[Soul]

Brief summary: I feel that I truly love my girlfriend, but I'm not physically attracted to her, so I very rarely want to have sex. I personally do not have a problem with this, but my girlfriend does.

Background: Ten years ago, we started becoming close friends and eventually became best friends. Two years after that, we decided to become a couple, and have been together off but mostly on for over eight years now. The problem is I have never been physically attracted to her, even though many others think she is considered good looking.

In university, I did actually take a course on human sexuality and intimate relationships. I learned about Sternberg's Triangular Theory of Love and I really buy into that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triangular_theory_of_love

Basically, for me personally, what I have for my girlfriend is very strong "companionate love". I have a very deep affection towards her, and I am fully ready, willing and wanting to marry and spend the rest of my life with her, but I feel no passion towards her. However, I am completely fine with how things are.

For her, I know she also has a very deep affection towards me, and at times she has indicated she does want to marry me as well. She wants to have sex everyday, and I can't be sure, but I have a feeling it's not so much that this stems from her passion towards me, but rather that she has the desire to feel "wanted". Very possibly, she may have "companionate love" with me as well, but she is not satisfied with just that and wants the "passion" element there as well. She desires the attention of being wanted and lusted after, but I can't give this to her.

My definition of "true love" is based on intimacy and commitment, where the passion is just a bonus. The problem is her definition of true love is different, and she believes there must be passion for there to be true love. Because of this, she does not think I truly love her.

I believe, and I've tried explaining to her, that the passion element is one that generally does not last in longterm relationships. I think that most of the successful relationships and marriages are based on companionate love, which is what we undoubtedly both have. I wanted to believe that her desire for passion is something that will fade over time, but that just doesn't seem to be the case.

If it were left to me to initiate sex, then I would probably only do it once or twice a month. But she wants it everyday, so she tries initiating it with me, and sometimes I'll relent and just do it without much resistance, but sometimes I would really not feel like it and she would then be very upset with me. Because of her initiating, I estimate we probably have sex between eight and ten times per month, or about twice per week on average. Sometimes we may do it 3-4 days in a row, and other times we may go a week without doing it. If she had her way, we would have sex at least five times per week, so 20+ times per month. I just simply can't meet her sexual needs.

Another thing that makes her more upset about this is the fact that I prefer to masturbate than to have sex with her. I don't do it in front of her, only when I'm alone, and sometimes when she is sleeping. I don't always have opportunities to masturbate, but if I had unlimited privacy, I generally would masturbate once a day, sometimes twice. Usually, I would masturbate to pictures of other girls that I find online, mostly models. I seem to be quite picky about who I find attractive, so it's generally the same few girls that turn me on, and I constantly look for new pictures or videos of them online, and when I find some, I get especially excited.

I don't actually want to be in a relationship with any of these girls, but their looks just turn me on. My girlfriend doesn't understand or doesn't care about that fact that I don't have feelings for them, and gets very jealous of these girls and upset with me because they turn me on and she doesn't.

She wants me to never masturbate, and never look at those girls anymore, but I don't think I can get myself to do that, nor do I think it's a reasonable request.

Another factor here is when I masturbate, I generally like to just get off as quickly as possible - usually within a couple minutes. When we have sex, not surprisingly, she does take longer to climax, so often it will take at least 20-30 minutes. Sometimes, I feel frustrated when she takes too long, and the longer it drags out, the more frustrated I get.

I hope I haven't left out anything significant here, and if you have any questions, please do ask and I will try answering them to the best of my ability.

Any insights you may have on this situation is greatly appreciated.

Thanks for your time.

[Wildcat21]

Are you gay? Seriously.

There are a lot men who are emotionall yattracted to women... but physically to men. Nothing wrong with that.

Also - YES jerking off can ruin the sex. WHy do you need to do that?

[Soul]

Are you gay? Seriously.

There are a lot men who are emotionall yattracted to women...but physically to men. Nothing wrong with that.

Also - YES jerking off can ruin the sex. WHy do you need to do that?

