[achampio21]

Hello! I live in Indiana and my biological mother has court ordered visitation rights with my 7 year old daughter. She has had these rights for about a year. My question is if I get adopted by another person, not related to me, and all of my mother's parental rights are terminated, which in turn terminates the grandparent relationship with my daughter legally, will the courts remove the court ordered visitation on the grounds that she is no longer my daughter's grandparent? :confused:

[ScottGem]

You have a 7 yr old daughter and someone wants to adopt YOU?? Even assuming your had your daughter when you were 12, you would still be over 18 and not eligible for adoption.

If you want to terminate grandma's visitation you will need to figure out something else. How about explaining the FULL story here so we can really help.

[achampio21]

Okay, I am 27 years old and live in Indiana. According to state laws I can be adopted by another Indiana resident even if I am over 18 years of age. I have been fighting this grandparents visitation for over 3 years at $175 an hour. And I have come to the conclusion that in Indiana grandparents just about have more rights than parents do. My mother is a self gratifying control freak, insatiable and extremely needy. She wants everything in life handed to her on a silver platter and doesn't think she should have to work for anything and is trying to force those ideas on my daughter. My daughter is already telling me she doesn't have to follow ANY rules and can do whatever she wants because her grandma said so. She is emotionally abusing my daughter but is so good at it that I can't pin anything on her. I have tried and tried to get her rights revoked and to no avail. But I came upon this tidbit of getting myself adopted to basically terminate all of her rights to me which would in turn terminate her rights to my daughter. Was wanting to know if she is no longer my legal mother and no longer my daughter's legal grandmother can the she still retain grandparent visitation rights? Is that better? Lol

[GV70]

Adoption of an adult. Approximately 26 States and the District of Columbia allow the adoption of any person, regardless of age. Colorado, Rhode Island, American Samoa, and the Northern Mariana Islands allow parties to petition the court for the adoption of persons over age 18 but under age 21.4 Nevada specifies that the adult to be adopted must be younger than the adoptive parent, and West Virginia's statutes state that the adopting parent must be a resident of that State to adopt an adult.

Alabama restricts adoption of adults to persons who are permanently and totally disabled or mentally retarded. Ohio allows adoption of an adult only when the person is permanently disabled, mentally retarded, or a stepchild or foster child with whom the relationship was established while the child was a minor.

Idaho, Illinois, and South Dakota require that the adopting parent be in a sustained parental relationship for a specified period, ranging from 6 months to 2 years, with the adult to be adopted. Virginia allows the adoption of an adult stepchild, niece, or nephew, as long as the adopted person resided in the home for at least 3 months prior to reaching adulthood and is at least 15 years younger than the adopting parent.

The word approximately is used to stress the fact that the statutes are constantly being revised and updated. This information is current as of February 2006. In North Carolina, Pennsylvania, and Texas, any adult may adopt. In Alabama, Hawaii, Kansas, Maine, Massachusetts, Michigan, Missouri, Nebraska, and West Virginia, a single adult and married couples jointly may adopt. In Vermont, any adult and a parent's partner may adopt. Back
3 Arizona, Delaware, Georgia, Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Kentucky, Minnesota, Mississippi, New Mexico, Oregon, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia, Wisconsin, and Wyoming.



States allow adult adoption:
Alaska, Arkansas, Florida, Georgia, Hawaii, Indiana, Kansas, Maine, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, Montana, Nebraska, New Hampshire, New York, North Carolina, North Dakota, Oklahoma, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Tennessee, Utah, Vermont, Washington, and Wyoming.

[GV70]

Was wanting to know if she is no longer my legal mother and no longer my daughter's legal grandmother can the she still retain grandparent visitation rights? Is that better?? lol

Of course she will not have visitation rights.

[JudyKayTee]

Of course she will not have visitation rights.

Don't you think the Court - which apparently has been involved in this fight for some time - will see this adoption of the mother for exactly what it is: a ploy to get around a Court Order?

Don't know, just a thought.

[Gernald]

Okay so I found this website that explains the law in depth (actually it's the state's website, but whatever).

