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talaniman · Mar 20, 2008, 08:53 PM

Those that ignore the lessons of history, are doomed to repeat it. Get to googling!

Wondergirl · Mar 20, 2008, 09:30 PM

Originally Posted by SkyGem

Besides that, what Patriotic American wants to go to a church, no matter what it predominant race, and listen to sermons that damn America, our beloved country! Speeches that border on sedition are not my cup of tea, folks. Too bad it appears to be the name brand of Wondergirl since she seems to know so much about and is defending such places and that should tell the story about who we are conversing with! Conversation with that one ended immediately!

When fundamentalist Christians have been seated at restaurant tables near the washrooms and kitchen, have had to drink out of defective or inoperable water fountains that are separate from those that everyone else drinks from, are made to use separate public toilets that haven't been cleaned for months and have broken fixtures, have been told their children must transfer to an inadequate school across town when a good one is only a few blocks from home, must be buried in their own cemeteries, cannot initiate a conversation and are not allowed to make eye contact with anyone who isn't a fundamentalist Christian, and have sat at the back of the bus only because that's the ujspoken rule, then let's discuss this rationally. (SkyGem is showing prejudice by not being willing even to discuss.)

talaniman · Mar 20, 2008, 10:00 PM

Iran Contra Affair

Main article: CIA and Contras cocaine trafficking in the US
Released on April 13, 1989, the Kerry Committee report concluded that members of the U.S. State Department "who provided support for the Contras were involved in drug trafficking...and elements of the Contras themselves knowingly received financial and material assistance from drug traffickers."
In 1996 Gary Webb wrote a series of articles published in the San Jose Mercury News, which investigated Nicaraguans linked to the CIA-backed Contras who had allegedly smuggled cocaine into the U.S. which was then distributed as crack cocaine into Los Angeles and funneled profits to the Contras. According to Webb, the CIA was aware of the cocaine transactions and the large shipments of drugs into the U.S. by the Contra personnel and directly aided drug dealers to raise money for the Contras.
In 1996 CIA Director John Deutsch went to Los Angeles to refute the allegations raised by the Gary Webb, and was famously confronted by former LAPD officer Michael Rupert, who said he had witnessed it occurring. [6]

I saw this confrontation on HBO.

tomder55 · Mar 21, 2008, 02:51 AM

Wondergirl the truth is that Rev Wright's version of liberation theology is separatist and an endorsement of segregation. They have rejected the message of MLK Jr.

speechlesstx · Mar 21, 2008, 05:16 AM

Originally Posted by BABRAM

Even stranger coming from Caucasian Republicans that have never stepped foot into a African-American church before.

Since I raised the question I feel the need to remind you that I have on several occasions set foot in black churches... I've already said that.

speechlesstx · Mar 21, 2008, 05:20 AM

Obama has clarified that his Grandmother isn't racist, "she is a typical white person."

610 WIP host Angelo Cataldi asked Obama about his Tuesday morning speech on race at the National Constitution Center in which he referenced his own white grandmother and her prejudice. Obama told Cataldi that "The point I was making was not that my grandmother harbors any racial animosity, but that she is a typical white person. If she sees somebody on the street that she doesn't know (pause) there's a reaction in her that doesn't go away and it comes out in the wrong way."

I feel better now, don't you? Oh, and could you expand on what a "typical white person" is Mr. Obama?

BABRAM · Mar 21, 2008, 05:23 AM

Originally Posted by speechlesstx

Obama has clarified that his Grandmother isn't racist, "she is a typical white person."

I feel better now, don't you? Oh, and could you expand on what a "typical white person" is Mr. Obama?

Ya think? Well... I'll give the same lecture I just provided Tom. I'm not going to be voting based on McCain's feeling for his great uncle, his cousin, or his mother. Obama loves all his family black and white, as I'm sure John McCain does. I know you heard some old white Republican news commentator on TV suggest that Obama threw his grandmother under the bus. Well Steve their paid to say nonsense to stir the masses and have no substance at a time when GW Bush has screwed the majority of us into economic oblivion.

excon · Mar 21, 2008, 05:41 AM

Hello:

I ain't no Christian, so what do I know about it? However, Jesus was rabblerousing Jew, and I know something about that.

He wasn't politically correct. He upset the status quo. He disrupted the comfortable. He got angry. He threw the moneychangers out of the temple. You seemed to like it when Jesus did it. Is that cause he was white? Or because YOU were the one being oppressed?? Frankly, Jesus raised holy hell. Why can't Wright?

excon

talaniman · Mar 21, 2008, 05:46 AM

Wondergirl the truth is that Rev Wright's version of liberation theology is separatist and an endorsement of segregation. They have rejected the message of MLK Jr.

You can infer that from a 10 minute sound bite? Your good.

speechlesstx · Mar 21, 2008, 07:59 AM

Originally Posted by BABRAM

Ya think?! Well...I'll give the same lecture I just provided Tom. I'm not going to be voting based on McCain's feeling for his great uncle, his cousin, or his mother. Obama loves all his family black and white, as I'm sure John McCain does. I know you heard some old white Republican news commentator on TV suggest that Obama threw his grandmother under the bus. Well Steve their paid to say nonsense to stir the masses and have no substance at a time when GW Bush has screwed the majority of us into economic oblivion.

