[smoothy]

Yes more whooming over the head needed as opposed to pulling a gun and using it. It brings us back to attitude and what attitude can you have when you can't see a future? No amount of whooming over the head changes the facts. These people behave the way they do because they have no future and so street life, small time dealing, etc, becomes attractive. A neighbourhood riot might be the most excitement these people have had and certainly an opportunity to make a point and as soon as they see a cop...

Its not about not seeing a future... they listen to and idolize this Rap crap... look up to the criminal element and act like that to get "street cred" with their homies... many of whom choose a life of crime. So the key word here is peer pressure and personal accountability... the former it the only influence they care about and the latter is something that is devoid in most of the younger generations...And some of the nicest black people I know and respect (who are older generations)....are the first to say that very same thing.....So its not the right wing Whites that say it....a lot of the older black folks (meaning early 60'S and older mostly) who were raised to show respect to others and their property...and do whats right have been saying it far longer.

[Wondergirl]

Its not about not seeing a future... they listen to and idolize this Rap crap... look up to the criminal element and act like that to get "street cred" with their homies... many of whom choose a life of crime. So the key word here is peer pressure and personal accountability... the former it the only influence they care about and the latter is something that is devoid in most of the younger generations...

You sound a bit like my grandfather. Unfortunately, it's not a passing teenage phase anymore.

[smoothy]

You sound a bit like my grandfather. Unfortunately, it's not a passing teenage phase anymore.

Yet it doesn't change who is responsible... that remains themselves. Not everyone else. Nor does it mean the rest of us have to accept it.


Actually last month a Handyman who was doing work at a neighbors....and is in his late 60's....and is black. Told me this very thing I just said, you should have heard his opinions about what the blacks were doing in Ferguson...he made ME sound liberal in my disdain. He's a nice guy...old school, older generation, we get along great..I've known him for about 2 years now...I wish he lived on my street instead of 20 miles away.

[paraclete]

Well smoothy it is a pity the experiment of Liberia failed, otherwise you could have shipped them all back. Thing is respect is something learned with age. I suggest you have no choice but bulldoze these troublesome neighbourhoods. It is a solution we have used in some areas of public housing, you could call it the move on solution, but then I expect we are too radical for you, even our left wing is far to the right of the way you do things. We even do things like have welfare payments carried out in a manner where it cannot be spent on booze, gambling, etc and kids don't go to school, no welfare. I don't know if it works but the older people are in favour of it.

It appears to be a scientific fact that it takes twenty-five years to get a brain, until then we should find a way to keep them locked up, military service seems a solution

[smoothy]

Well smoothy it is a pity the experiment of Liberia failed, otherwise you could have shipped them all back. Thing is respect is something learned with age. I suggest you have no choice but bulldoze these troublesome neighbourhoods. It is a solution we have used in some areas of public housing, you could call it the move on solution, but then I expect we are too radical for you, even our left wing is far to the right of the way you do things. We even do things like have welfare payments carried out in a manner where it cannot be spent on booze, gambling, etc and kids don't go to school, no welfare. I don't know if it works but the older people are in favour of it.

It appears to be a scientific fact that it takes twenty-five years to get a brain, until then we should find a way to keep them locked up, military service seems a solution

I agree... mandatory military service would do them good. Make them learn respect... make them learn the planet doesn't revolve around their wants and needs. Make them think of others and the greater good... or their fellow troops will beat it into them. Since they clearly aren't being taught this at home.

Would even give them a long term employment opportunity if they aren't total screwups.

[talaniman]

How about rebuilding a strong vibrant middle class with some decent paying jobs so the youths can actually aspire to something and thrive instead of just surviving with the crumbs of what's left over. Then you wouldn't have to keep blaming them for being rebellious and refusing to cooperate in something that clearly doesn't work for them.

You can talk all you want about what they are doing in Ferguson (Or anywhere in the country), but it's crap until you listen to what's been done to them also. There are enough facts that cannot be ignored and it's obvious with all due respect to the older black guy, today's youth ain't going for it any more. Nor should they. You do well to listen, while you are hollering about someone else's flaws and what they should do about it.

Glad you liked the old black guy, Smoothy, who was likely stroking your ego to keep his cash flow going because he knew only agreeing with your crap was the ONLY way to get along with you. He has probably dealt with many closed minded narrow thinkers in his time, and knew you would never listen to anything he had to REALLY say anyway.

