[paraclete]

Isreal will be eliminated

.
Does this idiot actually want to force Israel into a premptive strike
Defiant Ahmadinejad says Israel will be 'eliminated'

I would have thought that there was less rhetoric eminating from Iran these days and even the debate on the Iranian nuclear program is quieter than it was. Iran hasn't produced a bomb even though it has nuclear armed neighbours. The threat of the US forces in Iraq has been removed and the blow hard hasn't been blowing so hard, so what's the problem? He even has a reasonable attitude to the anti-muslim film

[paraclete]

Don't you find it amazing that Ahamadjidah should speak of a new world order and the demise of the US in the same sentence, wasn't it GWB who wanted a new world order

[tomder55]

No ;it was GHWB .

The Mahdi-hatter's time is up in Iran. He will soon step down .But before he does ,he is determined to fulfil his fantasy of ushering in the return of the Mahdi ;who will emerge from a well in a time of chaos.
What worries me more is the Obamamessiah ,who is willing to bring us all to the brink so that he can ride in on his white horse and save the day. He seriously has visions of him travelling to Tehran ala Nixon in his 2nd term;and coming to an accommodation with the mad -Mullahs .

[paraclete]

He seriously has visions of him travelling to Tehran ala Nixon in his 2nd term;and coming to an accomodation with the mad -Mullahs .

Well let him go. What's the worst that could happen? They could take him hostage. You know reality might take over and he may find the Mullahs aren't as mad as you think they are. Look The Muslims look to the Madhi, the Christians look to the return of Jesus the Messiah, the Jews are still waiting for their messiah.

I see two different forces operating in Iran, ahamadjihad was in the ascendency while the americans were in Iraq and now that they have gone wiser heads prevail and ahamadjihad is subdued. It's hard to take the religious leaders at their word that their aim isn't atomic weapons but they are perhaps more believable than ahamadjihad.

This nexus has to be broken and it is time for BO to earn his peace prize, let Iran have its civilian nuclear program and arrange to take the plutonium and spent fuel away for them. End on conflict

[tomder55]

You are as delusional as they are

[paraclete]

No you mustn't let one delusional individual like ahamadjihad colour your thinking about all Iranians. Yes they are a little mad by our standards but underneath it all they want the same thing we all do to be left alone. This is what americans don't get. You know Tom, in 1980 I had believed the B/S about Russians most of my life, but I travelled on a Russian ship and found they were no different to me. I was told China isn't a free country but a few years ago I travelled the country, not as part of a tour, but using local transport, I didn't see any more police than I would have in my own country or any more military either the Chinese were just like me, going about their daily lives. I had believed the B/S and it just wasn't true. So Tom I have decided not to believe american B/S any more. You know what Tom, you need to get out there and see things for yourself. In the words of that well known song, see the pyramids along the Nile, the sunset in old Cathy or was that Bombay, Rangoon across the bay, or was that another song... either way

Iran is the way it is because of american foreign policy, you created the environment that allowed Kohmeni and the mullahs to rise up and take over. You are responsible for the rise of militant Islam but you are in denial. You can undo what you have done but it takes great effort and certainly not gunboat diplomacy

[tomder55]

you mustn't let one delusional individual like ahamadjihad colour your thinking about all Iranians. Yes they are a little mad by our standards but underneath it all they want the same thing we all do to be left alone... You know what Tom, you need to get out there and see things for yourself.

spent parts of 2 years in Tehran . I found the people to be freedom loving people ,and that is part of the reason why I'm such a strong advocate for regime change.

[talaniman]

Regime change for Iran has to come from within, not by us and our own interests, and BB did himself no favors with his own presentation which was not only short on facts but full of the fear that Iran wants them to react to.

While all eyes are on Israeli fear over crap talk, Iran continues to bolster the Syrians and prevent a much needed regime change of the only Iranian ally.

[tomder55]

Regime change for Iran has to come from within,

and they could've had it in 2009 if the President wasn't so feckless. They needed his support and he voted Present .

and BB did himself no favors with his own presentation

On the contrary... I thought he was great . That JFK red line comment was right on the mark.

[talaniman]

I doubt soaring rhetoric would have changed the outcome of the Iranian election, as the opposition was definitely out gunned, and BB's bright red line was graphic, but served no purpose except to push for a war no one wants.

His assertion of Iran bombing Israel by next summer is ludicrous.

[tomder55]

I doubt soaring rhetoric would have changed the outcome of the Iranian election, as the opposition was definitely out gunned, and BB's bright red line was graphic, but served no purpose except to push for a war no one wants.

His assertion of Iran bombing Israel by next summer is ludicrous.

I'm not talking about soaring rhetoric . The President has already proven his words are shallow and meaningless.
What I was talking about was non-military material support to the Green Revolution . The President has already admitted he blew it on this call.

[talaniman]

What kind of non military support? I mean the regime was adamantly and aggressively squelching the unrest in the first place. I doubt anything short of an invasion would have changed the outcome. He may of made things a lot worse continuing his objections to what the government was doing given the opposition by the government, military, and half the population.

Maybe they weren't as ready for freedom as we like to think. I think any one objecting to the Iranian government would be meaningless to them at this time, maybe later.

I certainly hope so, but that's up to the Iranian people, NOT us.

[tomder55]

What kind of non military support? I mean the regime was adamently and aggressively squelching the unrest in the first place. I doubt anything short of an invasion would have changed the outcome. He may of made things a lot worse continuing his objections to peaceful protests given the opposition by the government,military, and half the population.

Maybe they weren't as ready for freedom as we like to think.

Hard for freedom loving people to come out from under the jackboot of tyranny when other freedom loving people turn a blind eye and" extend an open palm to the closed fist ".

[talaniman]

Case you haven't noticed we have many issues with Iran. Like I say, what do you mean by non military support? Cheerleading them to die for what they believe is ignoring the odds needlessly.

When the Iranians want freedom, they will take it like others before them.

[tomder55]

Had we not received help we'd still be singing 'God save the Queen' .

[talaniman]

They sent us money, so we should send the Iranians money? Got an address?

[tomder55]

WE got money ;material support ,covert training and overt military intervention. I supported 3 of the 4 for Iranian dissidents.

[talaniman]

Where is the address to send this stuff too?

[tomder55]

You are kidding... right ?

[talaniman]

Not at all, where do you start the covert training? What kind of training? And what's this overt military intervention look like. They are not going to let you in the country, nor let there own citizens out to be trained.

Explain how these things are accomplished. Remember, you guys have great ideas but have no clue how to carry them out in face of some very harsh reality. So for now it's a wish list, but impossible for any president to carry out,republican,or democrat.

Hell we can barely accomplish those goals in counties that have allowed us in, let alone occupy by force.