[speechlesstx]

How is it essentially different from Christianity today? The cover-ups with the priests sexually exploiting children, the suppression of women, blacks, and gays for centuries--even now, many Christian churches do not allow women to serve other than as nuns and exclude gays entirely--and until 50 years ago, excluded blacks from white churches.

The priest thing has been covered in this thread. Allowing women to serve in the church at all is probably much more than you'll get out of Islam. We don't afford them a lesser status, don't allow marriage to a child, force them to wear a hijab and veil and don't participate in honor killings.

How is taking over the world in the name of religion ANY different than what Christianity does?

OK I admit it, Christianity wants to convert the world. Voluntarily, entirely of your own free will and if you don't convert, I promise not to cut your head off... just be who you are.

Have you forgotten the Crusades, the witch burnings, the Spanish Inquisition and the missionaries to the New World?

I never knew them so I have nothing to forget.

If you don't believe me, try being a witch (pagan) or gay in the Bible Belt sometime.

I will have lived in the bible belt for 50 years next week and I've never seen any heretics burned at the stake. In fact, I think they meet at Memorial Park every Sunday, weather permitting.

[speechlesstx]

Hello again,

I wonder if there are any Christian church's that would like to turn this country into a theocracy, thereby destroying the Constitution. Nahh. Whoever heard of such a thing?

Who? In several decades of church life I have been taught to render unto Caesar what is Caesar's, but I don't recall anyone in the church ever calling for a theocracy.

[Synnen]

But the Christians in this country DO want a theocracy---they just don't call it that. Think of all the different ways religion influences law in this country. Running late this morning, so don't have time to get into examples--but I'm sure you can think of a few places where the "morals" that laws are built on come from the Christian morals.

And really--that was my point, speechlesstx, about the Crusades and witch burnings and all that--you DIDN'T know them. Neither do most Muslims know about what the terrorists are doing and planning. Looking at history--the atrocities committed in the name of Christianity have been as bad or worse than the atrocities committed in the name of Islam. But because YOU, personally, weren't a part of them, you refuse to acknowledge the point that the religion you belong to was behind them. Again--my point was ONLY that blaming ALL Muslims for the atrocities committed by some is like blaming ALL Christians for the atrocities committed by SOME. Or, if you like, that all blacks are bad because ONE of them stole from you. Or that all teenagers are bad and evil because you saw ONE of them on drugs. Please--accept an example for an example, already.

And having BEEN the witch in the Bible belt--burnings aren't always in the park at the stake. Egging my house, graffiti on my car, and discrimination in my workplace and other places, such as being asked to remove jewelry with pentacles on it or refusal to allow me to have my holy days off from work in exchange for working a different holiday. When's the last time you had to take Christmas or Easter off from work, and when have you EVER heard of someone being asked to remove a cross because someone found it offensive?

Either way--I see ALL of the objections to the new Mosque as religious discrimination unless you ask every church in the same area to please move away from a public/government remembrance site.

[speechlesstx]

Synnen, I think we've been over this before. If some moron 'Christians' egg your house and all that other stuff they're just that, morons. There is nothing in Christianity that teaches, allows, endorses that kind of behavior. There may be sects, just as with Islam, that pervert the faith but we have nothing in our bible or doctrine that can be used to justify it. If you were my neighbor you'd be my neighbor and hopefully a friend.

As for being asked to remove stuff or whatever, I don't know of any instances personally. I do know one of wife's employers made everyone cover their tattoos, but it was applied fairly to all as it should be.

As far as encoding morals into law, that works on all sides... doesn't make us a theocracy for trying to protect unborn babies or allowing kids to pray.

[excon]

Hello again,

Let's cut to the chase. YOU say, he has the RIGHT, but he SHOULDN'T build it...

Do you LIKE that right?? Would you change it if you could?

excon

[smoothy]

Hello again,

Let's cut to the chase. YOU say, he has the RIGHT, but he SHOULDN'T build it....

Do you LIKE that right??? Would you change it if you could?

excon

Should the Aryan Brotherhood have the right to build anything they want next to the NAACP headquarters?

And that particular Imam is no better than they are.

[speechlesstx]

Been there, done that multiple times ex. Yes, I like his right to build and I like my right to object.

[excon]

Should the Aryan Brotherhood have the right to build anything they want next to the NAACP headquarters?

Hello again, smoothy:

The question is simple and straightforward. Do you LIKE the First Amendment, or do you want to CHANGE it? Yes, or no is all that's required.

excon

[excon]

Yes, I like his right to build and I like my right to object.

Hello again, Steve:

You don't see ANY conflict in the above?? I'm not really sure what you mean... If you LIKE the amendment, it would seem that you wouldn't object when somebody takes advantage of it... Or is it just the WORDS that you like?

Please explain. Do you LIKE it when somebody takes advantage of his rights, or do you not?

excon

[speechlesstx]

I don't know what there is to explain, ex. They have the right to build it, I have the right to object. You recall the first amendment don't you? Does their right to build trump my right to object? Or, since you already know where I stand are you just waiting for me to endorse/bless/raise funds for the mosque? I think that's what you want.

