thumping, nice people.

[Allheart]

Those times are so precious NK aren't they? How cute that must have been the public school dances :).

Went to an all girls high school - Was wonderful on bad hair days, but honest to honest :),
We all had a huge crush on the janitor... oh me oh my :).

[NeedKarma]

Actually the most precious times were my university days and my time travelling Europe afterwards when I figured out that people are individuals not groups. Of course nothing compares to having kids in my book.

But back to your original post - do you see how there is no Satan force at work? People are people, it would be nice it we could stop lumping them into groups such as "non-believers", I believe in lots of stuff.

[Allheart]

Actually the most precious times were my university days and my time travelling Europe afterwards when I figured out that people are individuals not groups. Of course nothing compares to having kids in my book.

But back to your original post - do you see how there is no Satan force at work? People are people, it would be nice it we could stop lumping them into groups such as "non-believers", I believe in lots of stuff.

Very good point NK. And I am guilty of "labeling". I just didn't know how else to say it.
I should have said for those individuals who do not believe in God. I do apologize and I am glad you called me on it.

Do I see no Satan force at work? I hate to say it, but in a general sense, I think that evil does exsist and tries to detract from good or overpower good.

I do believe that if someone is very close to God and deeply spiritual, that evil will attempt to pull this person away from God. I am not saying people are evil, by no means, but "evil forces".

NK - I truly am sorry for the labeling - I think you know I meant no disrespect - Utter ingnorance on my part - but lesson learned.

[De Maria]

Why do we love our parents even when they punish us? Because their harsh slaps are done for love of us. In fact, Scripture says that if God does not punish you, you are not his child.}[/B]

Hi De Maria,

Thank you so much for all that you shared. I do agree. God is a loving and merciful God, and yes do beleive I will be punished when I step out of His light and away from His will. Yes, I beleive.

I guess my concern is that yes, our parents disciplined us when we did wrong. But they did not "slap" us the moment we came out of the womb. They did not hold us in their arms as infants, and yell in our fact, if you disobey me, you will be punished.

We had a chance to bond with our parents, to know and beleive and feel there love. We were giving a chance to trust.

I guess I would like non-believers to first know, or given a chance to be exposed to His love and not feel condemned at the start.

When I was "introduced" to God, it was before I can remember - 11 years of Catholic School (1 year public). And I was first taught about God's love and mery and yes also
his wrath. But I was given a chance to walk towards the Father and His light.

I just want everyone to have that same loving experience.

God is stronger then an evil that one can muster up - so the evil ones need to just give it up :).

Thank you again for your insight. I hope you can understand mind. I am just trying to understand it all. I get upset when God is painted so harshly and I am not painted Him as one that does not punish, but His love is such a wonderful and glorious thing and I just think that should be prevelant when sharing our beliefs.

I understand your sentiment. But you must recognize that most of the atheists on this board have heard about God's love and mercy. Many of them are former Christians. But they don't believe in God any longer. And, in fact, they are all aware of the stand they have taken. But they also don't believe in the existence of hell, therefore they don't believe any punishment will befall them for not believing in God.

Anyway, I don't want to dissuade you from preaching about God's love. Carry on and may God bless your every deed.

Sincerely,

De Maria

[Allheart]

I understand your sentiment. But you must recognize that most of the atheists on this board have heard about God's love and mercy. Many of them are former Christians. But they don't believe in God any longer. And, in fact, they are all aware of the stand they have taken. But they also don't believe in the existence of hell, therefore they don't believe any punishment will befall them for not believing in God.

Anyway, I don't want to dissuade you from preaching about God's love. Carry on and may God bless your every deed.

Sincerely,

De Maria

Demaria,

Thank you for your patience and time explaining. Yes, I am realizing that now (once believed but now no longer do).

I wouldn't say I preach, but I do know what you mean. I share when I think it's okay (without offending.. or hopefully without offending) - and I have a great deal of my own ways to get in better aligned with God's will.

But sharing His love is part of His will... yes? :).

Thanks again De Maria (and what a lovely name)

[Donna Mae]

"Humble yourselves, therefore, under God's mighty hand, that He may lift you up in due time. Cast all your anxiety on him because he cares for you.

Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour. Resist him, standing firm in the faith, because you know that your brothers throughout the world are undergoing the same kind of sufferings.

And the God of all grace, who called you to His eternal glory in Christ, after you have suffered a little while, will Himself restore you and make you strong, firm and steadfast. To Him be the power for ever and ever. Amen." 1 Peter 5:6-11