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    wonderingsoul1's Avatar
    wonderingsoul1 Posts: 2, Reputation: 1
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    #1

    Apr 9, 2008, 02:10 PM
    Catholics: 'To Cross Oneself'
    I am curious as to why Catholics cross themseleves. My boyfriend is not a serious religious follower, as does not attend church regularly but I think he went when he was younger. I quite often see him 'crossing himself' and saying the words, father, son and the holy ghost I think? And he even kisses his hand. Often I have wondered about asking him why, but never plucked up the courage to do so, as I do not wish to embarrass him.

    Basically just curious as to why he does it, especially as I have noticed when he does it, it seems to be when one of us mentions death or a deathly experience, is there any relation between the two?
    tickle's Avatar
    tickle Posts: 23,796, Reputation: 2674
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    #2

    Apr 9, 2008, 03:34 PM
    Here is a rather lengthy answer to your question. It is ingrained in catholics to 'cross themselves' whether they go to church or not. It is developed from a very early age.

    "Placing the cross on oneself"

    1. We place our thumb and first two fingers together in a point, and our last we fingers flat against our palm. The three fingers together represent the Holy Trinity - Father, Son and Holy Spirit, and the two fingers in the palm represent the two natures of Christ.
    2. We touch our forehead, then our belly, tracing the vertical part of the cross.
    3. From our belly, we bring our hand up to our right shoulder, touching it.
    4. We finish placing the cross on ourself by touching our left shoulder.

    The act of "Placing the cross on oneself" is a request for a blessing from God. We make if from right to left to mirror the actions of the priest when he blesses us. The priest, looking at the parishioners, blesses from left to right. Therefore, the parishioners, putting on the sign of the cross on themselves, do it from right to left.

    Because the Lord separated the sheep from the goats, putting the faithful sheep on His right side, and the goats on the left, the Church always treats the right side as the preferred side. We only cross ourselves with our RIGHT hand. The priest, when blessing a person, first touches or points to their RIGHT side, then their left. Also the censing of the Holy Table in the Altar is always done from the RIGHT side first; censing of the Ikonostasis, the Congregation and of the Church itself always begins with the right side. The priest always gives communion with his RIGHT hand, even if he is left handed. There are other examples of this right side preference.

    When a parent makes the sign of the cross over a child, they will cross them from left to right, just as the priest blesses. When they make the sign of the cross over themselves, they would do it, logically, the other way.

    The Catholic Encyclopedia states that in the Roman Catholic Church, the faithful crossed themselves from right to left, just as the Orthodox do, until the 15th or 16th century. They must explain why they have changed an ancient and apostolic tradition. We cannot answer as to their motivations.

    Is it important to cross ourselves a particular way? In a word, YES. We do not have the authority to choose willy-nilly what parts of the Christina Tradition we want to follow. Our fathers, and countless saints crossed themselves from right to left. Ancient icons show Christ or bishops beginning a blessing from right to left. The right side is referred to in a preferential way many times in scripture and our sacred hymns What should we want to change?
    MoonlitWaves's Avatar
    MoonlitWaves Posts: 171, Reputation: 52
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    #3

    Apr 9, 2008, 03:41 PM
    Tickle, I have a question for you. You put a lot of emphasis on the RIGHT side. Is the right hand side the preferred side because Jesus sits on the right hand side of God?
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    tickle Posts: 23,796, Reputation: 2674
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    #4

    Apr 9, 2008, 04:58 PM
    I have checked, my husband said because Jesus sits on the right hand side of god. That could be a good reason and probably not the only one, I guess the real reason is lost in antiquity but it is as good as anything else as far as I am concerned. I am not catholic, my husband is, in fact he was going to be a Priest and attended a seminary in Quebec so I guess his opinion is as good as any. God Bless :)
    Choux's Avatar
    Choux Posts: 3,047, Reputation: 376
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    #5

    Apr 11, 2008, 07:30 PM
    Back in the ages, people were very superstitious because they didn't know how the Universe worked, and many superstitions still survive. The sign of the cross wards off what is considered evil or bad luck. It places the mark of GodAlmighty on the individual, and thus, symbolically, God's protection.

    IN primitive times prior to knowledge, left handedness was considered "sinister"... of the devil so to speak.

    Best wishes in 2008,
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    De Maria Posts: 1,359, Reputation: 52
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    #6

    Apr 17, 2008, 09:24 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by wonderingsoul1
    I am curious as to why Catholics cross themseleves.
    It is the most basic Trinitarian prayer found in Scripture.

    Matthew 28 19 Going therefore, teach ye all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.

    As Catholics we pray with our bodies as well as with words. Gestures such as the sign of the Cross and sprinkling of water, kneeling to show our humility before God demonstrate a complete submission before God.

    The Cross is the symbol of our salvation. Jesus has essentially turned the world topsy turvy. An instrument of torture and death has now become a symbol of love and eternal life.

    Matthew 16 24 Then Jesus said to his disciples: If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

    The Cross is the thau or "t" which is the symbol with which God's chosen are marked:

    Ezechiel 9 4 And the Lord said to him: Go through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem: and mark Thau upon the foreheads of the men that sigh, and mourn for all the abominations that are committed in the midst thereof.

    My boyfriend is not a serious religious follower, as does not attend church regularly but I think he went when he was younger. I quite often see him 'crossing himself' and saying the words, father, son and the holy ghost I think?
    That is correct. Touching the forehead we say, "in the name of the Father. Touching the chest or heart, we say, "and of the Son". Touching the left and right shoulder, we say, "and of the Holy Ghost", we then join our hands in the prayer position and say "amen."

