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arcura · Oct 31, 2008, 09:06 AM

Unknown008
Either accept it or reject it as you have.
I accept it as a good possibility that God was involved.
Fred

michealb · Oct 31, 2008, 11:25 AM

Why doesn't god heal all people then or at least all of his followers?

Surely the five year old dying of cancer who has done nothing wrong in their life is just as worthy of being healed as anyone else.

Why has god never healed an amputee?

BMI · Oct 31, 2008, 12:31 PM

The guy above just does not get it NO MATTER WHAT!

There are 3 of them, 2 more prevalent than the third but still. They participate in EVERY religious discussion trying to find fault with everything said. In truth, I'd wager nobody on these boards finds them insightful nor welcome for that matter in regards to religious discussion.

Sorry Arcura, I just think it wrong for these three to enter into every discussion whether it is about the existence of God or not.

michealb · Oct 31, 2008, 01:09 PM

I realize you might not be familier with the term free speech but I find that very important as well. If you don't like what I have to say you are more than welcome to add me to your ignore list.

You are however right on the part about me not getting it. I don't see how you can attribute random events to a great design without proof or consistancy of occurrence or consistancy of out come it doesn't make sense. And if we were talking about anything else other than god very few would even give these ideas any thought. I'm very interested in why.

BMI · Oct 31, 2008, 01:25 PM

Free speech? What is that? Please educate me on that subject as well kind sir.

I don't see how you can call the craetion of the world a random event. You and your proof argument is getting real stale as well. All this talk of proof and visuals to aid us in every aspect of life.

Consider that you have never actually been to the sun to know what it consists of. You haven ever been in outer space to tell us where the boundaries are or what other solar systems even look like. We rely on machines and systems to map space and then interpret the data to shape what it MAY look like, but nobody has actually seen or been near the farthest star in the universe to have proof of what exactly it is.

You also use the word logic and common sense a lot I your posts. Who's logic? Who's sense? Yours? In that fictitious book called the Bible, with all its in accuracies and falacies, the main character even commented on those people whom cannot see, cannot hear. Sounds asifhe pegged that pretty bang on Michael.

No disrespect intended towards you. You choose not to believe, you cannot see, fine. Your way of bringing up the same issues regardless of the questions prevent the questions from ever being addressed.

BMI · Oct 31, 2008, 01:36 PM

After re-reading I do believe I was being a bit snippy Michael and for that I do apologize.

It's just that I really do not believe that these debates are being engaged in to learn but rather to bang home one's view. I do believe, with all respect, that an atheist has room to at least consider the information about God. I do not feel that is being done here. We all know that a certain member(s) will only believe when they see, I think everyone is fine with that, so why all the back and forth.

True beleivers, in my opinion, cannot have room for thoughts about there being no God, it makes no sense to us, its not logical in our capacity to think. If you will only believe when you see than you yourself will admit there is nothing more to be said.

In my opinion, you seek to understand and for that I commend you.

michealb · Oct 31, 2008, 01:52 PM

First off this particular question seems to be directed specifically at atheists and people of other religions. So I'm pretty spot on topic here. Even in the requirement of proof.

If you have a problem with my comments in another thread do so in that thread. I think you will find I stay pretty on topic in most of the threads only providing a different view point.

As far as to whose logic and whose common sense both of those are subjective. I look at religion as I would anything in my life and use the common sense that most people use in their life in everything but religion.

For example if I told you I had a potion that would heal you but it doesn't work for everyone but is capable of healing everything. Wouldn't you want the results to be above the statically anomalous results before you even spent time or money on such potion? It would seems like common sense to me and I apply that same common sense to things like prayer. That makes sense to me why doesn't it make sense to you?

Edit
Posted this before I read the apology. I appreciate the apology BMI.

Unknown008 · Nov 1, 2008, 01:32 AM

For your idea of potion, Michael, I would say that in a desperate attempt, anyone would try to obtain that potion, since you have nothing to lose, whatever the price.

The same is for God, you need faith for that 'potion' to work. If you ignore it, you won't have the opportunity to try it. Here also, what do you have to lose? Friends will reject you because of a belief? Not all, even if you did lose all, you'll obtain much more afterwards, and better, you'll have a friend on whom you can count on anytime; God.

Just think about it. It's just a simple choice. You choose to believe or not.

I hope you do the better one, Peace.

Galveston1 · Nov 1, 2008, 04:51 PM

Atheists do believe in a god. He is known as "Random Occurance".

Credendovidis · Nov 2, 2008, 05:38 PM

Originally Posted by Galveston1

Atheists do believe in a god. He is known as "Random Occurance".

What a rubbish!! Specially as you have been told in the past what an Atheist is, and what he "believes"...

What is Atheism? / What is an Atheist?

