[ETWolverine]

Hello again, El:

We have discussed this at length over the years. Suffice to say, that you're just fine with it the way it is. You find no fault with any of the hangers on.

The problem is, there is more going out than is coming in.

And yet you decry the fact that the insurance companies are making too much profits. If there were more going out than coming in, they would not have those high profits you complain about. They wouldn't be staying in business. But they do.

Here's another point: how are you going to fix the budget deficit if you incure more debt by paying out more than we take in?

And another point: if there is more going out than coming in, who is going to pay for it when the government takes the system over and it becomes just as bankrupt as social security, medicare and medicaid? Where is the government going to get the money to pay for it?

They're going to be getting it from you and me, fool. WE are going to be paying for it, while those who don't pay get the majority of services. Just like they do now, only on a grander scale.

Something has to be cut out. You think ALL those hangers on are going to get THEIR money, because they somehow DESERVE it, and it's going to be the PATIENTS who loose services. I think it's going to be one or more of useless hangers on. Then there will be MORE services, and cheaper prices.

Which system of government-run health care gives you an example that you can point to that proves your point. What government-run healthcare system makes MORE services available to the people without taxing them into oblivion? The UK? Uh... no. Canada? Non. The Netherlands? Switzerland? The old Soviet model? Nicht, nyet and NOT. There has NEVER been an example of a government run healthcare system that provides cheaper service with availability to all as soon as it is requested. IT DOESN'T EXIST. It CAN'T exist.

An example of that would be the insurance industry. They are absolutely unnecessary. I'll bet if we threw them out, there would be BILLIONS and BILLIONS of $$$'s available for health care... It could even be TRILLIONS!!

Excon

So your answer is to take the money out of the hands of the insurance companies (who are more profitable when they are more efficient) and put it in the hands of the government who run the most inefficient systems in the entire world, and you expect that to result in BETTER SERVICES at CHEAPER PRICES because there is going to be extra money lying around?

Are you effing insane? When does the government leave money lying around without using it for its own pet projects? They couldn't even keep their hands off our retirement funds!! And what will the government spend it on? Not healthcare. You know it and I know it.

So you will have killed a profitable industry, put hundreds of thousands out of work, and DECREASED GOVERNMENT INCOME in the form of taxes, while at the same time increasing government spending for healthcare. Keep in mind that 85% of Americans have their own healthcare already... you are going to force those Americans to stop paying for their own healthcare and take that burdon onto the government... and you think there's enough money to cover not only the 46 million uninsured American and illegal aliens, but also the 260 million Americans who already pay for their own insurance and are happy with the services they get.

And you think this is an improvement? To save 15% of the population that doesn't need to be saved, you're going to screw the other 85%?

What the heck are you thinking?

Besides, when something goes wrong in the medical system right now, you can sue the doctor, the hospital, the insurance company, etc. If everything is run by the government, who are you going to sue for legitimate relief? The Federal Government? The judges are EMPLOYED by the Federal Government. What are your chances of getting justice against the government if your doctor screws up?

M y G-d, excon. The entire concept of government-run healthcare is diametrically opposed to your libertarian beliefs. You actually believe that the government is going to give you, an old jailbird, a fair shot? Or anyone else that is forced into the system? What part of your own history or the history of world governments leads you to that conclusion? When you go to your local government healthcare office and tell them you need expensive drugs for cancer, and the supply for such drugs is limited, and they have the choice of giving those drugs to you, with a criminal record, or the guy who's never been to jail and has been a big-money supporter of the Democrat party over the past 20 years, who do you think is going to get the drugs? And there WILL be a shortage of drugs, because the companies that produce the drugs are going to go where business is cheaper, less regulated and more profitable. Israel, maybe. Or the Caribbean. Perhaps Ireland... the fastest growing capitalist nation in the world right now. Or Micronesia the most solid and unwaveringly capitalist nation in the world. But they won't be HERE anymore. And with government price-fixing, they won't be selling here either. So there will be shortages.

What are you thinking, excon?

Elliot

[ETWolverine]

I guess that's one of the problems with the US, their entire government is run by buffoons and has been for decades.

http://www.budget.gc.ca/2009/pdf/bud...etaire-eng.pdf

Budget 2008 - Economic Leadership

I suggest, NK, that you look to your own buffoons.

[NeedKarma]

Dude, we're not the ones slagging our government - you are.

[ETWolverine]

Dude, we're not the ones slagging our government - you are.

Perhaps you should be.