[vanheart]

I guess what I am starting discover is that for her, the hunt and the conquest is more valuable and exciting as the actual person. After that it diminishes until the next source of supply. And because I gave the support & love, I fed enough supply until that wasn't enough.

[chuff]

I guess what I am starting discover is that for her, the hunt and the conquest is more valuable and exciting as the actual person. After that it diminishes until the next source of supply. And because I gave the support & love, I fed enough supply until that wasnt enough.

What I'm starting to discover about you is that you have an abundance of support and love to give that grows and she ran out of being able to accept it because she had no idea how. I feel sort of bad for her, to know that women everywhere want what you have to offer and at some level she probably does too, but has no idea how to be loved. She ran out of ways to be loved and accepted and coasted for as long as she could until she realized she could no longer pretend because she wasn't good enough for what you had to offer. She'll go for the next "conquest" and fail again and again and fail again and again, just like she did with you. She may have been the dumper, but that doesn't mean she's the one in control of herself and her emotions like you are starting to be.

[vanheart]

That's exactly right on & difficult to grasp this personality disorder. My guess, for her that there is always the chance of finding that ideal person and she believes that she deserves that. To feel like she is missing out on something else when not fulfilled or restless or when she experiences the thrill of newer supply like that ego boost for that agent, which to her was a challenging conquest that she bagged. Then she was given the drive & justification to eliminate me. My guess is that in her mind, I was already out of the picture and she could justify a fling. Nice one, huh?

[vanheart]

Believe me, finding out all of this stuff since has not been pleasurable. I run past conversations with her in mind head, even our last ones. (which is guess normal) I recall times when she was feeling high & mighty or when I woul go up against her & would say things like "Well, I told you, never date a stylist" or "Why dont you go out with some rock n roll chick, then" I guess what I found out was "Never date a Narcissist"

[vanheart]

Just wanted everyone that I am making headway, and thanks to all of you, every word. (Ive read them over and over, along with your other posts for others.) Went to a pal's soccer match & had fun, working hard to not feel like it was a distraction. It was nice. When I left, even though the niceness, got a bit sad in a way, at first because I felt so happy that I had such close friends, then because I wasn't really sure what to next or wanted to make that trip to find out. I drove home, checked your posts, then decided to force myself to work. Which I did amongst lapses in thought, posts and emotional distractions. Needless to say, I completed that looming project deadline and went through every action in my head sometimes verbal, as if I were teaching the process to myself. I actually did this in half of the time it generally takes me. After that I started getting excited about putting into action tai's suggestions and while doing so, helped myself with the analogy re: your inner self is a computer with applications (parts) all at your disposal. Some you rely on more than others. I wrote down the names of all the apps & even the utilities that I knew played their particular role. Some I recognized & new that they were there, but paid no attention to them. I have probably jotted down about 200 very critically, making matches, rating them in similar categories. Almost in different folders, hidden or not. Wow, Im sounding nerdy now. Now I can start to see how they work together and most have their negative counterpart that also serve a purpose, all the regard if you choose to use them. Its mot so much that my drive isn't big enough, or that I need a reboot, although important sometimes. Its about to understand what purpose those parts serve and know how to utilize them. Not only now but in everything. Its really about being the "user"
I am grateful beyond my own belief. The next step is to towards awareness. Thanks today.

[vanheart]

Just woke up after a series of bad nightmares about her, worst ones yet & feeling pretty down. I know Im making progress, but can't seem to get it together in times like these. I wish I could erase her from my mind. I guess Im still pretty shocked. Sorry I seem to have some goods hours, then turn around & feel like jumping off a bridge.

[kctiger]

Dude, it is a literal emotional roller coaster. There were times when I found myself laughing one minute and crying the next. You are normal, and human, and it is understandable. It takes a lot of time. This is a marathon, not a sprint.

[vanheart]

This sucks. I feel so weak right now, like I am pretending to make some progress..

[taoplr]

Its about to understand what purpose those parts serve and know how to utilize them. Not only now but in everything. Its really about being the "user." The next step is to towards awareness.

And

... a series of bad nightmares ...worst ones yet & feeling pretty down. ...I seem to have some goods hours, then turn around & feel like jumping off a bridge.

We are with you, which I am sure you feel, and your roller coaster is the same make and model as many of ours. Keep working. The self-torture will end, and you will emerge from this a more conscious, happy, and healthy human being.

