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smearcase · Feb 9, 2013, 10:03 AM

"In our free report "3 Stocks That Will Help You Retire Rich," we name stocks that could help you build long-term wealth and retire well, along with some winning wealth-building strategies that every investor should be aware of. Click here now to keep reading. "

Is that why the word "Advertisement" appears at the top of the page in that LA Times article- perhaps?

tomder55 · Feb 9, 2013, 10:07 AM

Here is Dr Carson on a flat tax...

"What we need to do is come up with something simple. And when I pick up my Bible, you know what I see? I see the fairest individual in the universe, God, and he's given us a system. It's called a tithe."

"We don't necessarily have to do 10% but it's the principle. He didn't say if your crops fail, don't give me any tithe or if you have a bumper crop, give me triple tithe. So there must be something inherently fair about proportionality. You make $10 billion, you put in a billion. You make $10 you put in one. Of course you've got to get rid of the loopholes. Some people say, 'Well that's not fair because it doesn't hurt the guy who made $10 billion as much as the guy who made 10.' Where does it say you've got to hurt the guy? He just put a billion dollars in the pot. We don't need to hurt him. It's that kind of thinking that has resulted in 602 banks in the Cayman Islands. That money needs to be back here building our infrastructure and creating jobs."

talaniman · Feb 9, 2013, 10:20 AM

Originally Posted by smearcase

"In our free report "3 Stocks That Will Help You Retire Rich," we name stocks that could help you build long-term wealth and retire well, along with some winning wealth-building strategies that every investor should be aware of. Click here now to keep reading. "

Is that why the word "Advertisement" appears at the top of the page in that LA Times article- perhaps?

A well placed advertisement indeed. Ironic to me as I sipped my coffee.

Of course you've got to get rid of the loopholes

That's the whole problem with any system, Gods(?), or mans (or capitalists), loop holes.

tomder55 · Feb 9, 2013, 10:25 AM

There would be no loopholes in a flat tax. Loopholes are prevalent in a progressive system.

excon · Feb 9, 2013, 10:55 AM

Hello again, tom:

What you righty's don't get, or don't CARE to get, is that the single dollar that the guy who earns $10 has to pay, means a lot more to HIM than the billion the $10 billionaire has to give up..

It's not fair. It's not even close.

excon

talaniman · Feb 9, 2013, 10:56 AM

Loopholes are prevalent whenever a capitalists writes the rules for his greed... oooops... I mean right to make money by any mean necessary even cheat, steal or LIE.

Rich guys will always have a reason to have an exception to any rule. You want a flat tax? Okay are you guys willing to have ALL your money taxed the same way at the same rate? I don't think so. Then you wouldn't need an accountant to find ways to get around paying he whole flat tax you owe. Wonder who gives up all those tax shelters and charitable deductions?

We have been down this road of giving rich guys more loot. It has always resulted in less loot for the rest of the WORLD.

tomder55 · Feb 9, 2013, 12:04 PM

Originally Posted by excon

Hello again, tom:

What you righty's don't get, or don't CARE to get, is that the single dollar that the guy who earns $10 has to pay, means a lot more to HIM than the billion the $10 billionaire has to give up..

It's not fair. It's not even close.

excon

You are right... I'll never get that a progressive tax is a fair tax. The way I see it ;punishing success is unfair . It is also stupid because it encourages the loop holes to be created . I think income taxes are a bad idea anyway. But ,if you are going to have them ,then they should be the same as the consumption taxes .Same concept too. The rich spend more ;they pay more in taxes .

talaniman · Feb 9, 2013, 12:27 PM

Progressive,consumption,flat, doesn't matter because rich guys have power and influence to do as they please and screw the rest.

The more poor people pay, even a dollar, the more a capitalist takes. Its called the free market and its legal because they made it so. Its tyranny with a dollar sign. Slavery with a decimal point.

Free market my a$$, that's a marketing scheme like "job creators" to cover the true greedy nature of rich guys.

paraclete · Feb 9, 2013, 03:58 PM

Originally Posted by tomder55

here is Dr Carson on a flat tax ......

"What we need to do is come up with something simple. And when I pick up my Bible, you know what I see? I see the fairest individual in the universe, God, and he's given us a system. It's called a tithe."

