[DrBill100]

He's right, of course, that seizures can cause sudden death. That fails to tie together the physical environment (bathtub) and position of body, etc. But the preeminent problem is that you should not be left with guesswork and searching out the most likely assumption. The purpose of PMEs is to resolve these issues scientifically and conclusively.

I agree that it would be premature to contact an attorney and I don't feel you're yet prepared for a meeting with the coroner. But you will be. By all means do not initiate any contact with the coroner while you are angry and distraught.

[excon]

I don't want to talk to my lawyer until after I have my appointment with the coroner, because I don't want to prevent the coroner from saying anything to me.

Hello again, t:

That IS a concern. However, I don't think visiting a lawyer necessarily insures that outcome. He might very well agree that nothing should be said until after your meeting. Or, he might have a different strategy. If not, he'll certainly advise you HOW to conduct your interview with the coroner, and what pertinent questions to ask. I'd be wondering whether I could or SHOULD tape the session. It's certainly worth exploring.

I'm just saying, that if you're going to see a lawyer in any case, it would be my view, that sooner is better. Forewarned is forearmed.

excon

[thisisit]

Thanks DrBill, I won't. At first I was upset that they put me off till the end of next month, but now I feel I need that time to compose myself and get my emotions under control so that I don't go in with guns a' blazing.

[thisisit]

Hello again, t:

That IS a concern. However, I don't think visiting a lawyer necessarily insures that outcome. He might very well agree that nothing should be said until after your meeting. Or, he might have a different strategy. If not, he'll certainly advise you HOW to conduct your interview with the coroner, and what pertinent questions to ask. I'd be wondering whether I could or SHOULD tape the session. It's certainly worth exploring.

I'm just saying, that if you're going to see a lawyer in any case, it would be my view, that sooner is better. Forewarned is forearmed.

excon

Good point, however I know for sure I can only control myself. My sister has already suggested a tape recorder for the meeting, think I'll pick one up... preferably one that can be hidden.

[DrBill100]

Hello again, t:

That IS a concern. However, I don't think visiting a lawyer necessarily insures that outcome. He might very well agree that nothing should be said until after your meeting. Or, he might have a different strategy. If not, he'll certainly advise you HOW to conduct your interview with the coroner, and what pertinent questions to ask. I'd be wondering whether I could or SHOULD tape the session. It's certainly worth exploring.

I'm just saying, that if you're going to see a lawyer in any case, it would be my view, that sooner is better. Forewarned is forearmed.

excon

Thus far the culpable party is a governmental entity operating under the protection of sovereign immunity so long as they acted with proper discretion. However, there is another line of accountability available as the doctors are individually accountable to state licensure boards and professional membership groups. Complaints against licensed physicians will fall under administrative law procedures and most attorneys are reluctant to venture into that territory or even know how to handle it.

It may be that there is no productive cause of action for civil damages but that the doctors can be held accountable for their professional conduct through an administrative action(s). That would require an abuse of discretion. We don't know that yet.

Your advice is sound. I just don't think there's enough to present to an attorney at this point. It is just my thought that aggregating additional facts will direct her to the proper attorney and allow a more informed decision. Few that I know of will take thin cases on a contingency and fewer yet will enter an admin case except on hourly basis. But as a legal procedural matter you are probably right.

[cdad]

I don't want to talk to my lawyer until after I have my appointment with the coroner, because I don't want to prevent the coroner from saying anything to me. I did not have to bring up the autopsy with my son's doctor, he asked me what the autopsy showed. When I told him there was no autopsy, and I read what the piece of paper I have says, he was shocked. He was also very surprised that it took almost 2 months to get a none autopsy report. He repeated to me more than once that he told the coroner that it was his opinion that my son needed a full autopsy. He told me it is not unheard of that people with seizures have sudden unexplained death, but that usually is the case when seizures are not under control.

Im going to but in again. I did a little research and found out that where your son was living there is a laundry list of people that can proclaim caus of death besides the coroner. So until you get what you think is the big picture try to hold back and just listen. I know it's a tough time for you and you want answers. But the EMT in attendance could have came up with caus of death and there would have been no autopsy. Understand its prevailing law of that area.

[excon]

My sister has already suggested a tape recorder for the meeting, think I'll pick one up... preferably one that can be hidden.

Hello again, t:

As long as you know that taping WITHOUT permission is LEGAL in your state. It COULD be a felony. You don't want to complicate things... That's ONE of the reasons I suggested you get legal advice.

excon

[DrBill100]

Im going to but in again. I did alittle research and found out that where your son was living there is a laundry list of people that can proclaim caus of death besides the coroner. So until you get what you think is the big picture try to hold back and just listen. I know its a tough time for you and you want answers. But the EMT in attendence could have came up with caus of death and there would have been no autopsy. Understand its prevailing law of that area.

I learn something everyday. Please share with us the other persons that are empowered and qualified to determine cause of death, along with enabling statute if known. I've never heard of that.

