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justinv · Mar 14, 2010, 02:42 PM

Hi,

I have a Symmons Temptrol shower and in the last month or so, the shower starts getting cold after 1 or 2 minutes. I have to keep turning and turning the dial to keep the water hot. I don't think it's the hot water heater because it's not even a year old and elsewhere in the house there is still hot water when this happens.

I just replaced the spindle (part T-10 I think) and no change.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Justin

massplumber2008 · Mar 14, 2010, 04:21 PM

Hi Justin...

Hmmm... sounds more like a whole house issue here... especially if you replaced the spindle.

Tell me if you have a gas or electric water heater??

Since the shower is pretty much the only high volume fixture in the house (besides the washing machine) this would be the first place you would notice an issue... make sense?

Next step is to try the washing machine on full hot (large load)... wait until near the end of the fill cycle and then stick your hand under the water filling the unit... still hot?

Try this and let me know... answer my question.

Back to you

Mark

justinv · Mar 14, 2010, 05:35 PM

Hi, Mark.

Thank you for the quick response.

I just ran the washing machine on hot and at first it was VERY hot - too hot to touch. By the end I'd describe it as warm and maybe slightly cooler than one would like a shower to be.

In case you're wondering. I have it set at 130 degrees.

justinv · Mar 14, 2010, 05:45 PM

Oops. Also, it's a gas heater.

massplumber2008 · Mar 14, 2010, 05:59 PM

OK... figuring you have a 40 gallon gas-fired water heater here. If so, then you shouldn't even come close to running out during a single shower or load of dishes.

Hmmm...

I still want you to try the washing machine... let me know what happens... o.k?
It could be a defective gas valve (very unlikely). It could be a dip tube issue at the water heater (also unlikely at this point). It could be a defective mixing valve at another fixture causing issues with the shower (maybe?).

Test the washing machine... let me know if the water temperature varies up until the end of the fill cycle.

Finally, do you have a single handle bathroom sink faucet?

Let me know all...

Mark

justinv · Mar 14, 2010, 06:27 PM

Hey, Mark

I put 2 posts above. To clarify, it is a 30 gallon gas heater and when I ran the washing machine, it went from very hot to warm by the end of the fill cycle. Did you want me to do it a second time? Before we had our old 30-gallon heater replaced with this one, the hot water lasted much longer. Actually, the hot water lasted longer with this heater up until a month or two ago.

My upstairs bathroom sink is 2 handle, the downstairs is single handle.

Justin

massplumber2008 · Mar 14, 2010, 08:57 PM

OK... I suspect that the mixing valve at a single handle faucet may be causing the issue at the shower, washing machine, etc.

In the morning, shut off the shutoffs in the cabinets going to any single handle faucet you have in the house (kitchen sink, bathroom faucet downstairs, etc) and then take your shower... let me know if there is a HUGE improvement in length of hot shower. If there is an improvement then the mixing valve in one of the single handle faucets is shot and will need to be replaced. We can isolate which faucet when needed.

Let me know what you discover...

Mark

justinv · Mar 15, 2010, 07:33 PM

Mark,

I turned off both downstairs faucets and there was a definite improvement in both how far I had to turn the dial to get hot water (5 o'clock rather than the usual 3 o'clock) and the length of time during which it stayed hot. However, I did have to adjust the dial to keep it hot a couple of times. I am going to ask my wife if she notices an improvement tomorrow morning to make sure I'm not imagining things.

Is this the improvement you were looking for? Or were we hoping it would just stay a constant temperature the entire time without adjusting?

justinv · Mar 16, 2010, 05:45 AM

Update:

Wife showered this morning and noticed the same thing. Had to adjust the shower a lot less but still had to adjust.

afaroo · Mar 16, 2010, 06:08 AM

Hi Justinv,

Mark did a great troubleshooting for you I believe he will ask you to open shut of valves on one of the down stairs faucet, to isolate which faucet is the problem, good luck.

John

justinv · Mar 16, 2010, 08:32 AM

afaroo, I agree.

Once I isolate the faucet in question, should I just buy a new one and replace it or is it fixable?

My next question is, do I have multiple problems going on if I still have to adjust the shower to keep it hot?

justinv · Mar 16, 2010, 08:34 AM

I agree afaroo,

Once I identify the faucet in question, is this fixable or should I just replace the faucet?

Second, do I have multiple problems if I still have to adjust the shower to keep it hot?

Thanks,
Justin

afaroo · Mar 16, 2010, 08:46 AM

Once you identify the bad faucet please tell us the brand and the model number of it, you may have to replace the Cartridge or stem depends on your faucet, let fix this problem first then if you still have problem then go from there, also wait for Mark once he is online and what will he suggest he is the master, Thanks.

John

massplumber2008 · Mar 17, 2010, 04:33 AM

Hi all:

It still doesn't sound like this is isolated yet? Any other single handle faucets in the house? If so, then shut the hot water shutoff under that sink and then try the shower again.

You should not have to make adjustments to the shower if you find the right faucet. As suggested by John, you'll need to test each faucet and figure out which ine. You can usually fix the faucet by replacing the mixing cartridge.

I'm in the middle of a large project and we just went through a HUGE flooding in my area so I'm off pumping basements and lighting water heaters and boilers, but I'll pop in ASAP... keep me posted.

Mark

justinv · Mar 18, 2010, 07:17 PM

Hey, Mark

I only have the 2 single-handle faucets and both are off and I have to adjust the shower to keep it hot. I have a dual-handle upstairs in the bathroom with the shower but that doesn't count, right?

I'm guessing this is not the problem then. Any other thoughts?

I hear you on the flooding. I'm in Bristol County and we got our fair share of rain as well.

Justin

KISS · Mar 19, 2010, 03:35 AM

Take a look here: HowStuffWorks "How Water Heaters Work"

At a typical water heater. Note the DIP tube. A broken dip tube is yet another reason why this could happen.

After you run the water in the shower for a while or anywhere, compare the temperature of the water at the drain with the hot water. Is the water temp at the drain warmer or colder than the hot water.

massplumber2008 · Mar 19, 2010, 04:38 AM

Hi Guys:

YUP! If you've isolated all single handle faucets then you are best to check the DIP TUBE as KISS has suggested... next logical step, unfortunately! Chek out his links above... let us know what you think.

Mark

justinv · Mar 21, 2010, 07:12 AM

Oh boy! So it appears the only way to remove the dip tube to look at it is to cut the cold water supply pipe since the connection is soldered on so low. How hard is it to learn to solder..

afaroo · Mar 21, 2010, 07:54 AM

Justinv,

I agree with the experts above it is possible that you have a failed dip tube, open the link below and it will show you how the dip tube works, Thanks.

John

How a water heater dip tube works and what it looks like.