It's great that you have been playing with the sorting and organizing of your inner resources. Have fun with that. Get your nerd on, all the way. All the time you spend in your neurospace can contribute to the resolution of your suffering. You are building an inner "workshop" where you can think, reflect, discover, invent, design, access resources, and build methods with which to manage your emotional and relational experience, and catalyze your growth. All your artistic skills and instincts can apply here.

After you have built some inner space in which to work, the next step is to "be like a radio." Don't search around like a sleuth with a flashlight, or a repair man. The sleuth uses a flashlight to expose something he suspects might be there; it is an active process. The repair man fixes broken stuff. You are not broken, no matter what you feel. If you approach yourself with surgical tools in hand, your inner mind will mount resistance that you can't circumvent.

A radio, by contrast, is passive; it receives signals that are being broadcast and converts them to useful sounds. It has no opinion of its own, just the content of its broadcasters, which are your parts. Staying close to the radio model, you can take a curious stance, but not more eager than that. While you desperately want to resolve this situation, you will do more if you take the position of neutrality, as if you didn't care and nothing mattered. I know how hard this is, but you can do it.

You might have already realized that the end of your suffering isn't about logic or an objective explanation being presented to you and to which you can respond. It's about getting familiar enough with your inner self (selves) that they allow you access to the place in which you can hear/see/feel what is really going on within you and resolving it. You have enough reasons to drop this person from your heart, but some part of you keeps hitting the hot button and it is in your interest to communicate directly or indirectly with that part. (Indirect communication opens a whole new study, which works but we don't need here)

Remember that healing is a natural process and all we are attempting to do is to accelerate the process. While the part we are interested in is still struggling, other parts are busily engaged in repairing, learning, and updating your mental software. Many years of experience (I started this sort of work in 1960) tell me that you have all the resources within you that you need to learn your way through this. Just keep a steady but gentle hand on the tiller and your senses open to the movement of your heart.

Your nightmares provide a wealth of information, all of which can be useful. What do you think of writing them down and posting them? You can control who sees them if you want, but they can give you a lot of info. Some dream interpretation ideas:

• We dream to sort through experiences and make sense of them, as well as to reinforce learning. Repeated dreams signify unlearned or unfinished business.
  
• All the characters—people, animals, anything sentient—in your dreams represent parts of you. Nothing in your dreams represents a foreign element. The way they interact depicts a metaphorical example of the way the parts of your mind are interacting.
  
• You can influence your dreams by telling your "dream manager" (I just made that up) that you want to learn from dreaming and asking that they become more obvious and revealing. Do this just before sleep.
  
• You can keep a pad and pen by your bedside and tell yourself that you will awaken when a significant dream occurs, and write it down. Make sure that you write everything in clear language, not just shorthand or trigger words that you think will remind you of the dream. (I made that mistake once, and woke the next morning to find "alarm clock" and "cheese" on the notepad.) The next day, try to reconstruct the dream, or at least visualize and communicate with the parts of the dream, which are all parts of you.

During your waking hours, spend quality time in your workshop. Throw a Parts Party and invite every one of your inner selves to come. Listen, ask questions, just get comfortable having your mind reveal itself to you through this visualization. And, yes, you are making it all up; or are you?

The magic moment will arrive when the part of you that agonizes and obsesses over her tells you what he does for you by making all that occur. Your task at that moment will be to thank him, and invite him to update his method so you can have what he gives you but in ways that only bring you joy and gratitude. It might take a few more steps but that moment will arrive.

Tao

[vanheart]

Thanks Tal,
I like the idea of position of neutrality. Hope I can get there.

Sure, I don't mind posting that dream:

The last dream as I recall took place in a restaurant back in NY.
I was passing through the hallway when I came upon a group of my ex's family and others. A couple of them seemed really uncomfortable, but I was greeted and hugged by a few too. As I turned around, my ex was entering the room dressed in a sexy dress and confidently swaggering in almost a slutty way acting as if she didn't see me, kind of laughing. When she realized I started to step up to talk to her, she dove behind a chair. I pull the chair aside, she looked terrified. I said "Remember me?" She stood up, pulled her composure together and said simply "Nope", went around the table to be seated with her group.

I exited the restaurant & as I peered through the series of windows, she would shift back & forth to hide & avoid me seeing her through the glass.

That's all that I can recall..

[taoplr]

Thanks Tal,
I like the idea of position of neutrality. Hope I can get there.

