[paraclete]

Hey Tal I wasn't meaning your argy bargy, but Trump's, we are just talking, and sometimes I voice my frustration. You see I have always tolerated fools poorly, and with Trump on the throne it is an affront to common sense, but everything that is done is not his doing. We have fools here to, but our system tends to deal with them a little quicker, they are unable to hide in a big White House

[talaniman]

The Dufus may THINK he can hide in the big white house, but he will soon learn it is a fishbowl and everyone can watch him. Yeah we move very slowly most times, even though Republicans have moved very fast with this tax cut thing, but they will get what they deserve, of that you can be assured.

[smoothy]

I suppose all the whinny liberals are going to donate their tax return to the treasury this year to help pay down Obamas record deficits rather than have it returned to them and at least the next three since they don't want to keep any more of their money. And the Canadians, You don't pay taxes here so what business is it of yours how much or little we pay. Most of you have never even filed US income taxes so what do you know about our process.

[talaniman]

Though provocative, your post is factually incorrect. Nonetheless, I wish you and yours a great holiday my friend

[smoothy]

Likewise have a happy holiday as well.

https://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/.../gift/gift.htm


For those who feel they don't pay enough taxes now... link shows how you can give it to the Treasury to pay down O'bummers record deficits.

[talaniman]

I actually liked the way Reagan managed his tax cuts with help from the dems. He lowered them when he could, but when it was necessary, he raised them to cover those events that needed to be paid for without raising the deficit significantly. Lets face it, no middle class citizen will get rich from these tax cuts, and rich guys will make out like bandits, but if they don't trickle down enough crumbs for main street then you can bet they will have a problem on their hands.

Easy to pop your fingers, and shake your butt when things are going good, but you still have to pay those bills, and be ready for when stuff happens beyond your control. Personally I didn't elect my reps in the congress to give themselves and their donors a raise, nor would I donate part of my money toward them, which seems to be YOUR perception of the dem position. It's not, and you are in error, I believe, because fact is nobody manages their budgets that way, and the basic flaw of the tax cuts is they passed that before they even have a budget which is patently irresponsible in my view. You don't get to give away the loot through deficit spending, then holler there is no more money for the bills to be paid, so until we see the results of the repub actions play out, then you guys own the results whatever happens. You took the risk so you get the credit, or the consequences of that risk.

Go ahead get a motor cycle, or golf clubs before you pay the rent, or your credit cards, and let me know what the names your wife called you were.

[tomder55]

not going to read all the replies . Since the Kennedy 1960s ;supply side tax cuts have been the best way to stimulate growth. We wasted almost a decade trying Obama's Keynesian ideas and all we got was a version of stagnation. I feel very bad for the 30 somethings who entered into the work force ;or could not find jobs .Those who were fortunate to work ,even in higher skilled positions saw flat wage growth for the decade .

To those who mock "trickle down " please note that immediately after the tax bill was signed ,those 'greedy corporate bass turds began giving bonuses and pay increases to their work force .

Expect a stampede of companies handing out bonuses, raising pay, spending on capital projects and giving to charities, with the windfall from the massive corporate tax cuts

. Expect utility rates to start dropping too.

As for entitlement reform ....well as I enter the age when I start becoming eligible for government programs I've paid for since 1972 ; I still say entitlement reform is long over due , As long as the government continues to plunder payroll taxes that are specific to entitlements ,and spends it as general revenue ;then the programs will continue to be unsustainable . Again ;these 30 somethings who cannot purchase homes and were being forced to pay for health insurance they couldn't afford and did not want (thanks to Congress for eliminating the unconstitutional Obamacare mandate ) ; they must look at the SS and Medicare withdrawals from their paycheck with disgust ......They know damn well that money will not be there when their time comes because it will be being paid out to the generation who plundered funds . Don't be surprise that if there isn't major reform NOW ;that when they get their turn at the seat of power ;that they wack the geezers hard .

Government handouts and Welfare reform ? The one thing Bubba got right was reforming welfare . It was he that came up with the workfare programs that the emperor eliminated .

The one thing that disturbs me is that pretty much every lawmaker except Rand Paul has abandoned any thoughts of reducing spending . Herr Donald is a central government master planner and he is dragging the Repubics along with him . Shame of the conservatives in government for abandoning this central premise of their platform.