HSLDA | http://www.in.gov/legislative/bills/2005/IN/IN1116.1.html

One thing it said was the requirements for the grandparent to be granted visitation, if you are married to the paternal father then this law is void, however I'm going to assume for all intents and purposes that your not. Yes getting yourself adopted might help, but I'd try to get a good lawyer and take your case to the supreme court. On another website I saw that a similar law was declared unconstitutional... this may be the better way to go if you can manage it. I think you getting adopted would cause more problems than a solution, and then there's still no guaranty that the geneticly related maternal grandmother won't still have visitation.
Talk to a different lawyer than the one you have now (kind of like a second opinion), or if you don't have a lawyer get one (it sounds like you need one).

Hope all ends well.

[GV70]

What are some of the reasons for an adult adoption?

A former foster child who after growing close to the foster family and not being legally available for adoption as a child, may be adopted as an adult if he/she so wishes.
A step-child who has grown fond of his/her step-parent may be adopted as an adult by the step-parent.
An adult adoptee after finding his/her birth family may choose to be adopted by his/her family of origin.
A way to create legal inheritance rights within a relationship.

Reasons that an adult adoption may not be allowed:

Prohibited by some states, unless the adoptee meets guidelines which may include a top age of 21.
If the adoptive parent and the adopted adult "child" are involved in a sexual relationship, the state's incest laws will apply.
If the adoptive parent and adopted adult "child" are involved in a same-sex sexual relationship, sodomy laws will apply.
If the particular state requires a specific age difference between the adoptive parent and adopted child.
Some states, like New York, have determined that adoption law may not be used to legalize an adult relationship between same-sex partners. However, Delaware stated that it was okay to use adoption between adults to create inheritance rights, if that was the primary purpose of the adoption.


You must file these documents with the Court:

Petition
Adoption Agreement
Order


Petition
The name, age, date and place of birth of the Petitioners
How long the Petitioners have known each other
Why the Petitioners want the adoption to take place
If either Petitioner is married, the name of the spouse (if any), the date of their marriage, and the names and ages of their children. If spouses have signed consents to the adoption, list their names and dates they signed the consents. Attach the consents to the Petition.
The date your adoption agreement was signed. (Attach a copy of the adoption agreement.)
Whether the adoption is in the public interest
Adoption Agreement

This is the agreement between the person to be adopted and the adoptive parent. Both must sign and date the Agreement. The Agreement must say you both agree to assume the legal relationship of parent and child and all the duties and responsibilities of that relationship.

[excon]

wanting to know if she is no longer my legal mother and no longer my daughter's legal grandmother can the she still retain grandparent visitation rights?

Hello champ:

You are making the assumption that if she's no longer your legal mother, that would no longer make her your daughter's legal grandmother.

I wouldn't make that assumption.

excon

[achampio21]

I am not married and was never married to my 7 yr old daughter's father. Her bio father has seen her 6 times in 7 years and doesn't wish to have or create a relationship with her. He pays support though and we have no problems. I did appeal to supreme court and lost. I have been through 3 different lawyers in regards to this case and have spoke to (actual number) 54 other lawyers in hopes to gain additional information. After all the research and all the lawyers and all the advice I was told by just about all of them that I cannot get her rights revoked unless she severely harms my daughter physically or sells her for pornographic reasons. And even if she does either or both of those things I was told I have to have cncrete proof that she was directly involved. Because just saying she did it is not enough. I can't move away because she will still have visitation rights. I can't even give daughter up for adoption because she will still retain visitation rights! (wasnt an option just told to give me a good idea of grandparent rights and their power) So I was told by 12 of the 54 lawyers that my only options are: move and not tell courts where I went which in turn puts a warrant out for my arrest (NOT an option), have her(my mother) parental rights revoked which means she is no longer my daughter's grandmother or spend the next 11 years dealing with the situation which in my mind is also NOT an option. By the way I have 2 more children with my current fiancé that are boys and she has never seen them and knows NOTHING about them. I have a restraining order against my mother which she violated 4 times and we have black and white proof and the courts did nothing and she also "stole" my identity and ruined my credit and cashed out life insurance policies by signing my name to the cash surrender paperwork and still no one will do ANYTHING to her.! Thank you to anyone who responds good advice or bad advice! I am desperate for a solution. This "problem" is draining us finacially and emotionally. Please ANY help will help!