Thanks Bobby, but I don't need a lecture. You can vote for whoever you want for whatever reason, and I don't recall having doubted how much Obama loves his granny.

I do find it amusing how sensitive Obama's supporters get over the idea that he might be imperfect, that his Messianic credentials are fading. It's funny to see how quickly they change the subject when one of his flaws is revealed and after we've been treated to 8 years of Bush bashing, it's even funnier when they divert the attention to Bush.

Picture McCain saying something about a "typical black man." How long do you think before Jesse, Al, the NAACP and every MSM outlet in the country had a major hissy fit? Besides the latest Obama episodes revealing legitimate reasons to question his judgment, it highlights this racial double standard that myself and plenty of others are fed up with... and I don't need any "old white Republican news commentator" to explain it to me. Like it or not this past week has raised serious concerns about Obama, and until he can quit stumbling his way through it it's not going to get any easier for him or his supporters.

I want to know what a "typical white person" is to Mr. Obama. Am I one? Are you one? Tell us Senator, what exactly is a "typical white person?"

speechlesstx · Mar 21, 2008, 08:02 AM

Originally Posted by excon

Hello:

I ain't no Christian, so what do I know about it? However, Jesus was rabblerousing Jew, and I know something about that.

He wasn't politically correct. He upset the status quo. He disrupted the comfortable. He got angry. He threw the moneychangers out of the temple. You seemed to like it when Jesus did it. Is that cause he was white? Or because YOU were the one being oppressed??? Frankly, Jesus raised holy hell. Why can't Wright?

Yeah, Jesus was raising holy hell about the hypocrites. I can only imagine how He would react to some of Wright's rants. :D

Wondergirl · Mar 21, 2008, 09:30 AM

Originally Posted by tomder55

Wondergirl the truth is that Rev Wright's version of liberation theology is seperatist and an endorsement of segregation. They have rejected the message of MLK Jr.

Tom, that's not true at all!! Have you heard or read lots of Wright's sermons? Have you interviewed him? Have you read up on his philosophy?

Dark_crow · Mar 21, 2008, 09:57 AM

Excon
Wright can and has spoken…at the same time, I can and have, and you can and have. And with this post [post #68 you reach a couple thousand years in the past.

excon · Mar 21, 2008, 10:07 AM

Originally Posted by Dark_crow

And with this post [post #68 you reach a couple thousand years in the past.

Hello DC:

Yes, I did. Because the times and the people and what they say are SOOOO comparible. You don't think they are. Don't surprise me none.

excon

tomder55 · Mar 22, 2008, 02:10 AM

Tom, that's not true at all!! Have you heard or read lots of Wright's sermons? Have you interviewed him? Have you read up on his philosophy?

I have read the church's web site as well as reasearched the people Rev Wright says influenced him .

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/curren...-195912-3.html

tomder55 · Mar 22, 2008, 02:33 AM

Picture McCain saying something about a "typical black man." How long do you think before Jesse, Al, the NAACP and every MSM outlet in the country had a major hissy fit?

Hmmmm let's see what Jesse said in a similar vein :

There is nothing more painful to me ... than to walk down the street and hear footsteps and start thinking about robbery, then look around and see somebody white and feel relieved. -- Jesse Jackson

Jesse must be a typical white person.

Wondergirl · Mar 22, 2008, 10:48 AM

Originally Posted by tomder55

as a matter of fact I have read the church's web site as well as reasearched the people Rev Wright says influenced him .

https://www.askmehelpdesk.com/curren...-195912-3.html

And you're black, in your 60s, and grew up in the United States?

excon · Mar 22, 2008, 10:55 AM

Hello tom:

The point Wondergirl is making, and I echo it, is that no matter how smart you are (and you're smart), and no matter how much empathy you have for the black community, you can't understand what a black man goes through unless you live in his black skin.

Beyond that, having never experienced what black people go through, I find it quite presumptions of the right wing to expect that black people should think and act like white people - especially the ones who aren't in the ghetto anymore.

excon

Galveston1 · Mar 22, 2008, 05:27 PM

Anyone ever listen to Bill Cosby on the subject? Now, he's intelligent.

tomder55 · Mar 23, 2008, 01:20 AM

I reject the argument that it's a black thing so I can't understand. What Rev Wright and the black liberationist are selling is a philosophy diametrically opposed to MLK Jr 's message and it denegrades what he fought for.btw ;I agree with you that the core message in Obama's speech on the subject was the same argument you make... it's a black thing. Wright's racism is understandable and so is Obama's grandmothers . Nonsense !
It doesn't advance anything and it does not unite .

In Obama's 2004 Dem Convention Speech that propelled him to national prominence he said “there is not a black America and a white America... . There's the United States of America.” That is what made him so transitional and gave people so much hope. . The question is ;does he believe it or not? His 20 year attendance at Wright's church and his close association with him gives us ligitimate reasons to question that.