Yes Tom it is a good system if you bring the whole tithe into the storehouse, but you know Tom the jews found ways not to pay the whiole tithe and look what happened to them, so don't propose the system unless you propose to stick by it, remembering what the tithe was used for; social welfare

tomder55 · Feb 9, 2013, 05:44 PM

In a sense you are right because the religious leaders ran the state .But when Rome was the law it would've been unthinkable to tithe to the Romans.Under the New Covenant tithe should voluntarily go for charity... not to a welfare state . So ,I'll continue to contribute to the church for their ministries . The tithing example related to taxes only works for the purpose of proportionality; not for the purpose of coercive enforcement of what the state deems should be given to charity .

Wondergirl · Feb 9, 2013, 05:54 PM

Originally Posted by tomder55

So ,I'll continue to contribute to the church for their ministries. The tithing example related to taxes only works for the purpose of proportionality; not for the purpose of coercive enforcement of what the state deems should be given to charity .

A tithe demanded from every member isn't coercive?

My son's church is very concerned about Haiti and the poverty there and runs missions and donates money to help Haitians (but really isn't sure where the money ends up), yet people in the next suburb over from where their church is located are financially strapped and need mentoring and life/job coaching. There seems to be a disconnect.

excon · Feb 9, 2013, 06:54 PM

Hello again,

The Catholic Church CONTINUES it's lawlessness... I'd NEVER listen to ANYTHING these child molester have to say.

excon

paraclete · Feb 10, 2013, 01:34 AM

Tom the tithe to the church should not be deductable that robs both God and Casear. I don't wonder why your nation is no longer blessed

tomder55 · Feb 10, 2013, 04:47 AM

Originally Posted by paraclete

Tom the tithe to the church should not be deductable that robs both God and Casear. i don't wonder why your nation is no longer blessed

If you've read my positions on taxation and on the establishment clause then you know I oppose deductions ,and any special ta status given to churches .

Also... as I've already pointed out ; the example of tithing is ONLY useful in it's proportionality of tax rates .

tomder55 · Feb 10, 2013, 04:49 AM

Originally Posted by excon

Hello again,

The Catholic Church CONTINUES it's lawlessness... I'd NEVER listen to ANYTHING these child molester have to say.

excon

the rebuke of Cardinal Roger Mahony by his successor is "continuing it's lawlessness" ?

tomder55 · Feb 10, 2013, 04:52 AM

A tithe demanded from every member isn't coercive?

A tithe today is completely voluntary... it is more of a guideline than a mandate. But as I told Clete. The example of a tithe by Dr Carson is used to illustrate the fairness of a flat tax.

paraclete · Feb 10, 2013, 05:37 AM

Originally Posted by tomder55

if you've read my positions on taxation and on the establishment clause then you know I oppose deductions ,and any special ta status given to churches .

Also .... as I've already pointed out ; the example of tithing is ONLY useful in it's proportionality of tax rates .

Tom a flat tax worked in a society where in reality only the landed gentry paid the tithe, or tax. It is not a reality today at 10% because the tax is required to provide much more. As a example, since we no longer rely on God our medical bills have soared, since we are perpetually at war or in preparation for war, our military is vastly more expensive and since we no longer have benevolent kings builting the inferstructure, that too has to be provided.. as I have said to you before make the tax 20% and a consumption tax and you will get out of the hole you have dug yourself

tomder55 · Feb 10, 2013, 06:27 AM

Dr Duncan makes it a point in saying that he wasn't using 10% as a guideline . His only contention is that no matter what the rate ;it should remain flat . And he's right .

excon · Feb 10, 2013, 06:37 AM

Hello again, tom:

He's WRONG.. A flat tax rewards the wealthy and punishes the poor.. It's a veritable right wing orgasm.

excon

talaniman · Feb 10, 2013, 06:45 AM

Nothing like a comprehensive jobs program to get us going and increase revenues. Pretty obvious the job creators are busy with other things so we just have to hire new ones. I think if states would partner with federal government instead of trying to control woman's parts and voters, then the could cut the red tap and start repairing a crumbling infrastructure neglected for far to long.

Then at least we won't have to be embarrassed with a power outage during the Superbowl, or power outages after mother nature has knocked down trees that should have been pruned away from power lines last spring. The opportunity to grow the economy is being squandered while interest rates are at damn near zero, while we debate cuts and taxes.

Revenue always has tobe part of the solution.