[excon]

Hello again,

I've been asking our right wing friends WHAT their plan is, but I'm rebuffed. I'm told there's PLENTY of plans, yet the Republicans have made NO proposals.

Today, on Meet the Press, Paul Ryan SAID that NOBODY wants to go back to the old way where insurance companies decided what health care you get. Essentially, he acknowledges the BENEFITS of Obamacare. He just offered NO way to pay for it.

That IS the question for you righty's, isn't it?? How to PAY for it.

Oh, I know I'll hear the same old crap about if I paid attention, I'd KNOW what the Republican plan is.. But, I DO pay attention, and there's NO plan. There's CERTAINLY no legislation.. Who CARES about the "plans", that reside in the heads of right wingers, unless they put 'em in a BILL????

excon

[talaniman]

They did Ex, their plan is cut rich guy taxes and make workers pay more for what they buy. Trickle down economics but with no trickle. Increase profits and make labor cheaper.

You heard of RINO's? Well they have moved to being JCINO! Job Creators In Name Only!! Easy profits without working for them. Fat lazy greedy rich guys. Keep workers poor and on the public dole and talk about 'em like dogs.

Thought a liberal like you knew that.

[cdad]

They did Ex, their plan is cut rich guy taxes and make workers pay more for what they buy. Trickle down economics but with no trickle. Increase profits and make labor cheaper.

Thought a liberal like you knew that.

This is exactly the plan under Obamacare. To wipe out any remaining remnants of the middle class in this country. You have seen it but you just keep ignoring it. Be prepared for what you wished for as its going to turn this country upside down.

[talaniman]

Making minimum wage, so called "entry level jobs", middle class jobs hurts the middle class?

[cdad]

What is currently happening to the middle class right now is that they are seeing a steep decline in buying power of the dollars that they earn and with Obamacare in place it has added yet another layer of expense. Not everyone is going to get a subsidy and those that may need it most are going to be denied. Some that have already had thier plans modified have seen huge rate hikes and less coverage of medicines that were previously covered making an already expensive world cost even more. Deductables have risen to a point where going to a ER for treatment is almost out of the question unless your about to die. Thanks Obamacare.

[NeedKarma]

To wipe out any remaining remnants of the middle class in this country.

How do they benefit by doing this?

[cdad]

They can benefit from it by creating a permanent dependent class of citizens and fracturing the govenment to change the status to a social government rather then a republic.

[talaniman]

Poverty and lack of opportunity and options creates the permanent second class citizen. Talking about them just adds to the myth they deserve no more value as humans, or citizens. And transfers to their kids.

The whole notion of lumping the working poor with welfare queens, cheats, and lazy bums is a despicable tactic and political lie. But its been used since Nixon.

[tomder55]

yeah Ryan talks a good game and then is part of a budget deal that allows more government spending on the very thing he says he wants to repeal and replace. This week Harry Reid and Pelosi praised Ryan . That's all you need to know .

[talaniman]

That was a very small budget deal, and basically changes very little except stop the TParty from shutting down government... AGAIN in January, but down the line who knows what the loony's will do.

[NeedKarma]

They can benefit from it by creating a permanent dependent class of citizens

Why would all american citizens want to be dependent?
We have socialized health care and it could easily be argued that we are a freer society than you are.

[excon]

Hello NK:

Why would all american citizens want to be dependent?

You hear it all the time. They think, that we think, that'll be good. I dunno why. I don't understand ANYTHING they think.

excon

[cdad]

It is not that they "want" to be dependent. But Obamacare is trying to force people to be dependent.

[excon]

Hello again, dad:

I didn't mean we, as in we poor people. I meant we, as in liberals.. What does Obama or the Democrats gain by having LOTS of people unemployed and dependent on them? If you say it's cause poor people vote for him, I wouldn't argue. They do. But, the poor didn't ELECT him. The middle did. Obama already HAS their votes. Why would he need to impoverish them??

excon

[talaniman]

A chance to be healthy and responsible is making people dependent? Giving workers a chance to buy stuff with a higher wage and getting them less dependent on government is a bad thing for the economy?

[cdad]

Tal, where are you getting this stuff? The fact is that with Obamacare many that could afford insurance before can not now afford it and have to rely on a subsidy. Are you trying to argue that fact?

[talaniman]

No argument, I agree. Its too high to really afford. The subsidies are tied to taxes, and adjusted for income. How else should the working poor get health insurance. Are you saying they don't need it? Or don't deserve it?

[cdad]

What Im saying is that they are putting on another layer of government by giving a subsidy that before all this wasnt needed. The people that now have to take it so they can keep insurance and never had the intention of taking anything from the government in the way of a handout. Forcing them to do so is just wrong. Its making more and more dependent on the government.

[paraclete]

cdad don't let pride blind you, The ACA recognised increased cost in some sectors and offsets that cost as well as giving people who weren't subsidised incentive to acquire health insurance through subsidy. What it doesn't recognise is that if you couldn't afford health insurance before you probably can't afford it now and an apparent side effect might be that some find it more expensive

[talaniman]

You do have a better way of doing it right?