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tomder55 · Nov 19, 2011, 06:05 AM

Before and after the quake,the US has been by far the biggest donor ,both public and private ,to Haiti since 1973 . Short of a takeover, most of it is ,and will continue to be wasted, because despite our best efforts ,Haiti is a failed state.

talaniman · Nov 19, 2011, 11:44 AM

Originally Posted by paraclete

Yes I have met americans and they are just as opiniated as you are, so sure of their own righteousness. My hate goes back to the first american who abused me and attempted to make me feel insignificant in my own country, Big mouth, big ego, it intensified, when in a time of rampant inflation, the wise minds in america would not allow the company I worked for to increase salaries to match market value because in their narrow view we were being paid more than they were. I have worked for american companies and I know only too well how they regard the locals. You want to know why I don't like you, it is because of your actions towards Australians

Don't be mad at Americans, we too have a problem with American corporations. Why do you think they ran to your island? So WE couldn't get OUR raises that we deserved!

Your hatred is palatable, and comes across loud and clear. Unfortunately, I feel its misdirected.

paraclete · Nov 19, 2011, 02:20 PM

Originally Posted by talaniman

Don't be mad at Americans, we too have a problem with American corporations. Why do you think they ran to your island? So WE couldn't get OUR raises that we deserved!

Your hatred is palatable, and comes across loud and clear. Unfortunately, I feel its misdirected.

What sort of strange excuse is that? They came here to cheat you. Don't think this is a low cost country, it isn't, they came here to sell their products or to extract their royalties for their technology and when it didn't work the way they would like because this isn't the "states", they run a manager from the states in to foul things up even more. You talk about this being an island as if it is insignificant, this place is the size of the continential US, any place I want to go is distant

How would you like me to direct my opinion? If I could change your outlook on the world I would

talaniman · Nov 19, 2011, 02:51 PM

My outlook on the world is we are at WAR, an idelogical one, a new world order, against the old world order. It crosses borders, oceans, and cultures. Its happening through out the world, and pits us against each other in the classic divide and conquer through hatred. Step back from the hate and see if we are having a common problem, is all I will ask of you. Not trying to change your outlook, just want to know what you see without your hate.

paraclete · Nov 19, 2011, 03:21 PM

Originally Posted by talaniman

My outlook on the world is we are at WAR, an idelogical one, a new world order, against the old world order. It crosses borders, oceans, and cultures. Its happening thru out the world, and pits us against each other in the classic divide and conquer thru hatred. Step back from the hate and see if we are having a common problem, is all I will ask of you. Not trying to change your outlook, just want to know what you see without your hate.

Where did you get these ideas? A new world order? One world government. A euphenism for capitalist domination ruled by one country. We certainly don't want to go down that road any more than we wanted to go down the communist road. I see the common problem but I think we stand on opposite sides of it. I don't want the new world order where we are all lackeys of the capitalist system, it sounds like the old world order repackaged to me.

The Fabianists have wanted a new world order for a long time, strangely George W Bush spoke about an new world order and who knows he may have been a fabianist. These guys are dangerous because what they do isn't for the benefit of the little guy but to boost their own power and authority. Tal there is no utopia at the end of the road. What we all hope for is dignity, security and a reasonable income. I live in a society where that is possible without riping anyoneelse off. You think I hate but hate leads to violence and I am not a violent person. I intensely dislike any person, nation, etc that places itself above the rest of us and seeks to inject its will into places it does not belong. I also like to laugh at the ridiculous writhings of the system. It is part of the Australian ethos to take the mickey out of the tall poppies, this can be construed as hatred by some and for the record I don't like PC

talaniman · Nov 19, 2011, 03:53 PM

Originally Posted by paraclete

Where did you get these ideas? a new world order? one world government. a euphenism for capitalist domination ruled by one country. We certainly don't want to go down that road any more than we wanted to go down the communist road. I see the common problem but I think we stand on opposite sides of it. I don't want the new world order where we are all lackeys of the capitalist system, it sounds like the old world order repackaged to me.