I hope your response isn't indicative of the general quality of help that I can expect to get here, because that above is pure garbage that offers zero assistance.

No, I am not gay. Seriously. If I was, then wouldn't I be masturbating while looking at or thinking about guys? That is not the case. I ONLY have sexual desires for women. In my life, I have been seriously infatuated with two or three females, of which one of them was my girlfriend's other best friend (and she fully knows of that), but that's neither here nor there.

Why do I need to masturbate? I thought I made it pretty clear in my original post.

1.) I don't find my girlfriend sexually attractive, but there are some other girls I do find sexually attractive
2.) I prefer to get off quickly, but when I have sex with the girlfriend, I have to wait until she's done before I go.

[Wildcat21]

Ok, you wanted an honest answer. You need more help then can be offered here. Go get some counseling - you don't sound like you want to face reality.

Face some realities.

[Soul]

Ok, you wanted an honest answer. You need more help then can be offered here. Go get some counseling - you don't sound like you want to face reality.

Face some realities.

What is this "reality" that you think I can't face?

Please tell me on what premise you have to believe I must be gay?

Seriously, you're considered an expert here? That must be a joke.

Yes, maybe I might need professional counselling, and I have considered doing that, but I thought maybe I might be able to get some sort of help here first... but with people like you here, I'm beginning to think that maybe I was wrong.

[Allheart]

Hi Soul and welcome.

It must have been very difficult for you to reveal something so private.
I think the advice above, as far as seeking professional help with this situation is good advice.

Seeking professional help with this is nothing to be ashamed of, in fact, it would more than likely be the best thing for you in the long run.

I have a feeling this has nothing to do with the fact that you are not attracted to your girlfriend, your difficulties could be, more with something inside of you, than just sheerly an attraction issue.

Sorry if that sounds like I am saying there is something wrong with you, that is not what I am saying, but just from reading your post, there does seem to be something that needs to be tended to on a more one -on-one basis.

The current situation is really not fair to either one of you, especially your girlfriend. Intimacy, not necessarily the sex part of it, but the passion and intimacy, is a precious part of a relationship. If your girlfriend senses that you are not attraced to her, you will have even greater troubles down the road.

It is good you came here to get a feel of your situation. It may not be what you expected to hear, but it is a first step and a very good one for you to at least recognize there is a problem.

You love this girl deeply, it is worth considering seeking some assistance as to the why? I fear that if you don't find out if this is actually a problem or to what extent, you could loose this girl that you love, find yourself in another relationship, with the same problem.

I do wish you the best. Stick around the folks on here are awesome and truly do wish to help people.

[Geoffersonairplane]

Absolutely perfect advice allheart, sorry have to spread it so can't rate you.

I actually deleted a response I made earlier because I had to work out how to answer it properly and was unsure of the usefullness of my response.

But allheart has given you some valuable advice here so please listen to it..

Stick around here too and you will get some more valuable advice too..

Its not as bad as you think on here, you will get a variety of opinions, some you like, some you don't . Those that you don't like... Read them a few times before deciding if they provide you with real help.

I know you are not an engine, but this may help!

Filter some of the advice you get here through your line of reasoning..

But make sure the filter is not faulty buddy!!

Once the sediment has gone, everything will seem clearer!

[Wildcat21]

We always recommend professional help. It's really important. I am quite sure everyone on the palnet would benefit from help.

But, I only brought the other stuff because I have researched for a book about sexless marriages. Where the man refuses to have sex. The man usually turns out to be gay - nothing wrong with that.

Sex is pretty DAM important part of any healthy relationship. It will be a deal breaker in any relationship. This needs to be fixed.

[Geoffersonairplane]

I don't think professional help means there is anything bad/wrong with you necessarily (and in most cases)..

We could all do with some help from time to time and the experts can really offer you the best advice and guidance..

Nothing wrong with you buddy other than your need to accept that you need this help and guidance...

The road will be much less congested then, believe me!!

[chuff]

Hey soul, I have a question, have you had a previous sexual relationship with someone that you consider better than the girl your with now? If so perhaps your not happy with her compared to the level you had in the past.