    We begin and end all our prayers with the Sign of the Cross.

    and he even kisses his hand.
    He kisses the Cross which he forms with thumb and forefinger.

    Often I have wondered about asking him why, but never plucked up the courage to do so, as I do not wish to embarrass him.

    Basically just curious as to why he does it, especially as I have noticed when he does it, it seems to be when one of us mentions death or a deathly experience, is there any relation between the two?
    He must be praying for the deceased.

    May God bless you both and may this be an indicator of his imminent return to the Church.

    Sincerely,

    De Maria
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    Fr_Chuck Posts: 81,301, Reputation: 7692
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    #7

    Apr 25, 2008, 06:38 PM
    And to also remind everyone, Catholics are not nearly the only group that does the crossing, all of the Orthodox also cross thierself ( although they do it slightly different) And many of the Anglican also do it but not as much)

    Also many will bow their head when saying the name of Jesus
    JudyKayTee's Avatar
    JudyKayTee Posts: 46,503, Reputation: 4600
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    #8

    May 8, 2008, 07:06 AM
    Quote Originally Posted by Fr_Chuck
    And to also remind everyone, Catholics are not nearly the only group that does the crossing, all of the Orthodox also cross thierself ( although they do it slightly different) And many of the Anglican also do it but not as much)

    Also many will bow thier head when saying the name of Jesus

    Hmm - must depend on which religious order did the teaching but I was taught you kiss your right thumbnail, make the sign of the cross using the thumb to touch over the heart (the breastbone) while saying "in the name of the father," left ("in the name of the son") and right (in the name of the Holy Ghost") shoulders and then bring your thumbnail back to your lips for "Amen."

    Maybe it depends on ethnicity.

    This also enables you to hold a rosary while making the sign of the cross.
    tickle's Avatar
    tickle Posts: 23,796, Reputation: 2674
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    #9

    May 8, 2008, 08:21 AM
    JudyKayTee, I think the way they cross themselves depends on the religious order because my husband went to a seminary of Redempterist Fathers. He doesn't cross the way you mention.
    checkTradition's Avatar
    checkTradition Posts: 1, Reputation: 3
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    #10

    Jul 13, 2008, 01:51 PM
    Hey, let's keep this in prospective. I hope nobody gets personally offended but I feel it is my duty to say what I know.

    The Bible never talks about this tradition and Jesus never said to do it. Crossing oneself or how ever is called, is a man made tradition trying to fill the emptiness of lack of faith. Any religious practice without basis on the Bible is basically superstition. They don't protect, don't help, don't do anything. In any case what they do is make people believe the wrong things and get farther away from the truth of the Bible, which is the salvation of Jesus Christ by faith only, not deeds or tradition. I know that many leaders claim tradition is important but you have to double check. God's words were given for everybody, not only priests or religious leaders. Most people don't read the bible and there, is what God wants you to know and do. Don't let this important duty of interpreting the Bible to just a few people. More important, don't say that you know when you haven't even read it. While some traditions are the product of wise advise, not all of them are, so I advice you to base everything you do and believe on the Bible.

    - Practical questions to test the "superstitious" nature of crossing oneself...

    Would God protect and evil person that crosses himself?

    If I pray for protection but don't cross myself, does God deny the protection?

    Why would Paul and other apostles continuously tell christians to pray but never mention "crossing themselves"?

    There are many other traditions introduced by the politics of the early catholic church where paganism was mixed with pure christianity to preserve power. The movie "Luther" (not perfect but good historical representation) shows some of these "traditions" and some of the first attempts of true believers to go back to the truth of God.
    JudyKayTee's Avatar
    JudyKayTee Posts: 46,503, Reputation: 4600
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    #11

    Jul 13, 2008, 02:06 PM
    Quote Originally Posted by checkTradition
    Practical questions to test the "superstitious" nature of crossing oneself...

    Would God protect and evil person that crosses himself?

    If I pray for protection but don't cross myself, does God deny the protection?

    Why would Paul and other apostles continuously tell christians to pray but never mention "crossing themselves"?

    There are many other traditions introduced by the politics of the early catholic church where paganism was mixed with pure christianity to preserve power. The movie "Luther" (not perfect but good historical representation) shows some of these "traditions" and some of the first attempts of true believers to go back to the truth of God.

    I thought the sign of the cross was asking for a blessing, not some superstitious hand gesture to ward off evil -
    tickle's Avatar
    tickle Posts: 23,796, Reputation: 2674
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    #12

    Jul 13, 2008, 02:11 PM
    Hey check, this is a sort of old post, but you know, good to have your input. No one has to cross themselves, pray, ask for forgiveness. Its all inside of us to respect the wishes of those we love and tend to, or to those who have passed on from us.

    I was raised anglican because my parents were scots, english, canadian so the church we attended in our neighbourhood was something we always did going back, I don't know how long, but we had bible school. I enjoyed it but it didn't really expand my religion so to speak. I am now in middle ground and happy in my garden. If I could embrace anything it would be mother earth.

    My son has his instructions for my final passing and it will be cremation and spread around the beach where I grew up and enjoyed my life with my mom and dad and that will be one of the deals I can make and you know best of all, my son is happy with my final destination. I won't be crossing myself when I go, but I hope holding tight to my son's hand, the best passing I can have.

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