You may as well listen though because the demographics of power are changing and soon, very soon, you won't be able to abort, deport, shoot, incarcerate, or isolate, and subjugate your problems away, so quit hollering about yourself and what YOU want because other want things to. They intend on getting it and have been struggling for it a long time.

When you listen you will learn that black lives do matter, and you will understand why they riot for it. Try this on for size, maybe you're screaming, and hollering, and name calling, and blaming, and using, and abusing your fellow man, has pissed him off.

[paraclete]

Cut it out Tal, the only thing that matters over there is money, without it you are screwed

[tomder55]

oh the irony. It is the progressive policies that stunt the growth of a vibrant 'middle class' .

the 1980s, with a conservative, free-market Republican in the White House, were a boom time for black America.
Indeed, Andrew Brimmer, the Harvard-trained black economist, the former Federal Reserve Board member, estimated that total black business receipts increased from $12.4 billion in 1982 to $18.1 billion in 1987, translating into an annual average growth rate of 7.9 percent (compared to 5 percent for all U.S. businesses.
The success of the black entrepreneurial class during the Reagan era was rivaled only by the gains of the black middle class.
In fact, black social scientist Bart Landry estimated that that upwardly mobile cohort grew by a third under Reagan's watch, from 3.6 million in 1980 to 4.8 million in 1988. His definition was based on employment in white-collar jobs as well as on income levels.
All told, the middle class constituted more than 40 percent of black households by the end of Reagan's presidency, which was larger than the size of black working class, or the black poor.
The impressive growth of the black middle class during the 1980s was attributable in no small part to the explosive growth of jobs under Reagan, which benefited blacks disproportionately.
Indeed, between 1982 and 1988, total black employment increased by 2 million, a staggering sum. That meant that blacks gained 15 percent of the new jobs created during that span, while accounting for only 11 percent of the working-age population.
Meanwhile, the black jobless rate was cut by almost half between 1982 and 1988. Over the same span, the black employment rate – the percentage of working-age persons holding jobs – increased to record levels, from 49 percent to 56 percent.
The black executive ranks especially prospered under Reagan. The Equal Employment Opportunity Commission reported that the number of black managers and officers in corporations with 100 or more employees increased by 30 percent between 1980 and 1985.
During the same period, the number of black professionals increased by an astounding 63 percent.
The burgeoning of the black professional, managerial and executive ranks during the 1980s coincided with a steady growth of the black student population at the nation's colleges and universities in the 1980s.
Even though the number of college-aged blacks decreased during much of the decade, black college enrollment increased by 100,000 between 1980 and 1987, according to the Census Bureau.
Meanwhile, the 1980s saw an improvement in the black high school graduation rate, as the proportion of blacks 18 to 24 years old earning high school diplomas increased from 69.7 percent in 1980 to 76 percent by 1987.
On balance, then, the majority of black Americans made considerable progress in the 1980s.
More of us stayed in high school, graduated and went on to college. More of us were working than ever before, in better jobs and for higher wages. The black middle class burgeoned to unprecedented size, emerging as the dominant income group in black America. And black business flourished, creating wealth in the black community.

The good that Reagan did for black America | The San Diego Union-Tribune

[excon]

mandatory military service would do them good. Make them learn respect... make them learn the planet doesn't revolve around their wants and needs. Make them think of others and the greater good... or their fellow troops will beat it into them. Since they clearly aren't being taught this at home.

Hello smoothy:

I'm sitting here thinking of the worst kind of things to say to you, but everything I think of ISN'T bad enough.. You are a despicable human being. You are EVERYTHING that's wrong with our society today.

excon

[talaniman]

Morning Tom, I was there in the 80's, and King Reagan grew the middle class with FLEXIBLE monetary policy through raising and lowering TAXES as needed, and some pretty liberal deficit spending AND NO WARS (Even in the ME, after Lebanon remember, and the Iran/Iraq conflicts). It was also the start of businesses selling off to foreign labor and closing older factories for the big move south, AND brought cheap labor into the service markets with AMNESTY for many Mexican immigrants.