ATHEISM

A THEISM

A = No(t) or Without

THEISM = Belief in "God" or "Gods"

ATHEISM = No or Without Belief in "God" or "Gods"

Atheism is NOT disbelief in the existence of a "supreme being or beings".
Most Atheists have NO opinion on the existence of a "supreme being or beings".
Only a few "Strong" Atheists do that. Most "Soft/Weak" Atheists simply ignore the possibility of existence of a "supreme being or beings", as there is no (OSE) proof for that religious claim.

---

Agnosticism is about questioning the existence of a supreme being or beings, with the conclusion that nobody will ever know.

The basic tenets of Christianity are the belief that Jesus is the Saviour, and that you have to love and forgive your "neighbors".
The basic tenet of Atheism is the lack of belief in any deity or deities.

So your statement that "Atheists do believe in a god. He is known as "Random Occurance"" is based in your own oversupply of "hot air", and lacks any valid support. Nothing new , I see...

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

.

.

arcura · Nov 2, 2008, 05:45 PM

BMI.
I agree with you.
I have difficulty trying to understand why ANY atheist is participating on ANY religious board.
Peace and kindness,
Fred

michealb · Nov 2, 2008, 05:51 PM

We find adults who believe in magic entertaining.

Credendovidis · Nov 2, 2008, 06:57 PM

Originally Posted by arcura

... I have difficulty trying to understand why ANY atheist is participating on ANY religious board.

Have you ever asked? May be it is a reaction against the intolerance of certain theists on this board, and/or of those theists who insist to pursue, hunt, or haunt every Atheist with their own theist chimeras and/or paranoia , either here or by going from door to door...

Have a nice day, Fred !

:)

.

.

arcura · Nov 2, 2008, 07:27 PM

Cred,
That makes no sense at all.
You would now know what the theists on this or any religious board say if you never were there.
So what is the REAL reason you are here?
Peace and kindness,
Fred

Credendovidis · Nov 2, 2008, 07:53 PM

Originally Posted by arcura

cred, That makes no sense at all.

To you may be it does that, Fred !

Originally Posted by arcura

So what is the REAL reason you are here?

Just as you and all others do here, Fred : to state my opinion !
This is after all a discussion board where everyone can participate within the limits of the board rules.
And these rules do not demand any specific (religious) views to participate...

Have a nice day, Fred !

:)

.

.

Alty · Nov 2, 2008, 07:59 PM

Fred, may I point out that the religious discussion boards are open to all people of all faiths, not just Christians.

If you don't want to hear the opinions of people that aren't Christian then you should be posting your questions on the Christianity boards, where people like Cred, Michealb, and even me cannot participate as per site rules.

TexasParent · Nov 2, 2008, 08:04 PM

There are plenty of preachers right now that claim miracles of healing through Jesus and they are regularly debunked.

So seeing a miracles performed even by Jesus wouldn't be enough.

The truth is that Jesus would have to convince me using the truth that I know, something about my life that only I know with dead on specifics to convince me of the miracle that he is God. Not generalities, specifics, that he would know my life spread out before him and replay it back to me. I would drop to my knees and surrender to him on the spot if he could specifically describe the event or incident in my life where I asked for God's help.

Again not general mumbo jumbo, but specifics, the people involved, my age, the place I was when I asked for help.

No magician's tricks, no slight of hand, no raising of the dead when I not qualified to determine death in the first place, etc.

This isn't too much to ask of God, since God can do anything. If he wants me, then he knows what to do.

Galveston1 · Nov 2, 2008, 08:10 PM

If you read the article that I pointed out you will see that the girl's neurosurgeon is far more openminded than several of you are. Do you think he is deluded? Hmm?

Alty · Nov 2, 2008, 08:22 PM

I think he sees what he wants to see, like so many of us do. Deluded, no, just hopeful.

I believe that I am fairly openminded. If I truly saw a miracle then I would have no problem admitting that it's a miracle, after all, that would be proof of God, I'd finally know whether I'm following the right path.

Most "miracles" have other explanations that are more realistic than a true miracle.

TexasParent · Nov 2, 2008, 08:29 PM

Originally Posted by Galveston1

If you read the article that I pointed out you will see that the girl's neurosurgeon is far more openminded than several of you are. Do you think he is deluded?? Hmm?

I believe the mind and the body is an untapped miracle capable of healing itself in ways we haven't yet begun to understand. If you believe that it's God direct intervention then that's a pattern of belief that works for you and you are a lucky person to never have to doubt. However, God gave me a brain and an inquisitive and questioning mind. Geez, even the bible warns about falseness and to use your God given ability to descern what is true and what isn't. Based on the life that has been laid out for me, I have posted what it would take, what a miracle would be for me.