[valinors_sorrow]

I agree with part of your point but not about children on drugs. You can ask them first and if they say no, you need to start looking to make sure. I volunteer a lot with teenagers in trouble. If you suspect drugs or alcohol, discuss it first but you have to make sure. The sooner you can become aware of a problem with them, the sooner you can start helping them.

Actually I was agreeing with you. I make a distinction between snooping and scrutiny. What makes scrutiny not snooping is announcing it beforehand so it is not a sudden, unexpected invasion of privacy. Without the annoucement of "yes, you will be scrutinized", its akin to entrapment, which is emotionally damaging for all concerned. But in some circumstances scrutiny is very necessary, like kids on drugs. But I wonder if a spouse would ever do this to a spouse?

[talaniman]

By Val

Actually I was agreeing with you. I make a distinction between snooping and scrutiny. What makes scrutiny not snooping is announcing it beforehand so it is not a sudden, unexpected invasion of privacy. Without the annoucement of "yes, you will be scrutinized", its akin to entrapment, which is emotionally damaging for all concerned. But in some circumstances scrutiny is very necessary, like kids on drugs. But I wonder if a spouse would ever do this to a spouse?

Not only is trust important for a married couple, communication is the cornerstone. I never will understand how some one can't just say, hey I feel this or that, instead of going through e-mails or wallets or cell phones. Being honest and up front is the best way to go ,but by the same token if a question is asked by a spouse then it should be answered and none of that question with a question mess either. Again the truth upfront will allay fears, and set minds at ease and if it doesn't then -SAY SO! Instead of walking around with a lip stuck out wondering can you trust or not? At some point when the suspicion continues though, as in a question of where have you been not being very believable any human would be remiss not to use any means at their disposal to find out the truth! When two minds do not meet we get conflict.:cool: ;)

[Depressed in MO]

by Val

Not only is trust important for a married couple, communication is the cornerstone. I never will understand how some one can't just say, hey I feel this or that, instead of going thru e-mails or wallets or cell phones. Being honest and up front is the best way to go ,but by the same token if a question is asked by a spouse then it should be answered and none of that question with a question mess either. Again the truth upfront will allay fears, and set minds at ease and if it doesn't then -SAY SO! instead of walking around with a lip stuck out wondering can you trust or not? At some point when the suspicion continues though, as in a question of where have you been not being very believable any human would be remiss not to use any means at their disposal to find out the truth! When two minds do not meet we get conflict.:cool: ;)

Well what about after the fact that you talk to that person and they still continue their suspicious behavior? What is one suppose to do then? I've done the whole" respect his privacy" and don't snoop thing and it did nothing but buy him more time to do more harm.

[talaniman]

Well what about after the fact that you talk to that person and they still continue their suspicious behavior? What is one suppose to do then? I've done the whole" respect his privacy" and don't snoop thing and it did nothing but buy him more time to do more harm.

As I stated before if his answers were not beleivable say so then and there! After that you do what you have to (I would) If people have nothing to hide they generally don't act suspicious and to be honest hiding my cell phone and wallet is out of the question ,just me mind you, but I really don't care if my wife goes through them, But if a spouse cannot answer a simple question to allay the fears of their spouse then all bets off. To get respect you must give it! In your case which I remember very well Yourself -esteem did not allow you to put this right in his face and demand that he tell the truth or get out and if I remember right he left several times and you took him back and he did the same thing again.WE ALL HAVE THE RIGHT TO KNOW THE TRUTH FROM THE PEOPLE WE SHARE OUR LIFE WITH!

[Myth]

From my conversation with her this morning it seems that she had said something about this weeks ago.. her gut I mean... Recently (in the last week) there had been some damage to his cell phone over which he flipped out and needed it replaced asap as he was going out of town. She needed to have his verification code to be able to do that while he was at work and sooo when he gave it to her she remembered that it was also his password onto his comp screen...
From there it was all a matter of she open his Yahoo messenger and clicked on the mail button and was in. The had discussed her gut for a couple of weeks now and he had not managed to put her at ease but to make it worse. The night before his work trip he spent 3hrs "talking" to this woman on the comp. This was the day after the date on the email. He also demanded nicely his privacy to talk to his friends. He did not spend anytime with her as she packed his things and this made her even more suspicious. I think that she's given him ample time to "come clean" so to speak. I also think that everything happens for a reason and that maybe she was sapposed to find this out. I believe that having a pic of a strangers vagina in his email is akin to having another woman in the house... I mean how would he feel if the roles were reversed??

[Wildcat21]

Sounds like there is a rat in Denmark.

Time for your friend to have that talk. IF he doesn't want to talk about it - bingo

[Myth]

I agree... I think she needs to confront him. Why let this go any further

[Wildcat21]

She has to - no question.

[talaniman]

You mean he actually ask for privacy to talk to his g/f? Well after your last post Myth, I strongly recommend taking the nice gloves off for this next session with hubbie. If she still has access to his E-mail... (I don't like half slick lying cheaters)

[J_9]

Not only does he has to ask for privacy to talk to the girlfriend, but the wife goes ahead and gives privacy to the husband to talk to his girlfriend.