[excon]

Hello again, Steve:

THIS is a DIFFERENT question. I KNOW you don't want to answer, because it makes you THINK. Most wingers don't want to DO that.

Would you CHANGE the First Amendment if you COULD?

excon

[smoothy]

Hello again, smoothy:

The question is simple and straightforward. Do you LIKE the First Amendment, or do you want to CHANGE it? Yes, or no is all that's required.

excon

What does the first amendment have to do with a Terrorist Memorial at or near ground Zero?

And even IF it did... why are Muslims Above having to meet every restriction and law that applies to everyone else.

[smoothy]

Hello again, Steve:

THIS is a DIFFERENT question. I KNOW you don't want to answer, because it makes you THINK. Most wingers don't wanna DO that.

Would you CHANGE the First Amendment if you COULD?

excon

It's the Liberals that want to shut down Talk radio and every form of media they don't have essential domination over like they do in Newspapers and the TV media. Where the DNC dictates what information they will keep from the public and what they will avoid talking about. Such as Obamas records and avoiding any hard questions at press conferences to him that they love to throw at republicans and have..

If it was BUSH that has spent MILLIONS keeping all his records secret from the public that's ALL we would ever hear about... but for Lord Obama the Messiah, not a word.

Don't try laying THAT trip on republicans when it's the Dems that have been actively trying to silence anyone that disagrees with the Messiah (Obama) or their agenda in general.

Just one example... "The Fairness Docterine" which is anything but fair where they would by force get 50% of the radio airtime, but it would not apply to the already Lefty dominated TV news or Newspapers.

Liberals in general believe in ONLY their own free speech... but not anyone else's.

[excon]

Hello again, smoothy:

I could call a monkey a cigarette, but it would still BE a monkey. You can spew all the words you like, but it won't change a mosque into ________.

You either don't KNOW the First Amendment (which is MY pick), or you do and you just want to deflect the conversation because you don't want to THINK about legal stuff like that.

But, I want to talk about legal stuff like that. If you don't want to address it, don't. But, I ain't going to respond to made up words.

excon

[excon]

Its the Liberals that want to shut down Talk radio

Hello again, smoothy:

If you want to engage me, you're going to have to learn to debate. You don't debate. You throw out slogans and talking points. That ain't interesting, and I quickly grow tired of it.

I think we're done here.

excon

[smoothy]

Hello again, smoothy:

If you want to engage me, you're going to have to learn to debate. You don't debate. You throw out slogans and talking points. That ain't interesting, and I quickly grow tired of it.

I think we're done here.

excon

Really, YOU can throw out talking points and slogans but I can't?

[smoothy]

Hello again, smoothy:

I could call a monkey a cigarette, but it would still BE a monkey. You can spew all the words you like, but it won't change a mosque into ________.

You either don't KNOW the First Amendment (which is MY pick), or you do and you just want to deflect the conversation because you don't want to THINK about legal stuff like that.

But, I want to talk about legal stuff like that. If you don't want to address it, don't. But, I ain't gonna respond to made up words.

excon

You know, I've actually read the first amendment, as well as the second. And Nowhere in it and under any wording are Muslims exempt from every thing that can prevent them from erecting a terrorist memorial on American soil.

You can't Erect a Christmas Tree or Mention Christmas in schools... but Muslims are allowed to do anything they want, anywhere they want. I want to see how Muslims are granted rights Christians don't have in the Constitution. Since I can't find it myself can you please point it out.

[speechlesstx]

THIS is a DIFFERENT question.

Sure it is when you change the question.

I KNOW you don't want to answer, because it makes you THINK. Most wingers don't want to DO that.

I love to think, I'm just very tired.

Would you CHANGE the First Amendment if you COULD?

No.

[excon]

Really, YOU can throw out talking points and slogans but I can't?

Hello again, smoothy:

THAT is the problem we have. You can't tell the difference between slogans and debate. I'm sorry, Dude. I like you, but this ain't working for either of us. I'm breaking up. Don't call.

excon

[smoothy]

Hello again, smoothy:

THAT is the problem we have. You can't tell the difference between slogans and debate. I'm sorry, Dude. I like you, but this ain't working for either of us. I'm breaking up. Don't call.

excon

So... YOU can accuse Republicans of being anti-first amendment because the Left is above ever even being questioned. But actual attempts by the left to actually restrict the first amendment can not be mentioned..


Come on now... unless you can produce in specific wording where Muslims OUTSIDE THE USA can build a Terrorist memorial on OUR SOIL and be above any criticism then I think its you who is using talking points and diversion, not me. And Nobody has yet proven WHERE that money is actually coming from... for all anyone knows it can be Ossama Bin Laden or his buddies in Suadi Arabia financing it. NOT Americans. THe Imam being a straw man in the whole thing.