[Soul]

Finally, some meaningful responses that I can start addressing to go forward...

Hi Soul and welcome.

Thanks...

It must have been very difficult for you to reveal something so private.
I think the advice above, as far as seeking professional help with this situation is good advice.

Seeking professional help with this is nothing to be ashamed of, in fact, it would more than likely be the best thing for you in the long run.

Yes, I do realize this. In fact, my girlfriend and I had gone to a relationship counsellor for several sessions a little over half a year ago, but that came to an abrupt end when she finally revealed to me that several years ago she had slept with three other guys, during a time when we were "on a break", but still basically living together. For awhile, I couldn't stand looking at her, but it wasn't long before I realized I was able to forgive her for it, and would rather overlook what she did than break up with her for good. After that, we didn't get around to resuming the counselling.

I have a feeling this has nothing to do with the fact that you are not attracted to your girlfriend, your difficulties could be, more with something inside of you, than just sheerly an attraction issue.

Sorry if that sounds like I am saying there is something wrong with you, that is not what I am saying, but just from reading your post, there does seem to be something that needs to be tended to on a more one -on-one basis.

What you're saying is perfectly fine, and you might be wrong, in that maybe there IS something wrong with me, but at least you're addressing it in a way that is helpful and considerate, unlike Wildcat21.

Anyway, yes, maybe I may have issues that are my own and not related to my girlfriend, and that's why I was wondering just yesterday, after our last argument (and the catalyst for me actually coming here for help) if I should go to a counsellor myself and see if the issues can be brought to light and resolved. I think I might just need to do that.

The current situation is really not fair to either one of you, especially your girlfriend. Intimacy, not necessarily the sex part of it, but the passion and intimacy, is a precious part of a relationship. If your girlfriend senses that you are not attraced to her, you will have even greater troubles down the road.

Yes, I do agree it's not fair to either of us. The thing is, I believe intimacy and passion are two completely separate things. We have lots of intimacy... just no passion. We hold hands, hug, and snuggle all the time, and I enjoy doing that a lot with her. We are mentally very connected, and we share pretty much everything with each other, and are as comfortable as two people can be with one another. The only thing is, when it comes to actually having sex, that's the part I tend to balk on.

To me, I believe intimacy is a precious part of a relationship, but passion is just something that might initially bring two people together, but often fades away over time, and what determines whether the relationship will be successful or not in the longterm is the intimacy and commitment.

I do realize that this is my philosophy, and it seems that it differs from my girlfriend's philosophy, and that is where the problem lays.

We're not going to have greater troubles down the road... because we're already at that stage. My girlfriend knows I'm not physically attracted to her, and that's part of what has brought this situation to a head.

It is good you came here to get a feel of your situation. It may not be what you expected to hear, but it is a first step and a very good one for you to at least recognize there is a problem.

You love this girl deeply, it is worth considering seeking some assistance as to the why? I fear that if you don't find out if this is actually a problem or to what extent, you could loose this girl that you love, find yourself in another relationship, with the same problem.

Well, the thing is, if we don't do anything about this, we probably won't break up, but we'll just both continue to be unhappy - her because I don't give her the attention that she wants, and me because I get forced into having sex unwillingly.

I guess by seeking help, we need to find out one of two things:
1.) Is there a way to resolve this situation of her wanting sex, but me not wanting sex and preferring to masturbate?
2.) If there is, then great... but if there isn't, then we have to make the hard decision of forcing ourselves to break up with one another.

Neither of us want to break up with one another, but if it gets to the point where we feel we have no choice, then maybe we'll just have to force ourselves to.

I do wish you the best. Stick around the folks on here are awesome and truly do wish to help people.

Thanks...

[Soul]

But, I only brought the other stuff because I have researched for a book about sexless marriages. Where the man refuses to have sex. The man usually turns out to be gay - nothing wrong with that.