That was when bi partisan policy making was at it's best, before pappy George screwed up by making promises that deviated from what Reagan had established (Fiscal flexibility) and Pierrot spilled the beans about the big money extraction that was coming that stopped people from getting their foot in the door (opportunities). In a nutshell, people had a few bucks to spend and us 70's boomers could expand as part of a growing service economy (The Start of the New World Order). We have a thread about it in Current Events from back in the day.

So forget that revisionist propaganda, because there were many other factors going on that allowed King Reagan and the conservatives to look better than they were. At least Reagan ALLOWED enough trickle to keep the masses fairly docile, a concept modern repubs have forgotten about in their zeal for MO' MONEY, power, and influence.

So don't give me this how conservative help the Blacks the most when they were helping themselves FIRST.

[paraclete]

Well Tal how do you like your new world order now, up to your ears in debt, or perhaps I should ask Tom that question. Take a lesson from Greece boys both the right wing and the left wing lesson. You cannot ignore 50% of your population otherwise they will punish you at the polls and elect a radical who will be worse than your worst nightmare. It is no good saying the middle class prospers with lower taxes, you cannot prosper without income and those jobs you exported aren't coming back. You have lost the opportunity to pick a fight with Iran so you will have to wait for the next one

[talaniman]

The world revolves around a dollar, and we should emulate the Greeks? Surely you jest. Our debt is still easily manageable even if the right wing hollers otherwise. Save your fiscal advice for the clueless Chinese, and the CLUMSY Iranians.

Ignore Netty and his tough talk, because people with big sticks and KNOW HOW to use them don't have to holler. Doesn't IRAN know that nuking Israel is suicide? ure they do. Netty should be laughing at them and their provocative threats.

As for the NWO Clete, do the math, and plot the trend lines on a graph. Only then can you grasp what Tom and the wingers are REALLY hollering about. The fat cats will be put on a severe diet from all those years of gorging on American PIE.

[tomder55]

What tal doesn't mention is that the so called 'bi partisan policy' meant that needed cuts in the budget have not been made. Here's another dirty secret ; WE have been in a deficit spending budget since 1940 with only brief periods of surplus. The most notable time was when the Gingrich controlled Congress compelled Bubba to go along with their budget . But even those years were helped by unusual high tax receipts due to the dot com boom. There were also some surplus years while Harry Truman was b*tching about a 'do nothing ' Republican Congress ;and some surplus years at the end of Ike's Presidency .

Clete think about it . We claim there are no jobs for Blacks and other minorities and yet we allow a flood of illegals to cross our border every day . Don't you see the disconnect there ? Where are the jobs ? Either they are there and the illegals are taking them because Blacks don't want them OR the illegals are crossing the border to tap into our very generous social welfare system . Neither scenario is acceptable .

[talaniman]

Clinton closed a lot of military bases, after he raised taxes when he got elected AFTER Pappy (read my lips) Bush was throw out. Bubbles are now called revenue streams in case you forgot.

http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/A...0Military.html

(Yes Newt went along with it basically)

Two wars and a huge ten year tax cut is what the first APPOINTED president in history brought us, thanks to his brother cheating on the ballots. Blame that on the black people too! You wingers ALWAYS do!

[smoothy]

How about rebuilding a strong vibrant middle class with some decent paying jobs so the youths can actually aspire to something and thrive instead of just surviving with the crumbs of what's left over. Then you wouldn't have to keep blaming them for being rebellious and refusing to cooperate in something that clearly doesn't work for them.

You can talk all you want about what they are doing in Ferguson (Or anywhere in the country), but it's crap until you listen to what's been done to them also. There are enough facts that cannot be ignored and it's obvious with all due respect to the older black guy, today's youth ain't going for it any more. Nor should they. You do well to listen, while you are hollering about someone else's flaws and what they should do about it.

Glad you liked the old black guy, Smoothy, who was likely stroking your ego to keep his cash flow going because he knew only agreeing with your crap was the ONLY way to get along with you. He has probably dealt with many closed minded narrow thinkers in his time, and knew you would never listen to anything he had to REALLY say anyway.

You may as well listen though because the demographics of power are changing and soon, very soon, you won't be able to abort, deport, shoot, incarcerate, or isolate, and subjugate your problems away, so quit hollering about yourself and what YOU want because other want things to. They intend on getting it and have been struggling for it a long time.