[talaniman]

You may be better served teaching your child what you will not tolerate, as far as behavior, when she is with you. If 54 lawyers can't help you, and she is as bad as you say. Seems the courts can do something, if you have evidence.

[JudyKayTee]

I am not married and was never married to my 7 yr old daughter's father. Her bio father has seen her 6 times in 7 years and doesn't wish to have or create a relationship with her. He pays support though and we have no problems. I did appeal to supreme court and lost. I have been through 3 different lawyers in regards to this case and have spoke to (actual number) 54 other lawyers in hopes to gain additional information. After all the research and all the lawyers and all the advice I was told by just about all of them that I cannot get her rights revoked unless she severely harms my daughter physically or sells her for pornographic reasons. And even if she does either or both of those things I was told I have to have cncrete proof that she was directly involved. Because just saying she did it is not enough. I can't move away because she will still have visitation rights. I can't even give daughter up for adoption because she will still retain visitation rights! (wasnt an option just told to give me a good idea of grandparent rights and their power) So I was told by 12 of the 54 lawyers that my only options are: move and not tell courts where I went which in turn puts a warrant out for my arrest (NOT an option), have her(my mother) parental rights revoked which means she is no longer my daughter's grandmother or spend the next 11 years dealing with the situation which in my mind is also NOT an option. By the way I have 2 more children with my current fiance that are boys and she has never seen them and knows NOTHING about them. I have a restraining order against my mother which she violated 4 times and we have black and white proof and the courts did nothing and she also "stole" my identity and ruined my credit and cashed out life insurance policies by signing my name to the cash surrender paperwork and still no one will do ANYTHING to her.!!! Thank you to anyone who responds good advice or bad advice!! I am desperate for a solution. This "problem" is draining us finacially and emotionally. Please ANY help will help!!

First - PLEASE stop opening new threads. Go to one of your old threads with the same problem and add to the end of that. I keep thinking this is a new problem and then realize I've read and perhaps answered before.

If 3 retained lawyers and 54 "talked to" lawyers say there is nothing you can do I would tend to believe them. Perhaps this is one of those problems with no solution.

And the Attorneys are right - unless you prove your child is in physical danger there is nothing you can do. And I wouldn't assume, because she has visitation with your daughter, that she knows "nothing" about your other children.

Obviously you and your mother have problems and they have carried over to the relationship between you, her and your daughter. I'm surprised that she forged your name and you could prove it and there were no charges filed. Perhaps the Court is beginning to look at this like one long, eye rolling family melodrama.

I also would not let my life be run by a 7 year old. Kids know there are different rules in Dad's house and Mom's house and I would think you could let her know that her Grandmother's rules are different from yours and that's just how it is. "Not in my house" comes to mind.

You asked for good advice or bad advice so he comes some unwelcome advice - I get calls fairly frequently because of custody/visitation problems, often involving grandparents, current partner of ex-spouse, whatever. Lots of accusations and people being unjustifiably wronged. The more the person who wants the work done goes on and on about everything awful and terrible the other side has done, the more they go on about how "nobody does anything," the less inclined I am to do the work. No matter what I find, learn, report... they are NOT going to be happy and then I am going to join the list of bad guys.

Sometimes everyone enjoys the melodrama.

Sorry - but you did ask.

[Gernald]

Ask your daughter to testify.
She's old enough to make a decision on if she wants to see grandma or not. That website I looked at said that the grandparents rights can be revoked in the case that the child wishes to no longer see them... or something like that.

Did you try this already?

You could always wait for the hag to kick the bucket, it may be sooner than 11 years if your daughter pretends to be a brat or something around her. :-)

[cdad]

There may be a possible solution to your problem. It comes in the form of a visitation modification. If you are experiencing things the way you are document what's going on at all times. DO NOT embellish on anything. Seek in court a modification for supervised custody and at that time ask the courts for court ordered parental evaluation to be done. They are much more detailed then 15 minutes in a courtroom and they will talk and listen to the child as well. They also will do testing etc on all parties involved inc yourself your daughter and your mom. Any accusations you have can be addressed etc between yourself and the evaluator. Its not cheap and its not quick because it can take several weeks to 3 months in most cases but it can be through. At that time the evaluator can make recommendations on the custody order and if it should be supervised etc or if any parental alienation is going on by any of the parties. Good luck.