Even IF that were to be true, I very strongly don't think I'm part of that "usually". If I'm gay, I'm not trying to hide it or be in denial of it. I'm telling you again straight up that there is simply no reason for you or myself to believe I have any homosexual tendencies. I have only ever liked females, and have only ever fantasized about females, and have only ever gotten off by thinking of females.

Sex is pretty DAM important part of any healthy relationship. It will be a deal breaker in any relationship. This needs to be fixed.

This is an opinion, not a fact. I can guarantee there are many successful relationships and marriages that places sex low in the priority list.

[Allheart]

I do have a question, if that is okay. What was the level of attraction to your girlfriend, prior to you finding out she was with other men during the "break" in your relationship?
Sorry to bring that up, I know it's not pleasant for you.

[Soul]

Hey soul, I have a question, have you had a previous sexual relationship with someone that you consider better than the girl your with now? If so perhaps your not happy with her compared to the level you had in the past.

No, I have never had any other sexual relationships. She is my first and only girlfriend I've ever had. As I've mentioned before, however, there had been several girls I had lusted over and been infatuated with previous to getting together with her, but those never went anywhere.

I just don't find myself to be physically attracted to her. I don't know if it's just because I don't think she's as attractive as some of the other girls I see around, or if it's not related to that at all. I look at her more as my best friend and soulmate.

However, I do admit earlier on in our relationship, and even before we became a couple, I was more sexually charged with her, and I actually wanted to make out with her on several occasions.

I'm not sure what it was exactly that led me to want to make out with her at that time, whether it was just the newness of the whole experience, or just the thought of making out with someone... I don't know.

[Soul]

I do have a question, if that is okay. What was the level of attraction to your girlfriend, prior to you finding out she was with other men during the "break" in your relationship?
Sorry to bring that up, I know it's not pleasant for you.

It was the same. It has been this way for a very long time. In fact, she says the reason she even slept with these other guys is because she was mad or frustrated with me because I don't give her enough.

[Allheart]

Soul,

So you do see the danger in the lack of intamacy.

It sounds as though, outside of this issue, you do have a loving relationship. To me, there are all kinds of love.

And yes, going just yourself for the councilling, would probably be more beneficial. Believe me we all could use a visit to sit and have a chat with a professional who specializes in the fields we are in need of answers and insight.

Hang in there and just keep reassuring your girlfriend that you do lover her.

I truly hope you find the answers, you are off to a great start knowing there is an issue that seriously needs to be addressed. A lot of folks would not even get that far.

The sooner you look into this, the better for both of you.

[chuff]

Finally, some meaningful responses that I can start addressing to go forward...

Dude, the thought of being gay doesn't appeal to me either but Wildcat is an expert. He usually hits on the head. Maybe he wasn't right here but I can tell you from my own experience that he didn't mean any disrespect. Sometimes people come on this board and they are in denial about whatever there problems are and the only way to get to them is with a slap of reality to the face. On my very first post on this board WC was the first one to respond and I did not like what he wrote. I did not like it because it was true.

I'm not saying your gay but WC was just asking. He was trying to help and he has offered help to literally hundreds if not thousands of others here that is in may circumstances dead on. Okay your not gay but you are in denial, which I will try and help show you.

In fact, my girlfriend and I had gone to a relationship counsellor for several sessions a little over half a year ago, but that came to an abrupt end when she finally revealed to me that several years ago she had slept with three other guys, during a time when we were "on a break", but still basically living together.

Well this sounds like a major turning point in the relationship. First you don't trust her. You can say that you do but you don't. I can tell just by the way your wrote on a break in quotations. The counseling sessions should also probably have been extended when this revelation came out but instead they were ended.

For awhile, I couldn't stand looking at her, but it wasn't long before I realized I was able to forgive her for it, and would rather overlook what she did than break up with her for good. After that, we didn't get around to resuming the counselling.

You've never forgiven her. To be honest, I wouldn't have either. I bet down in your sub conscious, or for that matter even in your conscious mind you think, why should I give you any love when you take it to three other guys. There's not trust. Truthfully I don't blame you. I wouldn't trust her. But don't deny it. Don't lie to yourself about it.