Sure, I dont mind posting that dream:

The last dream as I recall took place in a restaurant back in NY.
I was passing through the hallway when I came upon a group of my ex's family and others. A couple of them seemed really uncomfortable, but I was greeted and hugged by a few too. As I turned around, my ex was entering the room dressed in a sexy dress and confidently swaggering in almost a slutty way acting as if she didnt see me, kinda laughing. When she realized I started to step up to talk to her, she dove behind a chair. I pull the chair aside, she looked terrified. I said "Remember me?" She stood up, pulled her composure together and said simply "Nope", went around the table to be seated with her group.

I exited the restaurant & as I peered through the series of windows, she would shift back & forth to hide & avoid me seeing her through the glass.

Thats all that I can recall..

So how do you interpret this dream, taking as a given that all the people are parts of you?

And, dude, it's tao with an ao. See? I said that you would forget...

No biggie. Just get back to work... dream hint: What part of you feels uncomfortable being loved? Recognized? Beautiful? (not meaning effeminate)

[vanheart]

Sorry again, Tao for the misspell...

I will have to think about that.
Thanks.

[vanheart]

Last night, I analyzed my dream that caused me so much pain. I deconstructed every detail and recognized what each "part" was communicating. I not going to list them all here.

Some were obvious and I felt better that these "parts' where coming to the surface. I started to get a bit frustrated as to try to connect all of them. Then this morning, BAM.

What I discovered that in my frustration in trying to communicate with these parts and how to invite them, I realized that they were saying "Hey, I hear you want to have that meeting after all, Were ready." And they did this through that dream. I got what I was asking for.

I believe that this dream was trying to help me look at, understand, and deal with rejection, fear of that, insecurities. How to listen to that "radio" and not to bother trying to use the "flashlight" anymore. Not to fight it, but accept and become more aware.

I thought of another analogy that helps me to recognize and utilize these "parts". That is one of a guitar tuner. Boy, has my guitar been way out, probably for quite some time.

I even wrote a dream for fun that mirrored mine and spun it around 180, to make it a positive one in which I felt no pain or anxiety in. I was almost neutral or indifferent in that dream in terms of outcome, in fact in the dream I was having quite a lot of fun. (thanks chuff, I haven't forgotten your earlier posts re: spinning negatives around)

What Im starting realize is this dream/life is MINE, not HERS. Never to be sacrificed again.

Thanks, Tao for helping me better understand that process.

[taoplr]

Last night, I analyzed my dream that caused me so much pain. I deconstructed every detail and recognized what each "part" was communicating. I not going to list them all here.

Some were obvious and I felt better that these "parts' where coming to the surface. I started to get a bit frustrated as to try to connect all of them. Then this morning, BAM.

What I discovered that in my frustration in trying to communicate with these parts and how to invite them, I realized that they were saying "Hey, I hear you want to have that meeting afterall, Were ready." And they did this through that dream. I got what I was asking for.

I believe that this dream was trying to help me look at, understand, and deal with rejection, fear of that, insecurities. How to listen to that "radio" and not to bother trying to use the "flashlight" anymore. Not to fight it, but accept and become more aware.

I thought of another analogy that helps me to recognize and utilize these "parts". That is one of a guitar tuner. Boy, has my guitar been way out, probably for quite some time.

I even wrote a dream for fun that mirrored mine and spun it around 180, to make it a positive one in which I felt no pain or anxiety in. I was almost neutral or indifferent in that dream in terms of outcome, in fact in the dream I was having quite a lot of fun. (thanks chuff, I havent forgotten your earlier posts re: spinning negatives around)

What Im starting realize is this dream/life is MINE, not HERS. Never to be sacrificed again.

Thanks, Tao for helping me better understand that process.

Yeah, Boye! You're right on the money!

Everything you describe is on the path to freedom. Your guitar analogy is perfect. We all get out of tune, and many of us don't even suspect that self-tuning is possible. By tuning yourself you enable yourself to get unstuck from this pattern of sacrifice (important topic to be explored) and to spot it the next time it starts to run its algorithm, interrupt it, and reframe it at the next level.

You wrote: "...How to listen to that "radio" and not to bother trying to use the "flashlight" anymore..."

In this exercise, you are the radio! Neutral, silent, unattached to any position or result, receptive, able to faithfully carry the message from within without distortion. Then, you are you, the conscious mind who responds to the messages of your inner mind and offers the opportunity to update each part's function while resolving your issues. It's a mutual win.