[ScottGem]

Sorry, but something doesn't track here. She forged your name and stole the cash value of your insurance policies and nothing was done? That is a criminal act. Did you have proof of it? Did you report it to the police? I really find it hard to believe that such a criminal action would not be prosecuted.

I also find it hard to believe that she can violate a restraining order without answering for it.

Something else is going on here that we are not hearing.

Have you had your daughter evaluated by a psychologist? A good one can tell if grandma is a negative influeance on your daughter.

[achampio21]

Okay, After I got the restraining order on my mother and it had been verified that she had received it she sent a letter to me in the mail which I had a police officer open and document. Then we put a trace on our phone and got proof from the phone company that she was calling our house and had a police officer document it. Then she had my brother call my cell phone and I called the police and while I was sitting in the officers police car she called my phone again and I answered it with the officer sitting right there and listening on speaker phone. He documented it. The detective from the police department called her in for questioning and filed a case against her which was sent to the county prosecutor. Who in turn said " there isn't enough evidence to prosecute." Then a year later I found out that she cashed out my life insurance policies and I spent 3 months gathering ALL of the evidence copies of the forms with my forged signature, copies of the checks mailed to HER address, and I pressed charges on her for forgery and fraud both felonies. The same prosecutor said " we don't have enough evidence to prosecute and we don't have enough money to hire a handwriting specialist to evaluate the signatures." I even had another detective willing to testify that she had admitted to him that she signed the checks!! I do not have life insurance or medical insurance now and I can't afford to take my daughter or even myself to get psych help. And the courts won't help me. EVERYONE is looking at this like I am being a spiteful daughter just trying to hurt my mother. But the TRUTH is I just want her to LEAVE ME ALONE!

[achampio21]

Sorry also to address having my daughter testify... she is too young in this state to be put on the stand. Not to mention since the visitation has begun my daughter's behavior has gotten a thousand times worse and she has even told me to my face that "she is bad because she hopes that I won't want her anymore and she can go live with meme where there aren't any rules". Now you tell me that woman is a good influence. PS take a look at the name my mother gave herself for the kids to call her.

[excon]

The same prosecutor said " we don't have enough evidence to prosecute and we don't have enough money to hire a handwriting specialist to evaluate the signatures."

Hello again, champ:

More evidence of doughnut eating - do nothing cops. Don't surprise me none.

What happened to all that Homeland Security money that the feds were passing out to local police departments?? I'll bet your department got a shiny new tank, and lots of SWAT gear that the cops can use to bust marijuana smokers...

But, do they have enough money or the integrity to help somebody really in trouble?? Nahhhh.

excon

[achampio21]

Yeah I agree excon, not to mention this woman doesn't work a real job lives on social security and gets paid to sit at home and screw with me and my life. She is healthy enough to work out in her yard and go to red hats meetings and you better believe she NEVER misses a court date. But she is WAAAAYYY too sick to have a sit on your butt and stare at a computer office job! But that brings me to my other point. I have three kids and a fiancé. We both work and take care of our kids. I have to miss work to take my daughter to visistation because I work nights and the time I have to drop her is (non negotionable) and it is pointless to go after the drop off. My husband pays all of the bills for a family of five and my job pays the lawyer. We never see each other because we have to work separate shifts due to the unbelievable expense of daycare and that witch gets to sleep in everyday and have all day to do whatever she wants. Nothing to do but bother me. It's becoming obvious to me that THIS is what is called legalized harassment.

[talaniman]

Maybe you can't get the locals aroused, but check with the Indiana State Attorney. He may not be as biased, with the evidence you have. Your daughters behavior though, is entirely your realm of responsibility. Get her the counseling she needs, and then you have leverage of undo, or negative influence.