What you're saying is perfectly fine, and you might be wrong, in that maybe there IS something wrong with me, but at least you're addressing it in a way that is helpful and considerate, unlike Wildcat21.

Okay, your not gay. Although you seem to be hung up on it for some reason.

Anyways, yes, maybe I may have issues that are my own and not related to my girlfriend, and that's why I was wondering just yesterday, after our last argument (and the catalyst for me actually coming here for help) if I should go to a counsellor myself and see if the issues can be brought to light and resolved. I think I might just need to do that.

If you can afford it, I think you should.

Yes, I do agree it's not fair to either of us. The thing is, I believe intimacy and passion are two completely separate things. We have lots of intimacy... just no passion. We hold hands, hug, and snuggle all the time, and I enjoy doing that a lot with her. We are mentally very connected, and we share pretty much everything with each other, and are as comfortable as two people can be with one another. The only thing is, when it comes to actually having sex, that's the part I tend to balk on.

Because she cheated on you. Three times. She broke that level of intimacy with three other guys. She broke that level of passion with three other guys. Don't make excuses for it. Don't deny it.

To me, I believe intimacy is a precious part of a relationship, but passion is just something that might initially bring two people together, but often fades away over time, and what determines whether the relationship will be successful or not in the longterm is the intimacy and commitment.

Yeah, it fades away when she doesn't share the same level of passion you do for the relationship or how you feel about the meaning of sex with one another.

I do realize that this is my philosophy, and it seems that it differs from my girlfriend's philosophy, and that is where the problem lays.

Yes.

We're not going to have greater troubles down the road... because we're already at that stage. My girlfriend knows I'm not physically attracted to her, and that's part of what has brought this situation to a head.

Your in denial. If you don't give her sex she will, or already is going to get it somewhere else. Eventually she'll leave you.

Well, the thing is, if we don't do anything about this, we probably won't break up, but we'll just both continue to be unhappy - her because I don't give her the attention that she wants, and me because I get forced into having sex unwillingly.

Again, your in denial. You will break up. She will do the breaking.

I guess by seeking help, we need to find out one of two things:
1.) Is there a way to resolve this situation of her wanting sex, but me not wanting sex and preferring to masturbate?
2.) If there is, then great... but if there isn't, then we have to make the hard decision of forcing ourselves to break up with one another.

Neither of us want to break up with one another, but if it gets to the point where we feel we have no choice, then maybe we'll just have to force ourselves to.

I'm sorry to say it but I think you've already broke up with her. Not physically but emotionally.

[Soul]

Soul,

So you do see the danger in the lack of intamacy.

Not to nit pick, but once again, it's the passion, not the intimacy... but yes, of course I do realize there's a problem in that she wants a lot of passion while I don't.

It sounds as though, outside of this issue, you do have a loving relationship. To me, there are all kinds of love.

Yes, we do have a loving relationship... very much so.

As I described in my original post, I really like to go by Sternberg's theory, and there it lists the different types of love... and what I have for her is strictly companionate love, and I am perfectly happy with this, but she is not.

And yes, going just yourself for the councilling, would probably be more beneficial. Believe me we all could use a visit to sit and have a chat with a professional who specializes in the fields we are in need of answers and insight.

Yeah, I guess I will be looking into booking a session soon.

Thanks for your insights.

[chuff]

Soul how old are you and how old is she?

How long have you being going out?

How long have you known each other?

[Allheart]

Chuff, All really good points.


Soul, you are not nit picking, so please don't worry. Passion, intamacy, if absent, there is a danger. What happened during the "break" and your girlfriends explanation as to why
It happened just supports the reason for concern.

I hope you understand that I am not say your girlfriend would betray you again, but, and I know you do know this there is that danger.

You say you are okay without the passion/intamacy ( nit pick again :), but do you really know that, when in truth, this was really your first relationship. How do you know that one day, some years down the road, you will wake up and turn to her and tell her something is missing.

The good thing is you know there is some work to be done and advice to seek and glad you are planning on doing that as an individual and soon.