I would never have let it get that far!

[valinors_sorrow]

It's a hard lesson and a pretty tough concept but many of the people who get walked all over simply allow it. They really do. They tend to hook up with walkers too, strangely enough. The fear of losing someone demands that they tolerate it. It is them demanding it of themselves but then they blame the walker for that as well as the walking.

How do I know this? I was just like that. I help people now who are like that. I eventually learned that no relationship is better than a bad one once I dealt with my codependency issues. But until then I was with a lot of messed up guys because I was so messed up.

I am not saying this is necessarily true of your friend Myth, but it certainly bears considering. I see a lot of blurred lines and after-the-fact justifications in what you are describing here about who is responsible for what... and I got to tell you, that is what makes me think there are two in this mess, not one.

If I was holding a face to face conversation with them in my office, the first thing I would be achieving is an agreement that they are each responsible for their own behaviors. No more cross blaming and then trumping that with the sactimonious "victim" card. "I did this because you did" that is out. Once we established responsibility like that, then maybe who isn't talking and who isn't trusting can be addressed appropriately. If someone can't take responsibility for what they do, then all bets are off about any relationship, period.

Many good people here have said it on many many threads - relationships take talking of a type of quality that builds trust. And if they don't know how to do that, then there will eventually be more than nude pics showing up in emails going wrong, if it hasn't already.

[Myth]

I think she said that she was going to confront him about it tonight. I'll make sure and ask her tomorrow what has happened and keep you all posted... She really needs to air the dirty laundry so to speak. I just hope that it all has a happy ending one way or another

[Chery]

Hi Myth.

I agree with Wildcat... when married, there should be no 'secrets' unless it's a surprise birthday party, or that special gift. And, of course the woman's purse and the man's wallet. Those are in my opinion, the little things that should still be 'private' and 'sacred'.

The internet, on the other hand, should not be secret - that's in a way, a fantasy world, but you should share all of your fantasies with your spouse.

I also agree that there might be more than just this issue of possibly cheating - he might like the mystery.. but it's still not right. Besides, no woman has a right to send pictures of her genitalia to a married man.

If your friend does not want to 'confess' that she's been through his mail, then she is not being totally honest either, but on the other hand, she's probably so 'bummed out' right now that he should have noticed something was amiss and asked her if she had something on her mind.

The 'receptiveness' on both parts is lacking and it would perhaps help her if she just had a fit and suggest counseling of some kind. That's only if this is really what she wants. It takes two to forget to communicate, no matter what reason.

No matter what you pass on to her, please make sure that you are not a focal point of their 'spat' because you don't need the stress in your condition.

Take care dear, and get back with us.

Usually, if you look for trouble, you'll find it.

[Quincy]

I also don't constitute this cheating. However this is on the borderline of almost cheating don't you think? I've had this same situation happen to me quite some time ago with a boyfriend who at first denied that he was chatting online. The bottom line is that he was talking to another female and exchanging phone numbers and information- which already crosses the line. If he was really interested in her he wouldn't pursue anything and would be honest about this girl. The fact that he isn't honest about this means that he is hiding this- and possibly more. Like I said an ex of mine did the same. He eventually went on and cheated on me- simply because I dismissed the emails and pictures in his email. The fact that your friend has gone out of her way to look into his email suggests that she does not trust him. Without the trust of both partners there is only a failed relationship.

[Myth]

Update:
She wrote him a letter telling him everything she did and that she would be leaving asap and he cried. I guess he knew he had made a mistake and from what I gathered they are working things out. He will not be talking to this woman again and even told his wife that when/if she calls that she could answer the call and talk to the other woman... Knowing her that might be dangerous for the other woman but it did give her piece of mind... She believes that this is a one time occurrence and that they can work through it. I agree with her since I know both of them. They seem to have a renewed love of life and each other since this happened... I hope it continues to be that way. I think he realised what he almost lost and how much she loves him to stay. She also went through the cell phone calls and he haddn't had any out of state numbers on the long distance, she thinks that this woman took it upon herself to act out and attempt to get her hubby. She forgave him but won't forget and is wondering if he'll ever be able to forgive himself. I guess anytime he looks at her he seems on the verge of tears. He told her it was because he almost lost the best thing that ever happened to him. The thing he had prayed the most for and now he had a second chance to make it right and he is grateful... I think they will work things out... What's life without a couple of speed bumps to slow you down and make you think..

[Chery]

So glad that this worked out.

Since I don't know them, my main concern was for you and I hope this did not stress you out.

It did sound as if the other woman sent the picture for your friend to find, creating an issue between them. So.. I hope your friend gives her heck if she dares to call him at home.

Yep, those speedbumps are what keeps us awake..

[Myth]

It didn't stress me too much. Just knew how I would feel if it was me. I know she will if she actually calls. I know I would and we are very much alike. Thank you all for your advice and I'll let you know if anything happens in the future.