Critically Important
Everyone who gets this far feels frustration. You are suffering and you want the part of you that makes you suffer to stop. But if you express your frustration, or impatience, or any form of disdain, you will be feeding conflict instead of rapport. In such a state, you get nowhere. You must manage yourself so that your voice is calm, your tempo (rate of movement in the dialog) matches that of the part with which you are communicating—don't rush—and your respect for whatever your parts tell you is palpable.

I have worked with hundreds of people who go inward and ask what their "problematic" part is doing for them or getting for them. They ask, then wait, then a reply comes, and then they shake their heads and say "It couldn't be THAT." Invariably, it is that, and that doesn't fit themselves image, so they reject it. Or, they ask and sit and wait for an answer. Muscles twitch, pictures flash before their mind's eye, emotions arise, and, not hearing a voice in their mind, they open their eyes and say "Nothing happened." A lot happened, but it wasn't what they expected, and being stuck there, the can't decipher the message.

You haven't made those mistakes. Looks like dreaming is a good medium for you. Stay open to other possibilities. As you get better at this, more tuned, more aware and sensitive, you might get a wide variety of inputs from your deep unconscious.

You are in the neighborhood of resolution. Your fear of rejection and sense of insecurity are the motivators (remember intention--method--outcome) and dealing with these feelings is central to your method (Is it self-sacrifice?" Only your inner self can know.). What appears to be very clear is that you are on the threshold of finding new ways to function.

Most important, this has nothing to do with her. It is about you, how you organized your mind to cope with life, what patterns you employ and how well they work, and about you can bring up to date a variety of functions within yourself. In your dream, it was fun. Let it be fun all the time, even when you address your deepest fears. For the parts of you who have been longing to communicate with you for years, it will be.

Tao

[vanheart]

Thanks so much tao, all so well communicated. Appreciate that. Its continuing to help, even at this moment...

[vanheart]

Tao, wanted to say that Ive been getting so many signs and experiencing so much synchronicity today in everything. Ive had some signals in the past few days & recognized them, seems like the floodgates are open. More and more parts are asking to have a chat. Its great.

Im starting to realize not to suppress anything, even Im telling myself to spot putting energy towards her. Even if I know that thought may seem negative, it brings clarity & may bring another part to chime in.

Ive told the parts that Im happy to have them in my room.

Had been jotting notes to myself during all of this, they have been increasingly more focused. One I wrote a couple days ago stated: "This is the only favor she ever did for you" Its true, and realizing that I am grateful. Didn't even need to say thanks.

My last one, among others was "Dream away, Dreamer"

One thing I told the parts is we would be having an ongoing relationship, especially after this breakup.

[taoplr]

Tao, wanted to say that Ive been getting so many signs and experiencing so much synchronicity today in everything. Ive had some signals in the past few days & recognized them, seems like the floodgates are open. More and more parts are asking to have a chat. Its great.

Im starting to realize not to suppress anything, even Im telling myself to spot putting energy towards her. Even if I know that thought may seem negative, it brings clarity & may bring another part to chime in.

Ive told the parts that Im happy to have them in my room.

Had been jotting notes to myself during all of this, they have been increasingly more focused. One I wrote a couple days ago stated: "This is the only favor she ever did for you" Its true, and realizing that I am grateful. Didnt even need to say thanks.

My last one, among others was "Dream away, Dreamer"

One thing I told the parts is we would be having an ongoing relationship, especially after this breakup.

Yes, the floodgates are open, and they can stay open if you continue to cultivate the state of mind that enabled you to get here. You are communicating with yourself, not blocking or suppressing information and emotions coming up from your unconscious mind. All these parts are you, organized into images that enable dialog. You won't be having an ongoing relationship with these parts; you are the relationship. It might take a while, but that will eventually make sense. For now, enjoy the discovery and learning that you have entered into. You can learn who you are at levels that will bring you tremendous delight and endless surprise.

This opening might have happened by itself one day in your life, maybe, but it happened now because your heart was split open by her. You are already grateful, so be grateful to her as you let her—and the story about her —go. Let the right moment come to you and finally let go.

Two injunctions:

You will relapse. That's because you have to. With a personal change as big as this, your learning mechanism has to test the new states you create, and the skills that you have just generated. Your mind will find the failure points to see where things break, then break them, then recycle back into what you have learned and put together a new new state. You have lots of choices about how you manage this, but recognize that nothing in the human heart/mind is static.

That's why people practice. So practice a lot. Let everybody inside of you be heard. Soften any hardness that comes up. As you have realized, resist nothing.