[talaniman]

It's the Dufus Show and the repubs are his willing sycophants, because without him they can't get any of their agenda done. That's the price you pay for wanting his signature.

[paraclete]

I really don't know what all the who-ha is about, I don't pay any income tax, and I recommend it

[tomder55]

clete redistribution is a fancy way of saying taking from someone and giving it to someone else . That is what most of the taxes are . This plan is supposed to be "simplified " and yet the loopholes are a thousand pages long . But the plan for all it's flaws is still supply side in concept ;and since the Kennedy tax plan of 1963 (passed in 1964 after his death ) ;supply side economics has been the right prescription for this country .

[paraclete]

There are many failed economic ideas Tom, and this tax plan has been modified, and once again you have a camel, a horse designed by a committee. What it does is change the emphasis on corporate taxation, a failed concept, it hasn't done much for individuals, but you might get some profits repatriated

[talaniman]

A better economic plan for growth would be creating demand by NOT penalizing working people with low wages they cannot possibly live on, while subsidizing rich multinationals paying those low wages with taxpayer money through tax breaks, tax cuts, loopholes, and cheap labor. If yo want facts the economic policies and the results can be found here.

https://www.thebalance.com/president...licies-3305560

[paraclete]

A better economic plan for growth would be creating demand by NOT penalizing working people with low wages they cannot possibly live on, while subsidizing rich multinationals paying those low wages with taxpayer money through tax breaks, tax cuts, loopholes, and cheap labor. If yo want facts the economic policies and the results can be found here.

https://www.thebalance.com/president...licies-3305560

Tal, you will get no argument from me about a minimum living wage, we should have gotten to the point by now that either people are entitled to a fair living, or they are not entitled to be here. There are just not enough jobs for the unskilled, the lowly skilled, and maybe even the skilled

[tomder55]

What it does is change the emphasis on corporate taxation, a failed concept,

exactly ! Corporations should not be taxed .They don't absorb the cost .They pass it on to their customers.

[talaniman]

Corporations should be taxed FAIRLY to support this country's general welfare, security, and infrastructures, like any other citizen is obligated to. SCOTUS decided that when they agreed that corporations are people too.

They should not be allowed ANY benefit unless they accept that responsibility as citizens.

[tomder55]

btw ;after voting against the Bill ,Bolshevik Bernie is now saying the "middle class" tax cuts should be permanent . As you know ;they couldn't be made permanent because there was no Democrat support for them so they did not make the 60 vote threshold necessary to avoid reconciliation.

YOUR Senator Cruz has reached out to Bernie to co sponsor legislation to make the tax cuts permanent . Will Bernie go along with it or let petty politics stand in the way ? Will you support YOUR Senator's efforts to make the tax cuts permanent ?

[talaniman]

I don't believe in permanent tax cuts for anybody especially if they are deficit sponsored. Makes no sense, and destroys the flexibility to raise and lower taxes, by need and target them narrowly. Learned that from Reagan who raised and lowered taxes to meet budgetary, and deficit challenges that are known to pop up like a war, that Bush paid for on the credit card, or natural disasters that have already reared their head in the Dufus Dynasty. It just ain't smart, and lets blame repubs for this reconciliation deal to purposely cut out the dems, and use their non participation against them.

They could have written a bill that would pass with 60 votes if the wanted to, but this last minute giveaway without closing loopholes was the intention all along. They got what they wanted and will the middle class take their hush money and reward repubs for the way they have been governing?

We'll see soon enough because repubs own the consequences of whatever outcome happens now as a result of their actions.

[tomder55]

my prediction is a growth rate of 5 % will be the result of this tax law. and as Jack Kemp taught us ;a rising tide lifts all boats .

[talaniman]

If business does it's part and raises wages and stimulates demand, it's very possible. Higher even but should we bet that that's going to happen, or that it will even be sustained for any long term frame? Or will they trickle enough crumbs to get their sycophants re elected? They make money even if they don't, so I am cautious and not very optimistic that they will do as intended. Especially in states that didn't mandate a higher wage.

History says that business will take the money and RUN, and repubs will have to explain that. What happens when other countries reduced their taxes even lower? That is almost guaranteed to happen.

[tomder55]

low taxes are good for all. I intend now to join the fight to get my state to lower it's taxes .NY and other blue states need to get on board .They have been ripping off their people for years knowing that the Federal tax system would partially subsidize it .