[thisisit]

Hello again, t:

As long as you know that taping WITHOUT permission is LEGAL in your state. It COULD be a felony. You don't want to complicate things... That's ONE of the reasons I suggested you get legal advice.

excon

Oh geez, yes I sure don't want to be the one committing a crime here! I think it is legal as long as one person knows the conversation is being taped. I'll have to find out for sure. If both people have to be aware, I'll simply put the tape recorder on the table and tell the coroner I'm taping so that I don't have to keep going back to her with questions.

[thisisit]

Im going to but in again. I did alittle research and found out that where your son was living there is a laundry list of people that can proclaim caus of death besides the coroner. So until you get what you think is the big picture try to hold back and just listen. I know its a tough time for you and you want answers. But the EMT in attendence could have came up with caus of death and there would have been no autopsy. Understand its prevailing law of that area.

There was no EMT, it was 2 police officers and a woman acting as coroner investigator. The police told me and it is printed in the police report that the coroner investigator took possession of the body for autopsy.

[cdad]

Oh geez, yes I sure don't want to be the one committing a crime here! I think it is legal as long as one person knows the conversation is being taped. I'll have to find out for sure. If both people have to be aware, I'll simply put the tape recorder on the table and tell the coroner I'm taping so that I don't have to keep going back to her with questions.

Ref:

http://www.citmedialaw.org/legal-gui...-recording-law

[thisisit]

Ref:

Ohio Recording Law | Citizen Media Law Project

Thank you! I found also that all the information the coroner has is considered public information, so I don't think there should be a problem recording my meeting. I will ask my lawyer though just to be safe.

[JudyKayTee]

Good point, however I know for sure I can only control myself. My sister has already suggested a tape recorder for the meeting, think I'll pick one up... preferably one that can be hidden.

This is a Federal crime in some States - I don't know where you are but you should look into this.

First, it's a dangerous practice. Second, it rises to a felony.

Do you know why I don't get on the medical boards and argue? Because I don't know squat about medicine.

Know why I post on the legal boards? Because that's my education, experience, knowledge.

I realize you think that no one can get a Judgment against you and also that as long as one person knows the conversation is being taped you are all right -

I'd check with an Attorney on both counts.

[thisisit]

This is a Federal crime in some States - I don't know where you are but you should look into this.

First, it's a dangerous practice. Second, it rises to a felony.

Do you know why I don't get on the medical boards and argue? Because I don't know squat about medicine.

Know why I post on the legal boards? Because that's my education, experience, knowledge.

I realize you think that no one can get a Judgment against you and also that as long as one person knows the conversation is being taped you are all right -

I'd check with an Attorney on both counts.

Will do Judy, and thank you very much for your advice. I'm pretty sure, but a lawyer I am not! If a lawyer in my district tells me it is illegal, I will put a tape recorder on the table and tell the coroner I am taping our meeting so that I don't have to go back and ask her the same questions again.

[DrBill100]

I noticed that some of the names I included in a previous post have now been reduced to initials. I don't object, in fact it's a pretty good idea - but wonder how and why it occurred.

[twinkiedooter]

There just might be another reason an autopsy was not done - money. Most counties these days in Ohio (I live in Ohio as well) are dead broke and are laying off police officers left and right, are shuttering libraries and restricting their hours, etc. This woman just may have decided that it was an obvious natural death due to the tumor and decided not to have the autopsy performed. You had him cremated. I hate to say this but you should not have done that until you were satisfied about his death and the cause of it. Had he been buried he could have been exhumed and the mystery of his death solved. As long as an external examination was performed that ruled out any foul play I'm thinking the coroner just took the "cheap" way out for the county and did not have the autopsy performed.

Also, as JKT said you don't really have any monetary damages to sue the coroner for or the county either other than not properly performing her legal duty (in your mind) to your son, the county will not be able to be sued. Taking this kind of case on in Court and winning will be almost impossible as the evidence (your son's body) has been irretrievably destroyed and unable to be examined by an autopsy.

I'm thinking you need to let this matter go. He was not the victim of foul play but died a natural death in the bathroom in the tub. A tumor on the pituatary gland can cause a person's eyesight and balance to be affected. A co-worker friend of mine had a tumor on the pituatary gland and his eyesight was the first to go. He had to have an immediate operation as his tumor was life threatening. You had your son for many years living with this volitale condition and could have lost him at any time such as when he was in the coma for 3 days. Please stop feeling guilty about this as you are not to blame. If anyone is to blame - blame the county for running out of money.

[thisisit]

He did not have this condition for many years! He was diagnosed after his baby was born. His doctor told me today that my son was stable. He saw my son the day before he died and everything looked good, he was stable AND when the coroner called him, he told her that it was his opinion that neither the tumor nor seizure disorder was the cause of death and he thought a full autopsy should be done. I was lead to believe an autopsy was done, that is why I had his body cremated.

[thisisit]

My son's baby is 2 years old.

[DrBill100]

Hang tough. We'll work through this item by item. You need a little time to assimilate this latest info.

[thisisit]

Thanks DrBill, I'd like to add that if money was the problem I would have been glad to pay for the autopsy, but I was never called by the coroner and neither was his girlfriend, nor was anyone else in the family.