Second, any dramatic internal change like this takes you into unfamiliar territory, perspective-wise, awareness-wise, behaviorally, relationally, etc. and the more you can see yourself being comfortable in the new state, the more smoothly it re-manifests when it intends to. If you visualize yourself at some point in the future, being the way you want to be, feeling and acting accordingly, you will feed that outcome. If you jump into that mental image as yourself, seeing through those eyes, hearing through those ears, feeling, breathing, just functioning in that imagined body, you feed that outcome.

Next:
You should continue discovery, reframing and recovery, and "getting to know you" time as long as you want. As soon as the waves of information exchange peak and level off, and as you find yourself making meaningful decisions about how you will be in the future, objections will arise. If they don't, ask:"Is there any part of me that objects to these changes I am making?"There are parts of you that will feel that the changes represent a loss to them. Talk with them.

These objections are not obstacles; they are—or bring about—enhancements, refinements, and greater stability in the totality of your changes. Treat objecting parts with consideration and respect. Ask them (not why) what their objection is, specifically, and know that reframing any objection can occur if you modify your state to include that part's needs. With the same demeanor as when you are communicating with your other parts, negotiate with them to blend their concerns with your real-world needs. Don't ignore any objection.

Tao

[vanheart]

Thanks, Tao.
That gives me a lot to think about.

That question: "Is there any part of me that objects to these changes I am making?" helps me try & understand why I feeling the way I do & getting closer in touch with that.

After another restless sleep, an hour here, an hour there, I had quite a few dreams all involving her. They are all helping me to better understand. I find myself feeling empty today & missing her. I am asking myself why? Do I miss her or the conditioning? What void was she really filling? And so on. I hope in the next days & weeks, I can start to let her go...

[taoplr]

Thanks, Tao.
That gives me a lot to think about.

That question: "Is there any part of me that objects to these changes I am making?" helps me try & understand why I feeling the way I do & getting closer in touch with that.

After another restless sleep, an hour here, an hour there, I had quite a few dreams all involving her. They are all helping me to better understand. I find myself feeling empty today & missing her. I am asking myself why? Do I miss her or the conditioning? What void was she really filling? And so on. I hope in the next days & weeks, I can start to let her go...

You have been letting her go all this time. You're just not done yet. All the anguish is part of it.

You are asking the right kinds of questions. I recommend that you stay with "What" instead of "Why." You'll get better information.

But the key is to realize that she represents something within you, something that was there long before you met her, and that you are dealing more with internal symbolism/meaning than with her. The work of freeing yourself is within.

Some reading, if you are so inclined, will strengthen your new foundations:

1. A General Theory of Love will tell you how the emotional mechanism with which you are struggling gets put in place. A nice read. (Note to everybody: Every parent should read this book.)

Amazon.com: A General Theory of Love: Thomas Lewis, Fari Amini, Richard Lannon: Books

2. Anything by Byron Katie will tell you about the stories you—and the rest of us—create to make meaning in our lives, and how we suffer because of the stories we chose. Katie has an amazing way about her that dismantles disabling stories.

Amazon.com: byron katie: Books

I read and liked A Thousand Names for Joy. But her perspective in general is very powerful. Another that looks good is I Need Your Love - Is That True? Amazon.com: I Need Your Love - Is That True?: How to Stop Seeking Love, Approval, and Appreciation and Start Finding Them Instead: Byron Katie, Michael Katz: Books

3. Brodsky's Better Being Blog is written by an old and dear friend of mine. He and I have known each other for a long time, trained in martial arts together, baby sat each other's kids, and have been influenced by the same philosophies. His thinking/writing and mine are eerily similar. (so I know that he's smart) You will find his blog very useful.

Brodsky’s Better Being Blog

Last thought for now, check out the word "cathexis." Hint: Along with other sources, go to Amazon.com: The Road Less Traveled, 25th Anniversary Edition : A New Psychology of Love, Traditional Values and Spiritual Growth: M. Scott Peck: Books and search cathexis in the book.

Have fun with all this. There is no extra cost for enjoying the ride.

Tao

[vanheart]

Thanks so much, Tao.
I will check those out.

Feeling like dog crap today. I in conversation with my parts, asking questions, getting responses and listening. Just can't seem to focus. Keep running through my head how she cheated, how I checked her into her flights, how she blindsided me with a phone call, then lied. Left me with "I want to be single" after 5 years. Pretty confused. I have some clarity, then I trigger something, & I fall apart all over again.