The Fabianists have wanted a new world order for a long time, strangely George W Bush spoke about an new world order and who knows he may have been a fabianist. These guys are dangerous because what they do isn't for the benefit of the little guy but to boost their own power and authority. Tal there is no utopia at the end of the road. What we all hope for is dignity, security and a reasonable income. I live in a society where that is possible without riping anyoneelse off. You think I hate but hate leads to violence and I am not a violent person. I intensely dislike any person, nation, etc that places itself above the rest of us and seeks to inject its will into places it does not belong. I also like to laugh at the rediculous writhings of the system. It is part of the Australian ethos to take the mickey out of the tall poppies, this can be construed as hatred by some and for the record I don't like PC

DAMN IF I DON'T AGREE!! You ain't the only one who doesn't like to be screwed over. :eek: You sound like part of the 99% to me!! :eek:

tomder55 · Nov 19, 2011, 04:32 PM

In some regards unfortunately there are many Fabians in the
Republic establishment. But the Bush freedom agenda was right on. Where I dispute him was where he did those compromises that tal loves so much that brought us the largest expansion in the entitlement called Medicare ;the largest Federal government intrusion of states authority in education ;and he continued the Clintoon policy of encouraging the expansion of the real estate bubble .

talaniman · Nov 19, 2011, 05:13 PM

Originally Posted by tomder55

in some regards unfortunately there are many Fabians in the
repubic establishment. But the Bush freedom agenda was right on. Where I dispute him was where he did those compromises that tal loves so much that brought us the largest expansion in the entitlement called Medicare ;the largest Federal government intrusion of states authority in education ;and he continued the Clintoon policy of encouraging the expansion of the real estate bubble .

DAMN, if I don't agree! Hated the part D which wasn't paid for and made life hard for the seniors and forced them into the free market for drugs, at inflated prices.

And all that cheating to get the numbers to look good for a test the states paid for.

And letting those greedy bankers and real estate companies, team up with the ratings agency to defraud millions and extract all the freakin' money in the world, and throw this country into chaos and misinformation, and then blame the janitor who is trying to clean the mess up, and the dems who came after repubs.

Careful Tom, I might have to join the TEA PARTY, Naw, I ain't that mad. Just amused that you repubs wrecked the car and want to drive again.

paraclete · Nov 19, 2011, 05:20 PM

Well there you go. No Tal I'm not a millionaire but I don't need to be. Money changes your perspective

talaniman · Nov 19, 2011, 06:32 PM

HEEEEEELP, The conservatives have GOT me, AAAAAAAAAAAAAAhhh! :eek:

paraclete · Nov 19, 2011, 06:58 PM

Yeh they will do that. Hey I'm a conservative part of the time, I like the pace of change to be ordered and intelligent, not chaotic grabbing at the latest idea and calling it gospel, but there must also be social responsibility, we are all in this boat together and those on the upper decks have to have responsibility for those on the lower decks

talaniman · Nov 19, 2011, 07:24 PM

HEEEEEEELP, the liberals have gotten Clete! Heeeelp!! :eek:

paraclete · Nov 19, 2011, 10:11 PM

Not at all, I am opposed to out and out socialism, but there are some things that need to be done and should be done. I think the boundries are more blurred here than they are there. Your Tea Party would be considered far right here somewhere right of One Nation, which was opposed to just about everything, however you have nothing equivalent to our Labor and Greens which are a long way left of centre. Our Liberal party which is considered conservative would be equivalent to some of your democrats, so as a nation we are fairly well signed on to social responsibility

You guys and gals think I'm fairly cynical about america, hell I'm cynical about what much of my own people do and say, but here is what one of your own has to say
http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/...120-1np1w.html

tomder55 · Nov 21, 2011, 08:20 AM

Social responsibility is a projection by someone about how much someone else should contribute.

talaniman · Nov 21, 2011, 12:31 PM

But consensus of opinion is what makes policy, and rules. Or at least it should in my opinion.

tomder55 · Nov 21, 2011, 12:45 PM

But consensus of opinion is what makes policy, and rules. Or at least it should in my opinion.

That's been the death of many a democracy. Fortunately we have the Constitution to guard against the tyranny of the majority .

paraclete · Nov 21, 2011, 02:07 PM

Yes but nothing is guarding you against the tyranny of the majority in your congress unless it is the use of Executive Orders.

Tell me Tom is it a democratic majority you fear so much?

talaniman · Nov 21, 2011, 02:52 PM

Originally Posted by paraclete

yes but nothing is guarding you against the tyranny of the majority in your congress unless it is the use of Executive Orders.

Tell me Tom is it a democratic majority you fear so much?

Republicans are happy only when it's a republican majority. Nothing else makes them happy.

TUT317 · Nov 21, 2011, 08:14 PM

Originally Posted by tomder55

that's been the death of many a democracy. Fortunately we have the Constitution to guard against the tyranny of the majority .

Hi Tom,

Here is an example of tyranny of the majority.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/22/us...pagewanted=all

The Constitution encourages this type of behaviour.

Tut

cdad · Nov 21, 2011, 08:16 PM

Originally Posted by TUT317

Hi Tom,

Here is an example of tyranny of the majority.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/22/us...pagewanted=all

The Constitution encourages this type of behaviour.

Tut

Link not working. Can you post it again ?

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