When you listen you will learn that black lives do matter, and you will understand why they riot for it. Try this on for size, maybe you're screaming, and hollering, and name calling, and blaming, and using, and abusing your fellow man, has pissed him off.

Obama and the Democrat party for even longer has worked hard to destroy the Middle class... not build it up. They have done this by ever increasing taxes while exempting the lower class from paying anything and in fact handing them extra money back far in excess of what they initially might have paid.

Why work harder to get ahead when you bump into a higher tax bracket and end up with even less money than you were making before?

OH, and that old black guy.....Hasn't gotten a dime from me...and in fact has saved my neighbors a significant amount....talking them OUT of a lot of work, and could have charged a lot more for what he has done. Yeah there ARE a lot of people who talk the talk to get their hand in your wallet....I know them when I see them.....this guy is one of the rare honest people out there. I know a sales pitch when I hear it...and he has never pitched one my way.

Funny how Democrats can't seem to believe all blacks aren't Democrat....or think they are entitled to a free ride....or that some believe in personal accountability.

Plus he doesn't have to come knocking on my door when he is done for the day to talk instead of heading home to beat the traffic like most wold.....if as you suggest....his reasons are other than I said. He knows I do all my own work because I know how to do it....and don't hire people to do it. Unlike most of my other neighbors. And most of our conversations weren't political in nature....and his comments were volunteered. Not a follow-up response to other comments earlier.

[J_9]

Let's keep in mind here that 99% of the black population (at least the ones I know personally) are VERY hard workers and excel at whatever they do. We are talking a mere minority of the population who are wreaking the havoc and giving a bad name to the black population as a whole.

I know several who work 2 full time jobs, can run circles around their Caucasian counterparts and do an all around better job in the long run.

I have the utmost respect of my colleagues of color who have worked their way out of the system to become upstanding members of society. Most of these colleagues are disgusted with the stigma that is being attached to the black population due to the actions of the minority of their culture. They are frustrated with the sense of entitlement some people express. This includes black and white alike.

Go ahead, twist my words, put words in my mouth. You would understand if you knew me personally.

1.
2.
3.
GO!

[excon]

Go ahead, twist my words, put words in my mouth. You would understand if you knew me personally.

1.
2.
3.
GO!

Hello again, J:

That didn't sound racist at all..

But, if there's any twisting of words going on here, it's YOU who's doing it.. If you think what you said above is the same thing you said the other day, you're DREAMING, girl..

excon

[J_9]

Hello again, J:

That didn't sound racist at all..

But, if there's any twisting of words going on here, it's YOU who's doing it.. If you think what you said above is the same thing you said the other day, you're DREAMING, girl..

excon

Apparently you don't know me as well as you think you do.

[talaniman]

@J

Go listen to the media, form your opinions. When you live it on a daily basis, come back and we'll discuss.

I tried but you only had eyes for Ex, he ain't cuter than me! I have lived it to on a daily basis. Racism is alive and well and black youth is demanding you listen. No they aren't the 1% you claim are the problem, they are the mass that lives it daily. Just like you. If you are frustrated then you should have empathy for their frustration too.

I'm sure the frustrated mother you quoted didn't want to be at the hospital at 2 in the morning either, and is it possible she had no one to watch the child at home?

No worries, I am well aware of your long hard hours on your feet, and take that as due consideration. You do sound better today.

[tomder55]

Clinton closed a lot of military bases, after he raised taxes when he got elected AFTER Pappy (read my lips) Bush was throw out. Bubbles are now called revenue streams in case you forgot.

http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/A...0Military.html

(Yes Newt went along with it basically)

Two wars and a huge ten year tax cut is what the first APPOINTED president in history brought us, thanks to his brother cheating on the ballots. Blame that on the black people too! You wingers ALWAYS do!

Geeze when are you going to give up that fiction ?


Don't worry though ;your hero the Goracle is thinking of throwing his hat in the ring. Bwaaaahaaaaaahaaaaahaaa !!! All we need now is for JFKerry to announce too !!!

Vote Analysis: Bush Wins, Again - ABC News

In fact, Bush's 537-vote margin of victory would have increased to 1,665 under the ballot-counting standards Gore's supporters had advocated, according to a review conducted by The Miami Herald, its parent company Knight Ridder, and USA Today.